I was wondering if you have had any experience with Generations. I’m trying to find one of the good ones, but I guess the only way to do that is to actually play them before buying. What whistle makers come closest to the overall sound of the Generations? I’ve got a Sindt that sounds nice. Does that come close to the traditionaly Generation sound? Thanks for your help!
I thought others might benefit from this (and it is whistle-related for a welcome change).
As far as the sound of the Sindt goes, it’s hard to say. John Sindt, by all accounts, set out make a whistle that would sound like a Generation (or a Feadog, Oak, Clare). And among Overtons, Copelands, Roses, Abells, Burkes and Silkstones, the Sindt sounds the most like a Generation. Two things, though: I have two Sindt Ds now, and their sounds differ. Of course, I just got the second, and perhaps should clean the one I’ve had once in a while… But still, I don’t think Sindts are always consistent in their sound. Also, if you played a Generation and a Sindt next to each other, you’d be able to hear a clear difference.
About finding good Generations: I’ve done a bit of that, because I pretty much play only Generations and Overtons (and Sindts on occasion). In my experience it depends on the key. At the moment, Generations Ds seem to be pretty good, C’s passable, and Bb’s unfortunately very spotty. (Used to be that Bb’s were the most reliable.) I suspect that the makers of Generations use a new injection mold every few years and that the quality of the mouthpieces deteriorates over the life cycle of the mold.
Trying them out in the shop is best, but it’s hard to find places that will let you. It’s not that bad though: most Generations can be made into good players by tweaking. It’s rare that I am left with a dog of a whistle even after tweaking.
This is what I do to tweak a Generation D, after removing any burrs or debris from the mouth piece:
Loosen the head and move it up the shaft about an 1/8 of an inch.
Flatten the windway by gluing a piece of .5 mm guitar pick into the windway, just inside the mouth-end.
Fill the cavity under the windway with blue tack (but not completely).
If necessary, dull the fipple blade slightly with very fine sandpaper.
I just did No’s 1 & 3 above yesterday to a Generation D that was not on my happy list. I’ve been playing it frequently since the operation and am more than pleased. I’ll have to consider No’s 2 & 4 but right now Im pleased enough to leave the poor thing alone and use it as one of my “working whistles”.
Keep tossing out the pearls of wisdom, experience, and humor. Some of us swine whose only regular contact with other whistlers is through this facility, really do appreciate it.
Thanks for the alternative method of flattening the windway. I’ve read of people heating, then flattening, but I hate doing anything so permanent (since I rarely get it right the first time).
Do you run the guitar pick down the length of the windway?
I’m so glad to hear someone else say that. I sold my first one to MurphyStout, and IMHO it was “sandy,” quite a bit like a Gen D. Then I got a new one and it sounded a lot purer in tone, a la Burke. It made me realize why we get so many heated debates here about whether or not they sound “chiffy.” Each C&Fer who posts an opinion about how they sound is probably right about their own whistle.
Tery,
I got the idea to flatten the windway first form StevieJ (aka Brother Steve). He uses the heat & pinch method and has been happy with the resuts. I tried tweaking several Generation D’s (and a couple of C’s) this way, with varying success. One of them came out playing beautifully and looking ugly. It’s still my best Generation.
Nickt originally suggested the guitar pic tweak, and I follow his suggestion down to the pics I use: Jim Dunlap Tortex red (.5 mm). I have also tried the Tortex orange (.6 mm), and I find that works for a C whistle but is a little thick for a D Generation. Jerry Freedman uses double-sticky tape and something he calls laminate, but that is over my head I fear.
About running the pick down the length of the window. I feel I am still figuiring out the optimal length of the piece of pic. Anything above half an inch tends to be too long in my experience, and produces a sound that gets too husky and raspy in the upper octave. Also, it tends to clog easily. Any thing shorter than a eigth of an inch is not enough of what I want. So, I am using a piece of pic the width of the windway and about a quarter of an inch long. I am also experimenting with cutting a dove-tail V into the piece of pic. To glue it into the windway I use superglue and I glue it on the bottom of the windway.
As for reversibility: It’s true, the pic piece can be popped out easily with a hobby knife.
What is the effect of each tweak. In particlar, what does the guitar pick do for the sound? What does dulling the blade do? The tacky tweak has improved my Gen D to very good but it still does not change octaves smoothly. I am another that has no contact with any whisle makers, tweakers, or players except through this board. I really appreciate the information freely given here.
Ron Kiley
Others may understand more of the theory, I am tweaking by the seat of my pants, if you will, but here goes:
Dulling the blade will strengthen the lower end (especially low E and D on a D whistle). It will also increase breathiness, depending on how you affect the bevel on the blade. If the blade is a bit rough to start out with, it will at first purify and focus the tone, until you start actually moving the blade edge back).
Reducing the height of the windway, for example by gluing a piece of guitar pic in there, will focus the sound and will create “back pressure” meaning that you have to push your breath through the mouth piece with a bit of effort. That gives you (in my imagination at least) more control over the tone and makes playing the whistle more satisfying. Once you go past the optimal windway reduction, the tone gets raspy, thick, grainy, and the whistle clogs more easily.
I don’t know why pulling out the head of the cheapos gives such a marked improvement, but it does.
As for filling the windway cavity, there is a learned explanation that Thomas Hastay has offered, but that eludes me at this time (and all other times, for that matter).
“John(Sindt) really didn’t want to create anything other
than a consistent ‘Generation’ type/style whistle.”
This above is exactly what Ann herself once told me.
I unfortunately tweaked my Sindt A(fortunately the result was incredibly close to what I want but I never do that again. I promise.) ,so I won’t have a chance with my newly coming Sindt A to know how far those Sindt whistles are consistent.
) ,so I won’t have a chance with my newly coming Sindt A to know how far those Sindt whistles are consistent.