Intonation and tone

[Cubitt]

In answer to the question of what it means to play in tune:

When you play with others, any given note you play should be in the same pitch as the other instruments. When you play alone, the relative pitch from one note to the next should be such that it isn't obvious that the intonation of the instrument is out. This is something to be very attentive about when buying a flute. You don't want a flute that has severe intonation problems or it will drive you crazy.

Think of a simple system flute as being like a violin. You must have a good ear so that you play each individual note the way a violinist must find the proper pitch wthout benefit of frets. The adjustments will be made in the embouchure, cross-fingerings and venting. If you have a reasonably good instrument and you know it well, you may be able to get it to play in ways another person trying your instrument cannot. This is fine - and part of playing a simple system flute.

[piedwhistler]

Thanks Cubitt. I have an M & E flute in rosewood and I'm working on getting to know it better.

[benhall.1]

I like things to be in tune.

Here's the question for you: What do you mean by "in tune"?

See ... I never said it was important to be "in tune", because I knew it was an obvious can of worms. (And I know that Mr Guru Sir was not accusing me of that, but others seem to have assumed that that was what I meant.) However, I still really believe that it's important for the player to be in control of their intonation. As with fiddle playing, I think some notes need to be 'sweetened', but that means that a C, for instance, will not - should not? - always be the same pitch, depending on context.

But I don't really want to go there. My point was just - 'Don't blame the flute'. The Boehm system may have been invented to make things easier, but I don't think that's an excuse not to be the one in charge, whatever type of flute one chooses to play (as opposed to the flute being in charge - mind you, try telling that to Rolly )

[Have just read read Cubitt's post before posting this - interesting cross-over points with my own post here.]

[kkrell]

Eden,
How much Irish flute playing have you been listening to, or trying to play along to? Should give you a sense of what works musically and what does not. May I suggest:

[piedwhistler]

Thanks kkrell. I have Albums 1 and 3 of the wooden flute obsession cds. I also have three of Molloy's albums, Paddy Carty, Conal O Grada, and Colm O'Donnell. Still collecting lol.

[Denny]

whatever ya do

don't listen to any of that Cherish The Ladies stuff

[piedwhistler]

[Clinton]

Classical flute players jigger with their intonation too. At least my teacher who plays in a symphony does. Actually, now that I think of it, pretty much all classical players of instruments, other than fixed pitch instruments like pianos and harps tend to alter their intonation. Granted, not as much as we do with just intonation, but...

Looking back, I realize growing up playing a bassoon in the local symphony that I was constantly adjusting intonation, but just didn't know it, since one does not tune a bassoon, but instead plays it into tune. Sometimes I think it is better to be ignorant!

There is a great little article by Catherine Folkers called "Trave 101" that explains this stuff quite nicely. But the long and the short of it is that "in tune" depends very much on context, including the key you are playing in, and the instruments you are playing with. If we get too absolute in this, we fall into the trap of the Mother watching her son marching with the local cadets and stating that little Johnny is the only one marching in step...

Clinton

[m31]

The Boehm can sterile by comparison.

The Boehm DO sound sterile by comparison.

You mean we sound septic?

[jemtheflute]

The Boehm can sterile by comparison.

The Boehm DO sound sterile by comparison.

You mean we sound septic?

Since when did "dirtiness" necessarily lead on to corruption?

Is it corrupt to try to get a dirty sound on a Böhm?

[I.D.10-t]

Would a similar parallel be keeping things "in time"?

[jim stone]

The Boehm can sterile by comparison.

The Boehm DO sound sterile by comparison.

You mean we sound septic?

Fecund!

[jemtheflute]

The Boehm can sterile by comparison.

You mean we sound septic?

Fecund!

Jim's imagination (or vocabulary) is too fertile!

(Can Americans pronounce "fertile", or is it one of those like the RC church service manuals they used to want to chuck at the Russians?)

[MTGuru]

Can Americans pronounce "fertile"

Sure. Rhymes with turtle and hurdle. TOY-dul, HOY-dul, FOY-dul.

[m31]

Can Americans pronounce "fertile"

Sure. Rhymes with turtle and hurdle. TOY-dul, HOY-dul, FOY-dul.

So Boehm players sound STOY-rul?

and we sound feck'd?