Almond Oil to Linseed Oil ..

weedie · Post by **weedie** » Thu May 01, 2008 7:13 pm

G'day all,
I've had my Terry McGee unkeyed,timber (Gidgee) flute for about 8 or so years now and in that time I've used Almond Oil for regular lubes..
I'm thinking of switching over to a food grade Linseed Oil,as I've read that this has better qualities for the maintainance of our Flutes...
Does anyone foresee any problems with the changeover ???
Adios amigos.....weedie........

groxburgh · Post by **groxburgh** » Thu May 01, 2008 7:18 pm

I think if you insist on using something other than what Terry recommends, and since you're in Oz you should actually use snake oil.

Cheers
Graeme

weedie · Post by **weedie** » Thu May 01, 2008 7:41 pm

Snake Oil !!!....wheredayageddit ??

..
I can get Goanna Oil....Its good for sore backs,aches and pains etc....wonder if that'd be any good

..
By the way.....No Goannas were harmed in the making of this product

weedie · Post by **weedie** » Fri May 02, 2008 1:03 am

Bumpity bump.....

Tim2723 · Post by **Tim2723** » Fri May 02, 2008 6:39 am

I would think the only thing to check would be the miscibility of the two oils in question. Get a small glass container (a cigar tube works perfectly) and mix a small quantity of both oils together. Examine the mix carefully under good light for a few minutes to see if they seperate. I don't believe they will, but it's best to test first. What you don't want is for one oil to simply bead up on top of the other when you apply it to the wood. Then check that they do not form any gummy residue as a result of blending.

And of course, be mindful of allergies.

weedie · Post by **weedie** » Fri May 02, 2008 7:45 pm

Thanks a lot Tim....that sounds an easy and practical way to check if things will be OK....

As soon as the Roofers/Plumbers leave today (nice blokes ,though noisy !),I'll give that a try.........see yer.........

groxburgh · Post by **groxburgh** » Fri May 02, 2008 8:00 pm

What I can't understand is why you ask a bunch of people online here, most of whom you probably don't know, and have no idea of their knowledge about such things etc.; about which of two different oils you should use on your flute, and neither of them are what the maker recommends?

My own personal opinion which is worth nothing:
Almond oil works well if used correctly.
Linseed oil works well (probably better than almond oil) if used correctly, but it's much harder than almond oil to use correctly (especially on a keyed instrument).
Terry made the flute and recommends woodwind bore oil. I'll bet this works well if used correctly and I can see no reason for using anything else.

Cheers
Graeme

weedie · Post by **weedie** » Sat May 03, 2008 2:41 am

Well Graeme,I've always gone with the mindset of "If your not sure,ask someone".There's a lot of very clever people on these pages and having read their responses to other questions over the past year or so,I respect their opinions..Jon C,Jem,Cork,Casey Burns,Loren,Terry to name but a few.,
So if I get 20 answers to my question and 15 of them say that the two oils are'nt compatible,them I'd probably say to myself that its not a good idea to get away from the Almond oil.....
Now to your opinions.....
"Linseed oil works well (probably better than almond oil)" Thats what I thought....This is the reason I asked the question in the first place...
"but it's much harder than almond oil to use correctly (especially on a keyed instrument)" ......my Flute is unkeyed...
"Terry made the flute and recommends woodwind bore oil" I know that...FOR THE BORE...I doubt that Terry would use it on the outside of the Flute....He favours Linseed oil for that application....
Lastly....I would have asked Terry these questions,but lately,Terry has been very good to me (giving of his knowledge and time) so I thought I'd give him a rest and not wear out my welcome....
So I hope this will clear up your 'not being able to understand my post' ..
I'm sorry if all of this comes across as being a bit 'Narky' but I felt a bit of 'Narkiness' coming through your letter and felt the need to respond accordingly...
Also.....cheers.......weedie............

groxburgh · Post by **groxburgh** » Sat May 03, 2008 6:33 am

weedie wrote: "Terry made the flute and recommends woodwind bore oil" I know that...FOR THE BORE...I doubt that Terry would use it on the outside of the Flute....He favours Linseed oil for that application....
Lastly....I would have asked Terry these questions,but lately,Terry has been very good to me (giving of his knowledge and time) so I thought I'd give him a rest and not wear out my welcome....

You don't need to bother Terry, I've been bothering him quite enough lately. His website already has his recommendation. Commercial bore oil, inside (and outside). If you want another opinion, Casey Burns' website recommends, commercial bore oil.....

Do you really need any more opinions?
Cheers
Graeme

galfrex · Post by **galfrex** » Sat May 03, 2008 12:48 pm

I get the impression that many (most?) wooden flute makers use raw linseed oil during the production of their instruments. Despite their own preference, they usually recommend that players use almond oil after that for two principal reasons:
1 - we are less likely to mess up the flute using almond oil than linseed. Amateurs may accidentally buy boiled instead of raw linseed; the excess linseed must be removed, while extra almond oil will eventually dissipate.
2 - JJ Quantz recommended almond oil in his Versuch, and the idea has stuck since then. I have, though, met one flute maker who points out that Quantz really was no expert on the properties of various oils. Quantz, he argues, recommended almond oil because it was among the more precious oils of the day, and therefore most befitting the flutes of his noble patrons. If linseed oil had cost more than almond at the time, Quantz surely would have preferred it then. In fact almond oil can promote the growth of a certain black fungus in some flutes - a phenomenon I have witnessed myself.

Some makers recommend the use of commercial bore oils, but at least as many others don't. There is a lot of information of the topic available on the internet, and I would recommend that people read the advice of more than 1 or 2 people. Personally, I would prefer to avoid the petroleum distillates that are found in most commercial bore oils. But that's just me.

I don't think there's one simple solution to the problem that will suit all flutes and all players at all times. Life's just not that neat.

Cork · Post by **Cork** » Sat May 03, 2008 3:57 pm

Other than an apparently genuine risk of fire*, the only apparent downside to raw, cold-pressed linseed oil might have to do with its smell.

Otherwise, wood simply likes it. Put it on, wipe off any excess, and repeat as necessary. Keypads, however, are an exception: Do not oil pads!

* = See product warning on the manufacturer's label.

Ronbo · Post by **Ronbo** » Sat May 03, 2008 4:47 pm

Is flax oil the same as raw linseed oil, except for the fact that it can be consumed?

groxburgh · Post by **groxburgh** » Sat May 03, 2008 4:49 pm

Cork wrote:Other than an apparently genuine risk of fire*, the only apparent downside to raw, cold-pressed linseed oil might have to do with its smell.

Otherwise, wood simply likes it. Put it on, wipe off any excess, and repeat as necessary. Keypads, however, are an exception: Do not oil pads!

* = See product warning on the manufacturer's label.

I'm not disagreeing with you Cork, but your instructions for using raw linseed oil above "Put it on, wipe off any excess, and repeat as necessary" is the equivalent of Monty Python's instructions on how to play the flute " blow in this hole here and wiggle your fingers up and down on the other holes"

Cheers
Graeme

crookedtune · Post by **crookedtune** » Sat May 03, 2008 5:00 pm

groxburgh wrote:
Cork wrote:Other than an apparently genuine risk of fire*, the only apparent downside to raw, cold-pressed linseed oil might have to do with its smell.

Otherwise, wood simply likes it. Put it on, wipe off any excess, and repeat as necessary. Keypads, however, are an exception: Do not oil pads!

* = See product warning on the manufacturer's label.
I'm not disagreeing with you Cork, but your instructions for using raw linseed oil above "Put it on, wipe off any excess, and repeat as necessary" is the equivalent of Monty Python's instructions on how to play the flute " blow in this hole here and wiggle your fingers up and down on the other holes"

Cheers
Graeme

Well, I guess Graeme has a point. Oiling a keyless flute is really a rather tricky procedure, best left to professionals.

Cork · Post by **Cork** » Sat May 03, 2008 5:22 pm

Ronbo wrote:Is flax oil the same as raw linseed oil, except for the fact that it can be consumed?

Apparently flax oil and raw linseed oil are one and the same thing.

However, perhaps a distinction could be made, as some linseed oil products could have certain additives, most notably at hardware store grade linseed oil.