Keeping thread down on tenons

[Hoovorff]

I did a quick search but didn't find a suggestion. (Maybe I searched the wrong terms.)

Anyway, what do you guys use to hold wayward thread down on thread-wrapped tenons? I have a flute in which the thread keeps unwrapping. I use either cork grease or Burt's Bee's to wax my tenons, but that's not keeping the thread down.

Any suggestions?

Thanks much, Jeanie

[jemtheflute]

I find ordinary cork grease usually does the trick, but it may depend rather on what thread you have - a stiffer, tighter spun thread will be more prone to lifting. I have taken recently to leaving the thread end loose when I re-bind thread lapped joints and just greasing it down - but I use a fairly soft, loose-spun cotton thread (embroidery "silk" - split down, just three of the six strands). I always used to do a "whipped" finish which provides a secure, knotless final closure to the whipping - there are various explanations of how to do this online, probably here on C&F and also on several maker's web-pages on maintenance that I have read - or you'd find out about it it in reference work on knots and seamanship, I expect, with helpful diagrams.

Anyway, here goes:
When you are sure you have the right amount of lapping whipped onto your tenon and have checked the fit, allowed it to settle for a few days etc., unwind about the last 6-10 turns. Get a loop of spare thread and lay it across the lapping with the U of the loop pointing towards where the last turn of thread will be (i.e. in the direction your wind is progressing towards in terms of the long axis of the flute) and projecting beyond that point. Wind your last few turns of lapping back on except for about 2"/5cm, over the loop of spare thread and as tightly as you can. Feed the end of your working thread through the loop, hold onto it with one hand and with the other pull the two ends of your extra loop, thus pulling the working thread end under its last few turns. Pull it right through and then tighten up the working end in the direction you were winding and cut it off flush with where it comes out.

There are a couple of other ways of achieving the same result, but this is probably the simplest. It is hard to make any adjustments/reopen the work after doing this, though. You would probably have to cut the last bit of lapping, remove a fair bit of the job and lay in a new piece of thread long enough to work a secure wrap-on and finish.

A less secure alternative, but a step up from an "open" end, is to put in a couple of half-hitches laid in the direction of the winding in the last few turns of thread. They can usually be persuaded to come undone with a finger-nail if need be, though they can also come undone by themsleves. At least they don't make a knotty lump.

Good luck.

[mahanpots]

Something just occurred to me, Jeanie. Are you taking apart the flute and putting it back together with a twist in the direction of that the thread is being wrapped?

Also, Casey Burns recommends using the stuff that they make to seal a toilet bowl with (preferably new). It's a pre-made doughnut-shaped thing that you cam buy at any good DIY place and made of some kind of harmless greasy stuff, apparently.

Good luck,

Michael

[Irish Marine]

Hi-
Michael's recommendation is a good one. I've been using the toilet bowl 'stuff' and it works really well. The thread definitely stays down and it helps create a great seal. Get one ring and it should last a lifetime!

[G1]

Anyone have any thoughts on replacing thread (polymer flute) with either cork or o-rings?

[Sillydill]

With this thick and tacky (Yes, in both senses of the word! ) wax, I prefer threaded tennons to cork.

One application of this ring-wax lasts a long, long....time. Not so, with any cork grease I've ever used.

All the Best!

[G1]

^lol - Thanks!

"Tightly seals in gas, odor and water." I believe I know a few folks who could make good use of this.

[Hoovorff]

Thanks for the suggestions! I'll try the toilet bowl wax.

Jeanie

[chas]

Anyone have any thoughts on replacing thread (polymer flute) with either cork or o-rings?

You need to make sure the groove for the thread is deep enough to take cork. I have a Cameron flute, designed for thread, that someone decided to cork, and the cork is so thin most of it had fallen out. I have thread on it now. If you want to put O-rings on it, you'll need to machine grooves for two on each tenon, as they'll move around and you need them at the two extrema of the tenon to get a stable joint. I guess it would be possible to use like 20 O-rings on each joint to keep them from moving around. In any case you'll need to check the fit of the joint and make sure you get O-rings of the right size.

[G1]

Aye... and thanks for the input! I think I'll go with the toilet wax... it appeals to my sense of irony, and may very well compliment my crappy style of playing!

[brianormond]

Hoovorf-

-I use blue cross-country ski wax. My flute's maker recommended red but blue is less goopy and easier to work with. Once your threads are waxed you can use this quick-fix method to snug a loose tenon:

-Scratch your thumbnail across waxed tenon threads six or eight times, distributing the longitudinal scratches radially- then reassemble. It'll be snug enough to last the evening and your flute will be more responsive -particularly the low D.

-Brian

[Holmes]

You could pick up the end of the thread with a needle (smallest one possible for the thickness of thread) and stitch it back into the body of the thread, then just trim back any surplus - tricky 'til you get used to it but it avoids the need for anything else and lasts.

I'm a cork man myself (controversial)

[Guinness]

Anyone have any thoughts on replacing thread (polymer flute) with either cork or o-rings?

I would thinking corking a polymer flute would make it less "carefree", assuming the original thread was somewhat hydrophobic.

[G1]

^You're probably right. I'm just more familiar with maintaining cork - but I intend to keep the thread intact, unless it bugs me at some point. Looking at options.

Thanks!

I had a friend who was hydrophobic - he got nervous anytime water got too close to his whiskey.