Right Hand Pinky

Dan Mozell · Post by **Dan Mozell** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 5:26 am

I've read that Grey Larsen recommends keeping the right hand pinky on the whistle at all times. Is this the most common practice, or are there lots of different approaches amoung excellent players?

At this early stage in my whistle playing, it seems that the right hand pinky is useful for stabalizing the instrument when playing phrases which include a C# (on a D whistle). But it also seems to reduce the mobility of the right hand ring finger, introducing unecessary tension. So right now, my right hand pinky is on or off depending upon the phrase.

Thanks for your comments.

http://www.danmozell.com

jemtheflute · Post by **jemtheflute** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 6:28 am

Dan, it sounds like you're doing just fine: sensible approach.

IMO using R(bottom) little finger to stabilise, especially on open C# is preferable to the common use of R3, but it doesn't need to be glued to the tube! As primarily a fluter who uses his Eb key fairly much as a classical player would (i.e. finger on/key pressed most of the time except for Ds), my R4 is on & off all the time anyway on flute, and when I play whistle it just carries on playing a phantom Eb key. I came to whistle that way and never had any problems (that I can recall 30+ years on) with balancing it/not dropping it/feeling insecure even on C#s or crossing the break, nor indeed with tension/independent movement with R3 as you mention. When you have 3+ fingers on you don't need it (other than as a location aid for the bottom hand, perhaps), so can do whatever gives you freedom and comfort; as you go into the L(top) hand part of the scale, use it, if not sooner.

The independent or opposed motion of R3 & 4 does/can develop and improve with practice, as one might expect. Modern fluters on Boehm flute are expected to work on it until they have it, as are pianists and various other instrumentalists. We don't need that level of effort on whistle (not actually playing anything, just auxilliary support), but it surely can be done if wanted. Choosing not to do it/adopting another approach is fine, but if you want to do it it's perfectly possible, not especially hard and very common in other contexts. The anatomy does impose some ultimate limits, but unless one has an injury or medical condition, does not prevent a good degree of fluency in such movement with practice.

MTGuru · Post by **MTGuru** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 7:20 am

Hi Dan ... Ditto Jem's thorough description. "On or off depending upon the phrase" sounds exactly right to me. This is another detail where Larsen's book is a bit too pedantic. Watch good whistlers like Crawford, Madden, Bergin et al. on YouTube or elsewhere, and their bottom pinkies are hopping up and down. If you have to think about it too much, you're probably doing something wrong.

walrii · Post by **walrii** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 7:25 am

MTGuru wrote:If you have to think about it too much, you're probably doing something wrong.

As I plug along in my musical journey, I find that statement applying to more and more situations.

Guinness · Post by **Guinness** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 7:37 am

I think for most folks, anchoring the RH pinky shouldn't introduce any tension except in the earlier stages of learning the instrument where finger independence has not been achieved. Furthermore, there's no need to lift any finger far above the tone hole. That said, I tend to de-anchor my pinky when playing notes involving the bottom three tone holes.

Grey's advice is probably aimed towards the flute player but it does have broader applicability. Anchoring the pinky likely promotes precision of RH finger placement. How many times have we heard on this board that some people have a hard time getting the bell note to play?

Guinness · Post by **Guinness** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 7:49 am

walrii wrote:
MTGuru wrote:If you have to think about it too much, you're probably doing something wrong.
As I plug along in my musical journey, I find that statement applying to more and more situations.

Really? I frequently find the opposite. The less I think about a tune, the more bland it sounds.

Thomas-Hastay · Post by **Thomas-Hastay** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 8:23 am

Some find it comfortable to place the pinky "under" the whistle as support. This practice is a Tabor Pipe method. A loose fabric ring or elastic band can also be looped over the whistle body and the pinky can rest in this with a half twist as a "sling" above or below the tube.

Bothrops · Post by **Bothrops** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 8:30 am

I keep my right pinky almost always on the whistle, because I find it more comfortable. Anyways, sometimes I lift it, for example, when doing an E roll.
I simply don't think about the pinky and I keep it when it feels good and comfortable, without any strain.
Up or down is the same, just do it the way it works for you!

burnsbyrne · Post by **burnsbyrne** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 9:22 am

I would love to be able to use my pinky to stabilize the whistle but it is simply too short. If I place my little finger tip on the whistle I am forced into a sort of piper's grip with my right hand. Also, with my pinky down my third finger becomes difficult to lift. They probably both share a tendon sheath. Anyway, telling everybody that they should keep that finger down without adding that for some people it's impossible is maybe not a good idea. BTW, my hands are big enough to pick up a basketball with one hand. It's just the pinky that's short.
Mike

anniemcu · Post by **anniemcu** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 10:01 am

I can't handle trying to concentrate on it to see, but I *think* I lift it sometimes and I know that I keep it there most times. How's that for straddling the fence?

MTGuru · Post by **MTGuru** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 10:03 am

Guinness wrote:Really? I frequently find the opposite. The less I think about a tune, the more bland it sounds.

Sure, absolutely, at the expressive / aesthetic level. But there are definitely things you need to automatize at the technical level, to free your concentration. Like chewing gum and whistling at the same time. Oh, wait ... bad example.

anniemcu wrote:I can't handle trying to concentrate on it to see, but I *think* I lift it sometimes and I know that I keep it there most times. How's that for straddling the fence?

I once tried analyzing my pinkie movement for a rule-based description, and gave up. It's too phrase- and ornament-dependent to be interesting in those terms.

sbfluter · Post by **sbfluter** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 4:35 pm

For my low whistle I made a rubber band safety belt for my left thumb.

BoneQuint · Post by **BoneQuint** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 4:46 pm

Bothrops wrote:I keep my right pinky almost always on the whistle, because I find it more comfortable. Anyways, sometimes I lift it, for example, when doing an E roll.
I simply don't think about the pinky and I keep it when it feels good and comfortable, without any strain.

I don't know how pedantic Grey is in his book, but that's exactly what I've heard him say he does in person.

Bothrops · Post by **Bothrops** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 4:51 pm

BoneQuint wrote:
Bothrops wrote:I keep my right pinky almost always on the whistle, because I find it more comfortable. Anyways, sometimes I lift it, for example, when doing an E roll.
I simply don't think about the pinky and I keep it when it feels good and comfortable, without any strain.
I don't know how pedantic Grey is in his book, but that's exactly what I've heard him say he does in person.

Cool, I don't have his books, that's just what I think about the topic

anniemcu · Post by **anniemcu** » Fri Mar 21, 2008 4:59 pm

burnsbyrne wrote:I would love to be able to use my pinky to stabilize the whistle but it is simply too short. If I place my little finger tip on the whistle I am forced into a sort of piper's grip with my right hand. Also, with my pinky down my third finger becomes difficult to lift. They probably both share a tendon sheath. Anyway, telling everybody that they should keep that finger down without adding that for some people it's impossible is maybe not a good idea. BTW, my hands are big enough to pick up a basketball with one hand. It's just the pinky that's short.
Mike

My Pinky fingers are short too. I do use the second pad of my right hand, rather than the tips, though, so I guess that's why I can reach to get my pinky on the whistle. i think i always have.