Ulster fifes

The Laughing Imp · Post by **The Laughing Imp** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 5:29 am

Fantastic thread. Full of information. My brain feels stuffed with fifey goodness. I loved the YouTube video. Glad I dropped by the forum after such a long time away.

Cayden · Post by **Cayden** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 5:43 am

You really want to read this on the subject, nice book which steers clear of the controversies of sectarian connections without avoiding the issue. Very informative.

I bought one of those Miller Browne yokes in Dublin in 1979. Has been sitting in a vase ever since. Will be happy to sell.

The Laughing Imp · Post by **The Laughing Imp** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:07 am

Peter Laban wrote:You really want to read this on the subject, nice book which steers clear of the controversies of sectarian connections without avoiding the issue. Very informative.

I bought one of those Miller Browne yokes in Dublin in 1979. Has been sitting in a vase ever since. Will be happy to sell.

Thanks for the link. I was searching for that book after I read the discussion (here or on another thread).

Chris The Wakes · Post by **Chris The Wakes** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:43 am

The only flute that can really stur up several negitive & violent emotions when 20 drunken bigots come swaggering down your street pedaling there sectarian hatraid all in the name of religous liberty!

Shame!

Ceili_whistle_man · Post by **Ceili_whistle_man** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 4:52 am

Sure come on now Chris The Wakes, the Hibernians aren't all that bad are they?

Chris The Wakes · Post by **Chris The Wakes** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 6:40 am

Ceili_whistle_man wrote:Sure come on now Chris The Wakes, the Hibernians aren't all that bad are they?

They are all in the same boat - bigots!!
OO & AOH = Dividing the people!

jemtheflute · Post by **jemtheflute** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 7:05 am

Although I reluctantly recognise that it is not entirely possible to separate the instruments and the music played upon them from long cultural associations with specific sectarian interests, I really don't think this nasty and boring "old hat" stuff is relevant to this thread! (Which had thus far done its serious business without getting embroiled in or marred by the gunk of history.) Leave it out, guys, or at least take it off to the Proctology section where it maybe fits better, though IMO it doesn't "belong" anywhere.
(No, I'm not trying to say that it should never be discussed - to fully move on from something you have to recognise it and deal with it; but the discussion in this thread assumed it could be ignored/had been moved on from for the purposes of considering the instruments.)

planxtydt · Post by **planxtydt** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 7:59 am

well said Jem!

Chris The Wakes · Post by **Chris The Wakes** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 8:11 am

Totally agree, Sorry chaps maybe not the best place or time to put my point (or not so much point - just view) across....unfortunately when the topic is raised about such flutes the bad views/intrests of a majority of people who use them outweight any positive discussion about there use!

Just my view!

Ignore me!

boyd · Post by **boyd** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:22 pm

Its up to musicians to steal the instruments and the music back from the bigots, I guess.

Rev Gary Hastings made a good point in saying that the music (and the fife) existed a long time before the politico-religious differences came into being.

Interestingly, as an Ulsterman, and having grown up listening to the music of all sides, I reckon that in a few short generations from now the emotions and the associations of fife/flute bands will be greatly diluted (or gone) and our descendants will all be out celebrating these very same cultural differences and divisions that can get us all wound up 10years after things started to settle down.

Like it or not, the Orange Order and the Ancient Order of Hibernians (and their supporters) really existed and had influence, and will always be a part of history.

And the sooner they ARE part of history, the better, I suppose.

But, loved or loathed, they can never be forgotten.

As a musician, I'd say they are dinky wee instruments, the tunes that are played on them are often great wee things altogether, and I'm tempted to get one and play it for the craic...

...I just won't play it when I'm at home.

Well, not for another couple of decades at least

Chris The Wakes · Post by **Chris The Wakes** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:42 pm

boyd wrote:Its up to musicians to steal the instruments and the music back from the bigots, I guess.

Rev Gary Hastings made a good point in saying that the music (and the fife) existed a long time before the politico-religious differences came into being.

Interestingly, as an Ulsterman, and having grown up listening to the music of all sides, I reckon that in a few short generations from now the emotions and the associations of fife/flute bands will be greatly diluted (or gone) and our descendants will all be out celebrating these very same cultural differences and divisions that can get us all wound up 10years after things started to settle down.

Like it or not, the Orange Order and the Ancient Order of Hibernians (and their supporters) really existed and had influence, and will always be a part of history.

And the sooner they ARE part of history, the better, I suppose.

But, loved or loathed, they can never be forgotten.

As a musician, I'd say they are dinky wee instruments, the tunes that are played on them are often great wee things altogether, and I'm tempted to get one and play it for the craic...

...I just won't play it when I'm at home.

Well, not for another couple of decades at least

Ding ding! We have a winner!

Well said mate!

Interestingly, as an Ulsterman, and having grown up listening to the music of all sides, I reckon that in a few short generations from now the emotions and the associations of fife/flute bands will be greatly diluted (or gone) and our descendants will all be out celebrating these very same cultural differences and divisions that can get us all wound up 10years after things started to settle down

Here's hoping that day comes sooner rather than later mate!

Ceili_whistle_man · Post by **Ceili_whistle_man** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:32 am

Jemtheflute said:

Leave it out, guys, or at least take it off to the Proctology section where it maybe fits better, though IMO it doesn't "belong" anywhere.

Leave what out Jem?

I really don't think this nasty and boring "old hat" stuff is relevant to this thread!

Oh that 'stuff'. It may be nasty, in fact it is nasty, but boring and old hat? What if one of our US friends had made a comment about the fife being a 'Johnny Reb' instrument?

I just find it laughable that both sides of the religious divide in NI play exactly the same tunes as each other on exactly the same instruments and are equally as bigotted as each other.

(As were the Confederate and Union soldiers no doubt)
I love the fife and drum tradition, the pure drop stuff, not the highjacked Nationalist/Loyalist crap with all the posturing and swagger. I love it for the tunes and the way they are played, not for the political conotations in the words for the tunes. That's enough on that anyway.

Jem, thanks for the link to Angus fifes, very helpful indeed. Some of the instruments on there are a bit cumbersome looking with bumps and rings everywhere, but there are some really nice looking flutes/fifes as well. I wonder what they sound like?
I am still having no luck in finding a contact for the elusive fife maker from Larne NI, 'Wilby' Wilson. Anyone heard tell of him or where he is?

Hey planxtydt!! How are the wee seasiders and swifts doing these days? Though...I'm a 'wise man from the East' meself!

taity · Post by **taity** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 6:42 am

Its up to musicians to steal the instruments and the music back from the bigots
well said i was a bigot once then i grew up now i play what i want when i want and where i want .if some asks me to play tune and its seen as an Protestant one i then play a Hibernian one just to see the look on there face .music to me is the tune not what it stands for to the bigots