Mna na h Eireann (Women of Ireland)

[Jack]

I can see what you're saying, then.

Can you see how some people don't fault them because they don't believe it's misleading, since they recognize that a Church can be Catholic (big C) and not Roman Catholic? That's where I stand. I'd guess it's probably where Sinéad O'Connor and Michael Cox stand, too. Don't know that for sure, though...

[Walden]

Reminds me of the movementarian schismatics who are actually Old Order Sideshow Mel Movementarians. I can understand why they just call themselves "Movementarians," but it gets tricky when you have groups like the One True Continuing Movementarian Sede Vanacantist Recension, who teach that they are headed by The Leader reincarnated, and the mainstream Movementarian Leader is actually an imposter, as they wish to claim title to the real property of the group most commonly known as Movementarians.

[Jack]

No everybody won't. I won't. And if you're from any of the other Catholic Churches you probably won't, either. That "Catholic" automatically and always means "Roman Catholic" is not a universal assumption.

I think this is hairsplitting. It's generally true that almost everyone will take it to mean you're Roman Catholic.

Best wishes,
Jerry

It may well be hair-splitting. I probably just think about these things too much. But even if it is hair-splitting to whirl around the definitions, it is not fair for somebody to say "X is not really a Catholic priest, since she's not Roman Catholic." That's what izzarina said, in reference to Sinéad O'Connor, and that's what initially made me have a "wait a minute..." moment.

[Jerry Freeman]

I can see what you're saying, then.

Can you see how some people don't fault them because they don't believe it's misleading, since they recognize that a Church can be Catholic (big C) and not Roman Catholic? That's where I stand. I'd guess it's probably where Sinéad O'Connor and Michael Cox stand, too. Don't know that for sure, though...

Sure. And I would expect that a great many, if not virtually all, of the people who belong to other churches with Catholic in their names sincerely believe that their church is the true Catholic church and the others, including the Roman Catholic church, have gone astray. So of course, they will simply refer to themselves as Catholic.

Best wishes,
Jerry

[Jerry Freeman]

... it is not fair for somebody to say "X is not really a Catholic priest, since she's not Roman Catholic." That's what izzarina said, in reference to Sinéad O'Connor, and that's what initially made me have a "wait a minute..." moment.

If you say, "Sinéad O'Connor" is a Catholic priest, you're implying that she's a Roman Catholic priest. That's how the vast majority of people will hear you. When you say that, it naturally annoys some people because they reasonably can assume you realize most people understand "Catholic priest" to mean Roman Catholic priest and you're trying to ascribe a qualification to someone to whom it doesn't apply. I haven't gone back to read the whole thread, but based on what you're telling me, I would say Redwolf's response was reasonable.

Best wishes,
Jerry

[Jack]

I can see what you're saying, then.

Can you see how some people don't fault them because they don't believe it's misleading, since they recognize that a Church can be Catholic (big C) and not Roman Catholic? That's where I stand. I'd guess it's probably where Sinéad O'Connor and Michael Cox stand, too. Don't know that for sure, though...

Sure. And I would expect that a great many, if not virtually all, of the people who belong to other churches with Catholic in their names sincerely believe that their church is the true Catholic church and the others, including the Roman Catholic church, have gone astray. So of course, they will simply refer to themselves as Catholic.

Best wishes,
Jerry

Well, a great number are like that, but the Liberal Catholic Church, for one, is not. It's more liberal (imagine that! lol) and esoteric in how it understands itself. It was influenced a lot by Madame Blavatsky and her early Theosophical Society. These particular Catholics teach unity of all religions, including all the various kinds of Catholics (including Roman Catholics). I think you're generally right, though, because the Liberal Catholic Church seems to be the exception.

[Bloomfield]

Sadly, I couldn't find the "Nothing for Sale" thread to link to. That, I would say, is the canonized first and last word on nothing. After all that was discussed in the "Nothing for Sale" thread, there's nothing left that can be said. Sigh.

It's hard to find nothing when you're looking for something.

[Jerry Freeman]

duplicate post deleted

How did I do that? Bloomfield's post somehow got between my two duplicate posts ...

OMG! It's a Miracle!

Best wishes,
Jerry

[Jack]

If you say, "Sinéad O'Connor" is a Catholic priest, you're implying that she's a Roman Catholic priest.

I guess this is where we simply disagree.

[Jerry Freeman]

Sadly, I couldn't find the "Nothing for Sale" thread to link to. That, I would say, is the canonized first and last word on nothing. After all that was discussed in the "Nothing for Sale" thread, there's nothing left that can be said. Sigh.

It's hard to find nothing when you're looking for something.

Hallelujah!

The sacred text! Now we can once again read what the deepest thinkers on the subject at hand have inscribed for all posterity.

Best wishes,
Jerry

[Jerry Freeman]

If you say, "Sinéad O'Connor" is a Catholic priest, you're implying that she's a Roman Catholic priest.

I guess this is where we simply disagree.

I don't think it's that simple.

You're sophisticated enough to know when you're saying something that's subtly (or not so subtly) provocative. I'm sure you know that the vast majority will interpret your statement to mean she's a Catholic Priest. On the other hand, you could easily have said, "Sinéad O'Connor" is a [insert name of specific denomination here] Catholic priest. Then your comment would have been more or less neutral. You're smart enough to understand the difference.

Best wishes,
Jerry

[Bloomfield]

If you say, "Sinéad O'Connor" is a Catholic priest, you're implying that she's a Roman Catholic priest.

I guess this is where we simply disagree.

Or where one of you is simply wrong.

[Denny]

If you say, "Sinéad O'Connor" is a Catholic priest, you're implying that she's a Roman Catholic priest.

I guess this is where we simply disagree.

Or where one of you is simply wrong.

someone should start a poll...

[s1m0n]

The Roman Catholic church is the only one that can call itself "Catholic" with a capital "C" and no other qualification.

All of these groups use "Catholic" with an uppercase "C" in their names.

I said "can," Cran, not "do."

Cran has it correctly.

The Roman Catholic Church 'owns' the modifier "Roman", not Catholic. There are many Catholic Churches but only one of those is Roman.

[s1m0n]

If you say, "Sinéad O'Connor" is a Catholic priest, you're implying that she's a Roman Catholic priest. That's how the vast majority of people will hear you. When you say that, it naturally annoys some people because they reasonably can assume you realize most people understand "Catholic priest" to mean Roman Catholic priest and you're trying to ascribe a qualification to someone to whom it doesn't apply.

Jerry, the term "Catholic" is a part of the Nicene Creed:

[...]
We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father [and the Son],
who with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified,
who has spoken through the prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look for the resurrection of the dead,
and the life of the world to come. Amen.

Every christian church is Catholic.