Copley w/out tuning slide QUESTION

[dyersituations]

...how are they?

I am hoping to get a wood flute sometime, since I currently play a M&E polymer. Now that I am strong enough on the M&E, I feel I'd like to move to a wood flute. Is the Copley w/out tuning slide a big enough jump from the M&E?

If not, what are some recommendations? I would prefer to stay under 1K, but after some research I have found that this may be difficult to get the flute I need... (I play gigs).

Thanks.

[BrendanB]

While I definitely understand the temptation not to spend too much on a flute, if you are really interested in getting a good wooden flute, I really suggest spending the extra couple hundred dollars to get a tuning slide. Trust me, you'll want it.

You can still get some great keyless flutes for $1,000 or less. There is a posting right now on the forum for a keyless Byrne and the seller is evidently open to taking $1,000. That's a great price for a wonderful flute that is heads and tails better than a M&E.

Other than that, I believe Eamonn Cotter's keyless flutes are still less than $1,000 (although the weak dollar may have changed that). Hammy's flutes are not much over $1K.

I'm sure other people will weigh in with their favorites, but if you are willing to spend up to $1K, my advice would be to spend the money up front to make sure you get a flute that you won't want to replace in a year.

Brendan

[tin tin]

Copley flutes are very good and will offer plenty of room for growth over the years. One consideration, assuming you're currently playing the Rudall & Rose model by M&E: the Copley has a bigger bore and thus plays rather differently than narrower bore flutes.

The presence of absence of a tuning slide doesn't dictate the flute's quality, but it is a handy tool. I don't think it's make or break, but if you can afford it, it will serve you well over the long term. If you can't afford it, don't let that dictate whether or not you get a wood flute. I've never played Copley's slide-less model, but I've played some lined and unlined Olwells, and there is a bit of a tonal difference; no telling which you prefer.

[Sillydill]

Dear Dyer,

I'll offer a different opinion: I prefer the all-wood construction of the Copley! Mine plays perfectly in tune for me with the slide shut.

I really like the Hawkes flute design and also currently have a Ward.



The Ward also plays perfectly in tune for me with the slide shut, so I think the slide is superfluous!

The Copley is lighter and well ballanced.

[JS]

I have a Copley D/Eb combination with no slide, and I couldn't be more pleased with it. No problems at all getting into tune with the folks I usually play with. Personally, and it is just personal, I like the aesthetics and tone of a slideless flute.

Goes without saying that Dave Copley is grand to deal with.

[greenspiderweb]

While I definitely understand the temptation not to spend too much on a flute, if you are really interested in getting a good wooden flute, I really suggest spending the extra couple hundred dollars to get a tuning slide. Trust me, you'll want it.

You can still get some great keyless flutes for $1,000 or less. There is a posting right now on the forum for a keyless Byrne and the seller is evidently open to taking $1,000. That's a great price for a wonderful flute that is heads and tails better than a M&E.

Other than that, I believe Eamonn Cotter's keyless flutes are still less than $1,000 (although the weak dollar may have changed that). Hammy's flutes are not much over $1K.

I'm sure other people will weigh in with their favorites, but if you are willing to spend up to $1K, my advice would be to spend the money up front to make sure you get a flute that you won't want to replace in a year.

Brendan

Well, that's close to what I said on the price of the Byrne, Brendan-but, actually I said that I am taking offers, starting at $1000 on the Byrne. I doubt it will sell for that, since I already have one offer over that. Yes, it's a lovely flute, as you know-you had one too, I remember.

[BrendanB]

Well, that's close to what I said on the price of the Byrne, Brendan-but, actually I said that I am taking offers, starting at $1000 on the Byrne. I doubt it will sell for that, since I already have one offer over that. Yes, it's a lovely flute, as you know-you had one too, I remember.

Sorry for misreading your post. I'm glad to hear you are getting offers. I think Bryan makes great flutes. I have a keyed flute on order from him.

Brendan

[greenspiderweb]

Well, that's close to what I said on the price of the Byrne, Brendan-but, actually I said that I am taking offers, starting at $1000 on the Byrne. I doubt it will sell for that, since I already have one offer over that. Yes, it's a lovely flute, as you know-you had one too, I remember.

Sorry for misreading your post. I'm glad to hear you are getting offers. I think Bryan makes great flutes. I have a keyed flute on order from him.
Brendan

Oh wow! You are the lucky one then! Let us know your impressions after you play it a bit, OK?

[I.D.10-t]

How much can rolling in or out compensate for lack of a slide?
Does it mess with internal tuning the same way that extending the flute does?

[bruceb]

I've also never felt the need for a slide on my flutes. It's always been easy to play at 440 without one. On the Copley I had without a slide (it looked *very* much like the one Sillydill has, ha, ha.), I needed to pull it out just a bit to play at 440. This didn't seem to cause any problems.

My GLP has the minimum disruption tenon which works fine. Since I didn't have a problem with the Copley (or my slideless Burns) I can't say it's any better for me, but it's an elegant solution to making a flute a bit more tunable without the expense of a metal slide.

For several reasons, I prefer my wooden flutes to be all wood except for external reinforcing rings.

bruce

[Cork]

...how are they?

I am hoping to get a wood flute sometime, since I currently play a M&E polymer. Now that I am strong enough on the M&E, I feel I'd like to move to a wood flute. Is the Copley w/out tuning slide a big enough jump from the M&E?

If not, what are some recommendations? I would prefer to stay under 1K, but after some research I have found that this may be difficult to get the flute I need... (I play gigs).

Thanks.

With all due respect to you, please, it seems that you are asking at least a few questions, and let me add my own two cents worth, here.

For instance, there are flutes with tuning slides, and there are flutes without. Because the by far most of my own day to day playing is done solo, by myself and to my own satisfaction, nearly all of my wood (non-Boehm) flutes have no tuning slide, or little in the way of a tuning slide, as my preference, and that's because a well made flute needs no tuning slide. It's just that simple. A tuning slide, moreover, has more to do with tuning to other instruments, and seeing as you play gigs, presumably with other players, having a tuning slide could be an advantage to you, although let it be said that a good, flexible embouchure can also go a long way toward tuning to other instruments. Also, no tuning slide can perfectly tune a flute to another instrument, as even then at least some measure of embouchure flexibility will be called for, albeit less.

Again, I am not trying to be critical, here, but it seemed as though you had put those two matters into the same question.

Also, there are quite a few really good flutes out there for considerably less than big money, and don't be afraid to consider some of the newer polymer/Delrin models, which play very well, are practically maintenance free, and which travel well, as a plus to the gigging musician.

[Bridges-PdP]

I have the M&E and the Copley slideless. I enjoy playing the Copley more, it has a nicer sound, cleaner and more crisp are how I might describe it.

I started with the M&E and while others said it was heavy, I never noticed the weight, THAT IS until I got the Copley, which is very light.

I asked myself if I needed a tuning slide on the Copley and I answered it by asking another question: Do I ever move the tuning slide on the M&E? Nope.

[cocusflute]

I have a great Copley for sale - just like the one on Silly Dill's post. I am asking $450 for the flute. It is in perfect condition and plays and looks as new.
I play a C flute with an all-wood, no-tuning-slide head and I am delighted with the sound of it. The issue for me re slide or no-slide isn't the tuning. It is the sound. A flute without a slide has a resonance that the metal lining mutes a bit, though with the slide the projection and focus might be slightly different.
This is an old discussion; the choices boil down to personal taste rather than to a measurable difference between the heads.

[chas]

Dyer, you oughta snap cocus's Copley up right this minute. If it's not for you, you can recoup your investment without breaking a sweat. I agree with him that there's something about an all-wood flute that's missing once you put some metal in the bore. My all-rosewood Olwell is going to the grave with me.

[skh]

My all-rosewood Olwell is going to the grave with me.

A pity.