copper flutes

mutepointe · Post by **mutepointe** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:01 pm

dear folks: why are there copper whistles and very few copper flutes? could i make a copper flute at home? does anyone have experience, advice, or specifications? i shattered quite a bit of pvc pipe until i briefly had access to a drill press. i am thinking that copper would be easier to work with.

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:06 pm

I don't see any reason you couldn't do a copper flute.

Copper is in the same family of metals as silver and gold and should produce a playable instrument.

I would think the main challenge would be copper's tendency to tarnish and corrode, which causes it to taste bad.

--James

I.D.10-t · Post by **I.D.10-t** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 6:06 pm

Daniel Bingamon makes copper flutes. He also has some interesting ways of making them.
from http://www.tinwhistles.us/flutes.htm

The headjoint Inner diameter is slightly smaller than the tonebody to bring octave alignment into tune.

“Hammy” Hamilton also makes something similar.
http://homepage.eircom.net/~hammie/practice.htm

One thing I think you will find is that the tubing is thin and needs some kind of lip plate to create a chimney deep enough to play properly.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Another route may be similar to what Michael Copeland.

from http://www.chiffandfipple.com/mcinterview.html

Dale:I've heard that when you started making whistles, you took apart a Clarke.

Michael: I really like the beginnings of the whistle I made. Frankly, I wasn't one of those flute players who wouldn't go to a session and take a whistle with me and take it out and play it. I didn't really like the whistles that were out there. I thought the Generation Bb was tolerable but it isn't a session instrument. I might play that one on my own, but not with others. I remembered I had an old Clarke C in the shop. One day, I guess I was bored with flute making. So I took it and using some of the stuff I had learned from instrument making. I would raise or lower the lip, fill in the cracks around the woodblock with wax and give it a going over... and I really loved the "flutey" sound when it was set up properly. So, thought, I should make one of these. I had a sheet of brass that was thicker than the Clarke. I unsoldered the Clarke C and laid it flat out. I still have it! I'm glad I kept some of these early experiments. On the lathe (a wood lathe) and a file, I filed a taper from a steel rod. I then annealed the piece of brass, wrapped it around a mandrel with a rawhide mallet, and soldered it together. I'd press it through a lead doughnut to smooth it down on the mandrel. I put a wooden plug in it, cut the window and drilled the finger holes where I thought they should be. It was all very crude. But, when I blew into it and notes came out... I was flying. I love those moments.

Perhaps you could make a nice tapered flute like the Clinton flute.

Aanvil · Post by **Aanvil** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 1:06 am

I just finished a low D whistle in copper this evening. Plays pretty well. Weee!

I'm just a mere "student" maker right now but I think the available premade tube ( like type M) is too thin for a flute. Particularly for making an embouchure.

Not enough chimney hight. The copper flutes I have seen all have some added height through wood or some type of plastic.

Copper is heavy to me. Would it have a reasonable thickenss to build a viable flute... I don't think you'd be holding it up for very long.

Anyway... just some thoughts.

A

vomitbunny · Post by **vomitbunny** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 10:12 am

I made one in Bb once. The head was a section of pvc about 4 inches long. Gave some chimney dept and keeps your lips off the copper.

Sillydill · Post by **Sillydill** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 11:09 am

Here's a pic. of a really neat little Eb piccolo I had:

It was made of copper and had a lip-plate, made by Sabine of electronic tuner fame. The whole thing was laquered, so it stayed shiny and didn't taste foul. It was a really good little piccolo, but in Eb it was just to much!

jb · Post by jb » Mon Sep 18, 2006 11:56 am

I've been wondering for a while if anybody has tried making flutes from aluminium. Not from tubing but from a solid bar and a conical bore.

Cathy Wilde · Post by **Cathy Wilde** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 2:54 pm

Interesting question. Mike Burke makes regular and low whistles from aluminum, but they sure seem cylindrical. What are those funky conical Clarke whistles made of? They're very light ....

mutepointe · Post by **mutepointe** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 6:49 pm

you folks sure know a lot. thanks for the quick reply. the pic of a copper flute was outstanding. i liked the idea of the pvc/copper combo that vomit spoke about. that seemed to be the simplest way to go. ugly but simple. "without ugliness there can be no beauty" from some old twilight zone episode starring that guy from the cowboy series, the big valley.

Aanvil · Post by **Aanvil** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 8:02 pm

Oh, I thought I should mention that copper isn't easier than PCV.

Its more messy and... tastes bad. So keep your fingers out of your mouth.

I put a ligh burnish on my work piece with sandpaper and wash it even before I cut just to take off any oxidation and keep down the mess.

You must wear gloves and eye protection (you should anyway) as little sharp pieces of copper go flying everwhere. Even with hand tools and files. Mind the pets, babies and other loved ones with bare feet.

A good set of jewlers files, 400/600/800 wet/dry sand paper... cloth backed if you can get it... will go a long way to making your day.

You can get a deburring tool but you have to dull it otherwise it will eat your hole.

Just note this. You will have similar problems drilling holes.

Both copper and PCV are very soft and the reason you bust apart your workpiece is because of the drill bit taking to big of a bite all at once.

For plastic and very soft metals you might want to consider buying something called a "zero-rake" bit. The Plastic and metal bits you buy from the local hardward outlet are not the same thing.

http://www.acrylicbirdcages.com/plastic ... _tools.htm

If you are handy and have a grinder you can just grind the rake back on regular bits and it will work just fine... its also a heck of a lot cheaper.

(I have and illustration link somewhere... just can't find it now)

I really recomend a small drill press with variable speed and a very secure jig for your workpiece.

If you don't, even no rake bits can grab if you are off angle and piece of super sonic copper tube flying into your head or to parts unknown is not something you want.

Its also hard to get your holes true without a press and that makes tuning a real chore.

Anyway... just some quick thoughts.

Go try it.

mutepointe · Post by **mutepointe** » Mon Sep 18, 2006 9:18 pm

what a wet blanket you are. i believe that i will have more success convincing my wife that it was her idea to buy me a new flute for my birthday. and she taste better and is not at all toxic compared to copper.

Chiffed · Post by **Chiffed** » Tue Sep 19, 2006 10:16 pm

jb wrote:I've been wondering for a while if anybody has tried making flutes from aluminium. Not from tubing but from a solid bar and a conical bore.

Not from bar-stock, and not conical, but there is a type of aluminium pipe the same ID/OD as Sched 40 water pipe. I used it to make a flute to a standard PVC design (Doug Tipple's), and it worked beautifully. I made two improvements over my usual PVC flutes: first, I added a long tapered Sander spike in the head end; secondly, I was forced to be a bit more decisive in the cutting of the embouchure - couldn't just fiddle away with an Xacto knife on aluminium. Good flute, and holds its own in a bar fight.

As for conical bores, I can't imagine that reaming a long taper in aluminum would be much fun. Could be wrong, though.