Flute or Player: You Decide...

The Chiff & Fipple Irish Flute on-line community. Sideblown for your protection.
User avatar
GaryKelly
Posts: 3090
Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 4:09 am
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: Swindon UK

Post by GaryKelly »

Some additional information, which perhaps I should have mentioned... sorry!

The player recently had the opportunity to try a number of flutes (always wise before considering a purchase). Knowing that a flute may sound different under the ear of the player than to listeners, the player recorded the separate tracks, the better to make an informed decision as to each flute. It was an honest appraisal, with no knowledge that later on 'someone' would do a cut-and-paste to make this test track.

No special effects or any other manipulation have been applied to the track(s), other than the 'assemble editing'... ie cut-and-paste.

Oh and 5 minutes is 'less than 10 years', so is 1 year, etc etc. And I'm not going to name the player privately in email or PM... sorry Colin#1! :)
Image "It might be a bit better to tune to one of my fiddle's open strings, like A, rather than asking me for an F#." - Martin Milner
User avatar
johnkerr
Posts: 1001
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2002 6:00 pm
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: Falls Church VA USA

Post by johnkerr »

BrendanB wrote:And people say that it's the player and not the flute. Unbelievable.
It's neither. It's the hoseclamps. And the ones on this track are (roughly) 54.8976% rusted.
User avatar
johnkerr
Posts: 1001
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2002 6:00 pm
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: Falls Church VA USA

Post by johnkerr »

Oh, and I forgot to mention....needs more cowbell.
User avatar
treeshark
Posts: 952
Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2003 6:00 pm
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: London
Contact:

Post by treeshark »

Well it starts sort of soft and delicious like a buttery croissant, then I detect a distinct lemony cheescake flavour and mmm, let me see, I get notes of butterscotch and bacon rind, it all finishes with a flurry of fruity flavours I get lime and apple sauce, raspberry sorbet, and elderflower....YUM!
User avatar
vanessa
Posts: 65
Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2006 7:10 am
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: Ireland

Post by vanessa »

What a fascinating experiment :boggle: ! I'm only a beginner with no musical background and my musical hearing skills are pretty poor so when I listened I only heard 6 different flutes but I'm sure I'm way off here and I lack the confidence to comment because I'm not good with jargon re tone and timbre and what have you, which means I leave that up to the experts but I do have a personal preference when listening, so I can hardly wait for the results but I would have to laugh if it's one and the same flute when I'm hearing six :lol: - not sure what that would say about my mental state :o
User avatar
AaronMalcomb
Posts: 2205
Joined: Sat May 25, 2002 6:00 pm
antispam: No
Location: Bellingham, WA

Post by AaronMalcomb »

It's the player and lovely playing indeed. I hear nothing that makes it obvious that there is more than one flute.

Edit to add that I thought that the tone did sound rather like a chocolate bar, about 70% cocoa, with chunks of European walnuts and taken moderately with sips of frothy, French Roast coffee.
User avatar
BigDavy
Posts: 4885
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2004 5:50 am
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: Larkhall Scotland

Post by BigDavy »

Well I'll bite.

3 flutes.

1st ebony.

2nd blackwood

3rd Rosewood

Makers - not a clue :-?

Tone - flute like.

David
Payday, Piping, Percussion and Poetry- the 4 best Ps
User avatar
BrendanB
Posts: 242
Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2003 3:56 pm
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: Washington DC

Post by BrendanB »

johnkerr wrote:Oh, and I forgot to mention....needs more cowbell.
Hell yeah. Strap it on.

Image
User avatar
dow
Posts: 954
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 12:21 am
antispam: No
Please enter the next number in sequence: 12
Location: Boerne, TX

Post by dow »

I think there are three or possibly four.

No clue on the rest.
Dow Mathis ∴
Boerne, TX
Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently motivated fool.
User avatar
rama
Posts: 1411
Joined: Sun Feb 16, 2003 6:00 pm
antispam: No
Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
Tell us something.: flute itm flute, interested in the flute forum for discussions and the instrument exchange forum to buy and sell flutes
Location: salem, ma.

Post by rama »

hmmm.... listen for the tapping foot, it appears and disappears and reappears. 4 possibly 5 changes detected. also, i believe gary to be a proponent of "it ain't the flute" school, so i figure there is at least 2 flutes being played (which would demonstrate and support this view).
my guess there are at least grinter and a hamilton flute, maybe 1 more.
User avatar
crookedtune
Posts: 4255
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2006 7:02 pm
antispam: No
Please enter the next number in sequence: 8
Location: Raleigh, NC / Cape Cod, MA

Post by crookedtune »

BrendanB wrote:
johnkerr wrote:Oh, and I forgot to mention....needs more cowbell.
Hell yeah. Strap it on.

Image
Well, that was just uncalled for. MODERATOR!!!! :swear: :swear:
Charlie Gravel

“I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.”
― Oscar Wilde
User avatar
Whistlin'Dixie
Posts: 2281
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2002 6:00 pm
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: It's too darn hot!

Post by Whistlin'Dixie »

Oh My god! How heinous! I am going to have visions of that belly button in my dreams tonite. Aaaaaaauuuuurrrrgggghhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!
User avatar
Denny
Posts: 24005
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2003 11:29 am
antispam: No
Location: N of Seattle

Post by Denny »

Whistlin'Dixie wrote:Oh My god! How heinous! I am going to have visions of that belly button in my dreams tonite. Aaaaaaauuuuurrrrgggghhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ewww...I thought only the good ones were called dreams. :o
User avatar
Chiffed
Posts: 1298
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 1:15 pm
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: Pender Island, B.C.

Post by Chiffed »

3 flutes:
One that he/she really enjoys the low notes on,
One that he/she likes the feel of rolls on, and
One he/she cracks the high notes on.
:devil:

Materials: reinforced concrete for all three.
Tones: Yes.
Happily tooting when my dogs let me.
User avatar
GaryKelly
Posts: 3090
Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 4:09 am
Please enter the next number in sequence: 1
Location: Swindon UK

Post by GaryKelly »

Hmmm, some interesting things have come out of this 'experiment' so far.

Interesting Thing No.1 Perhaps the most interesting responses are the one that haven't been written. And they've been not-written by the most ardent, vociferous, and dogmatic proponents of the 'it's the flute' camp. Where are they? I've seen 'em browsing the forum and posting to other threads. Surely those who continuously propagate the belief that certain woods possess distinct 'tonal qualities' would have absolutely no difficulty with this test? Of course, if they don't want to play, we can only surmise as to the reasons why. Guess what I'll be surmising.

Interesting Thing No.2 was this:
Unseen122 wrote:I definatly hear a difference between the first and last Flute playing. I can tell that the first one is probably a larger bore instrument and the last is sometihng smaller. Of course it could be one Flute and one player changing their embochure, it would have the same effect.
Shame about the last sentence in the quote though, which rather negates the 'definite' in the first. But, after tapping me teeth with a pencil for a while it came to me that Unseen is 17 (please correct me if I'm wrong, Avery). Which means, if he hasn't already devastated his hearing playing those feckin' awful Agony-Bags, he may be hearing something in the track that those of us who are older (some of us considerably older) simply cannot detect. Advancing years progressively reduces the high-end response of our ears. But his statement is too vague to be of value as it stands. Avery, perhaps you could do us a favour? Play the track again, and tell us the time at which you think you hear a transition from 'a larger bore instrument' to 'something smaller' or the 'change in the player's embouchure'. That way we can all have a listen again to see if we can hear what your younger (and therefore higher range) ears are picking up.

Interesting Thing No.3: There's been only one serious attempt at question E.
BigDavy wrote:Tone - flute like.
Which, oddly enough, is what all the non-flute-players who've heard the track have told me..."sounds like a flute". And which of course is quite right. It does indeed sound like a flute, and not a congealed dairy product or a member of the animal kingdom.

Now you'd think, given the endless reams of adjectives spewed around here on flute tone (quite often by those non-participants mentioned in Thing No.1 above) that it'd be a relatively simple question to answer. From the huge list of such frequently-bandied adjectives as sweet, pure, rich, complex, full-bodied, creamy, buttery, reedy, honking, buzzing, barking, edgey, hard, soft, focussed, centred, unfocussed, breathy, bright, dark, light, sombre, chocolatey, full, round, woody, woodier, warm, cold, dead, &c &c &c &c ad infinitum, you'd think there'd be no difficulty assigning at least half a dozen to the test track.

But no. Nothing, except of course for the delightfully amusing aromatic wags! Which is a shame, because here's a chance for the adjective-brigade to agree upon and fix a set of standard adjectives to a tone that everyone can hear and use as a reference... "Aha! So *that's* what they mean by rich-complex-full-centred-honking-focussed-creamy-dark-edgey-reedy!"

Interesting Thing No.4: Approaching 700 'views', only 28 responses (and a few of those are cow-bell and belly-button related).

However. Interesting Things aside, it has been brought to my attention that some folks don't necessarily visit C&F every day, or perhaps can only visit at weekends. So, to give them all a fair chance I'll wait until Monday to post the answers to A,B,C, and D. I reckon BigDavy nailed E.

I think I'll bookmark this thread and point certain individuals to it next time they start wittering on about "xwood has a warm dairy product tone, but ywood has a hard buzzing tone". It might spare us all a long winter...

Pants. I forgot to put in a question F about sports cars.
Image "It might be a bit better to tune to one of my fiddle's open strings, like A, rather than asking me for an F#." - Martin Milner
Post Reply