This Made Me Angry

[Unseen122]

So I asked Micheal Cronolly of M & E why do you have to pay for rings and keys on the price for keying a Wooden Flute if Rings come standard on a Wooden Flute, I get a reply back saying that he does not make keyed wooden Flutes. Well guess what I had decided that when I have the cash I was going to get the M & E because for about the same price as the Hammy I was going to get I could get 4 keys as opposed to keyless. So that completely ruined my plan. To all of you reading this and thinking why would I change my mind about getting the super loud Hammy when before I had made such a big deal about having the lodest Flute it is because the band I needed it to play with decided to get a Drummer meaning I would need to be miced no matter what. This might actually be good because now I can spend more to get a super keyless and might be able to have enough to get me started on a a practice set of Pipes.

Anybody of heard of the maker named Carl Bell? I need some feedback as his prices are not too bad and I could get Boxwood.

[Wormdiet]

My thought would be. . . how many tunes do you play that you need keys for? On those tunes, could you get a whistle in the appropriate key? Or heck, even get one of those matched sets with like 4 bodies and one headpiece.

I have an M & E and love it, btw.

If I had the choice, though, I'd definitely spring for a keyless hammy or Olwell over a keyed M & E. Obviously, one variable here is how much you would use the keys.

[GaryKelly]

Anybody of heard of the maker named Carl Bell? I need some feedback as his prices are not too bad and I could get Boxwood.

I have one of Carl's big Bb flutes in blackwood. Tis very well made and was going very well until my elbow problems laid me off all the instruments. 'Fraid I can't help you where the D is concerned.

You could also try looking at Dominic Allan's flutes, he also makes keyed/keyless in boxwood:

http://www.woodflutes.co.uk/seriesR.html

http://www.woodflutes.co.uk/flutes.html

[glinjack]

There is no point in getting a keyed flute untill you know and understand the cromatic scale, when you know how to use the keys, then you can call yourself a flute player,
the keyless flutes are nothing more than a large whistle, and i believe they should be referred to as such,,
i use all the keys (whenever called for) on my rudall & rose boxwood 8 keyed flute, so lets not mix-up flute players and whistle players here.

[lixnaw]

There is no point in getting a keyed flute untill you know and understand the cromatic scale, when you know how to use the keys, then you can call yourself a flute player,
the keyless flutes are nothing more than a large whistle, and i believe they should be referred to as such,,
i use all the keys (whenever called for) on my rudall & rose boxwood 8 keyed flute, so lets not mix-up flute players and whistle players here.

what about uilleann pipers with keyless chanters, what do you call that?

[glinjack]

There is no point in getting a keyed flute untill you know and understand the cromatic scale, when you know how to use the keys, then you can call yourself a flute player,
the keyless flutes are nothing more than a large whistle, and i believe they should be referred to as such,,
i use all the keys (whenever called for) on my rudall & rose boxwood 8 keyed flute, so lets not mix-up flute players and whistle players here.

what about about uilleann pipers with keyless chanters, what do you call that?

I suppose i would have to call it "a whistle powered by a windbag",
I actually had a sighting of one of these in jessie james bar a few years ago.

[Denny]

There is no point in getting a keyed flute untill you know and understand the cromatic scale, when you know how to use the keys, then you can call yourself a flute player,
the keyless flutes are nothing more than a large whistle, and i believe they should be referred to as such,,
i use all the keys (whenever called for) on my rudall & rose boxwood 8 keyed flute, so lets not mix-up flute players and whistle players here.

what about uilleann pipers with keyless chanters, what do you call that?

I believe that is a whistle with a balloon...

[ChrisA]

There is no point in getting a keyed flute untill you know and understand the cromatic scale, when you know how to use the keys, then you can call yourself a flute player,
the keyless flutes are nothing more than a large whistle, and i believe they should be referred to as such,,
i use all the keys (whenever called for) on my rudall & rose boxwood 8 keyed flute, so lets not mix-up flute players and whistle players here.

Good luck finding that fight you're looking for.

[lixnaw]

i never played any pipes
but i once knew a fella in Tralee called John Curtin, he moved to London after.
he could half hole anything on his generation C.

[vomitbunny]

Keys help to protect a flute. Keeps them from rolling off tables.

[tin tin]

There is no point in getting a keyed flute until you know and understand the cromatic scale, when you know how to use the keys, then you can call yourself a flute player,
the keyless flutes are nothing more than a large whistle, and i believe they should be referred to as such,,
i use all the keys (whenever called for) on my rudall & rose boxwood 8 keyed flute, so lets not mix-up flute players and whistle players here.

Unless I'm missing some strange humor, this has to be one of the more ridiculous posts I've seen lately. As keys are not needed for a large majority of the Irish traditional repertoire, using or not using them is very much a matter of personal choice. The idea that one can't be a real flute player without using them is plain silly. According to that definition, it would seem that people like Seamus Tansey and Hariprasad Chaurasia (bansuri) are not actually flute players. Or what do you make of Catherine McEvoy, who plays a right-handed keyed flute left-handed and doesn't use the keys? How about baroque flutists? Does using one key give access to the 'real' flute-players' club? And if playing whistle is somehow a lesser calling, I guess Mary Bergin is of little consequence.

Finally, you will find that whistles are an end-blown instrument (under the general umbrella of the flute family), while the term flute usually refers to a side-blown instrument, regardless of keys (or even finger holes, for that matter).

(By the way, I play a keyed simple-system flute and played Boehm flute for 15 years, so this is not the disgruntled rant of someone who can't handle keys.) But I do think keyless flutes are perfectly viable for Irish music (and a number of other types of music), and I think the distinction you make is absurd.

[chas]

Yeah, I felt like yelling, "Moderators, there's a snobe in our midst."

It is kind of like saying you really don't play the fipple flute if you play a whistle, in order to really play, you must play the recorder, and must be able to play it in the key of Dflat or B.

[Unseen122]

I wanted a Keyed Flute because I want to be able to play the occasional chromatics more cleanly. I have wide and short hands (size 12 1/2 ring) so half holing is not always easy for me. I really want an F nat key a lot. I have ultimatley decided I want a Rudall of some form so that means no to the Hammy. I am highly considering the Carl Bell Flute (the pictures and prices) but I need some more feedback before I can really consider it. I could also get a ringless Burns for pretty cheap and also have the Boxwood option for that it might not be as strong and tunable but I think I would survive because what I hear about Boxwood is that it is harder than Blackwod to crack. I like the tone of Boxwood and I think if given the option I would go for it. When I get some money I would probably want to spend upt to $800 so that gives me the options of that range. I would have Splurged for the Keyed Flute though

[Wormdiet]

I wanted a Keyed Flute because I want to be able to play the occasional chromatics more cleanly. I have wide and short hands (size 12 1/2 ring) so half holing is not always easy for me. I really want an F nat key a lot. I have ultimatley decided I want a Rudall of some form so that means no to the Hammy. I am highly considering the Carl Bell Flute (the pictures and prices) but I need some more feedback before I can really consider it. I could also get a ringless Burns for pretty cheap and also have the Boxwood option for that it might not be as strong and tunable but I think I would survive because what I hear about Boxwood is that it is harder than Blackwod to crack. I like the tone of Boxwood and I think if given the option I would go for it. When I get some money I would probably want to spend upt to $800 so that gives me the options of that range. I would have Splurged for the Keyed Flute though

I like yer choice of preferred keys. . . Fnatural tunes are fun:)

If you get a keyed flute you absolutely must learn Paddy Carty's version of Jug of Punch.

[glinjack]

i never played any pipes
but i once knew a fella in Tralee called John Curtin, he moved to London after.
he could half hole anything on his generation C.

yes indeed John Curtain a great whistle player from Brosna Co Kerry, John was born in london, his father Con Curtain played violin and owned "'the big baloon"' tavern in london, he now lives in Brosna and owns a bar in the square, John is also a great flute player and grew up playing and learning alongside the great Roger Sherlock in west London,
I spent some great nights playing music in Con Curtains bar in Brosna some years back, looking forward to meeting and playing with those great people sometime soon.