Hybrids

[herbivore12]

As Weeks noted, I have a hybrid Civic.

My mileage varies considerably, depending on how much attention I pay when I drive. If I drive a bit aggressively, or without thought to efficiency (lots of acceleration, which really burns up gas, etc., as opposed to nice steady driving), I get about 40 mpg. If I actually pay attention, though, it improves to about 50 mpg. I get about 50 mpg -- sometimes better -- for long trips on the freeway, as well, if I keep the thing at a reasonable speed.

Once, having gassed up at a high-ish altitude and driven mostly downhill for many miles, my gas mileage was something like 97 mpg. That was pretty fun, but nothing like typical.

I got the Civic before the redesigned Prius came out; I hated the older version of the Prius in almost every way. The new one is apparently a much nicer car to drive. I still find the styling and that TV screen in the dashboard to be weird and distracting, but then again, under my tree-hugging, tax-and-spend liberal exterior, I'm pretty much a conservative traditionalist . . .

With gas around here as high as $2.60 (or more!) for the lowest-grade stuff, I'm really appreciating the efficiency. The super-low emmissions are nice, too, for us greenies. The newer model standard cars are improving a lot, though, on both fronts, which is awfully nice.

A nice effect for the music lover is the lack of noise at long stops, when the gas engine turns off. Perfect for a little whistle practice, or listening to your CDs/radio with no engine noise at all. . . ahhhhh.

[IRTradRU?]

Oh, and you can crank up Planxty on the cd player and it sounds really, really good.

It's about time we heard of some priorities here!

[DCrom]

Just a cautionary note - I'd pretty much settled on a hybrid for my next car, but I've seen news stories recently (as in, the last couple of weeks) that show that most of the hybrid's in-town milage advantage is an artifact of the way that the EPA was testing.

This is mainly due to the fact that the "in-town" testing was't done on the road, but on rollers. This method seems to be reasonably accurate for conventional cars (at least, it seems to be consistant for conventional cars) but gives an artificially high number for hybrids.

Turns out that - in actual, town driving situations - hybrids get about the same actual MPG as a similar-sized car with the same power & acceleration. The EPA Highway numbers seem to be pretty accurate, though.

Given the still-present price differential, I'm not certain that it makes sense to buy a hybrid for mostly in-town driving. I probably would for mostly highway driving, though. And the situation may change noticably, in either direction, with next years models.

[Brewster]

Any thoughts on repair/maintenance issues with hybrids? I assume when the battery dies, you just can't pick up a $75 Die Hard at Sears. I seem to remember reading way back that battery sytem needs to be replaced at some point and it's not inexpensive.

[herbivore12]

Just a cautionary note - I'd pretty much settled on a hybrid for my next car, but I've seen news stories recently (as in, the last couple of weeks) that show that most of the hybrid's in-town milage advantage is an artifact of the way that the EPA was testing.

This makes sense to me, since my in-town mileage has never been as good as mileage during longer trips, despite the manufacturer's claims that in-town mileage is supposed to be better than highway mileage. Think I can get some kind of rebate for that misleading claim? (Wouldn't be a good American if I didn't sue somebody . . .)

That said, my in-town mileage is usually around 40 - 42 mpg, which ain't too bad; the lowest mileage I got was 38 mpg during a particularly hectic time when I didn't pay attention to my driving at all for a while.

With the weather getting nice, though, I've been riding my bike to work; now that's fuel efficient (coffee and a banana'll get me there; you don't want to know about the emmissions, though...).

[ChrisA]

There are owner-enthusiast sites where people report mileages in excess of 90mpg, other people reporting on the same make & model 40ish mpg. It turns out, how you drive - how much you take advantage of regenerative braking, etc., makes a huge difference.

That seems a bit hard to believe. I can see the 40MPG figure, but more than doubling the mileage based on 'the way they drive' is a wee bit to fathom.

Now, if some folks are getting mileage (I assume it's combined city/highway) at 40 MPG, I don't see that much of an upside. My SAAB gets 30 MPG combined, and has hit 36 on the open highway. So now I'm wondering what the fuss is all about.... ?

Oh - and the SAAB that I have is rated at 180 HP compared to the 76 HP of the Prius.

Apparently the Insight has some meters to let you know how you're doing mileage-wise,
which can turn it into something of an obsessive game for some. The trick to it is
to always brake so that it's entirely the regenerative system slowing down the car,
and never the brake pads (which simply throw the energy away as heat). In traffic
situations involving cars behind you, this game may not be playable ...

Only people with a really heavy foot on gas and brakes can drive their mileage down
to 'normal car' levels. But it is doable. The same people would also be driving down
mileage on normal cars with that obnoxious slam brakes / floor accelerator / repeat ad naseum
behaviour that makes me despise commuting by automobile.

I think 50ish mpg was normal. Still from anecdotal evidence over a year ago. 70ish
was decently achievable by the gamesters, 90 was reserved for the truly obssessed.

[BillChin]

A friend has a Prius. It is surprisingly roomy.

I could not find any definitive mileage survey on hybrids, but did find this from Edmunds, a long-standing source of auto information.

The Real Costs of Owning a Hybrid
By Tara Baukus Mello, Date Posted 11-18-2004
http://www.edmunds.com/advice/specialre ... ticle.html
...
Since hybrids have only been on sale in the consumer market for about five years, it's still a bit early to assess all the real costs of owning one of these vehicles. On the surface, it appears that the added costs are recouped with benefits such as the federal tax credit and the improvement in fuel economy. Maintenance and repairs seem to be average or slightly below average so far, and issues with repairs of hybrid-specific components are nearly nonexistent. Whether the benefits outweigh the costs in the long term will really remain dependent on external factors, such as if the clean fuel federal tax deduction is phased out as planned, and personal factors, such as the owner's typical commute and if he or she can get the optimum fuel economy benefits.

For the hybrid owners we spoke with, any additional costs, perceived or real, were outweighed by the love of their cars. Everyone we interviewed adored their hybrids and many said that they would be unlikely to go back to driving a gasoline-only vehicle. Shelly Cohen of Seattle, Wash., drives a 2003 Honda Civic Hybrid and she is glad to know that there are some larger hybrids coming on the market, so she has more room for the two youngsters in her life as they grow. "When it comes time to trade it in, I'll be looking at the hybrid (Toyota) Highlander or the (Honda) Accord," she says. "I'll need something bigger by then, but it will be good to know that I can still get the environmental and the fuel economy benefits of a hybrid."

[peeplj]

The plus side: you won't have to worry about the SUVs much longer if gas prices stay this high, you may not be seeing as many of them on the roads in years to come.

Something to consider: my 97 Neon 4-door gets 24 in the city and 40 on the highway and cost a little over ten grand when I bought it new. These numbers aren't as good as what you're quoting here, but it's not bad for an inexpensive (relatively) car that is several years old.

I include that only to point out that for fuel economy there are other options besides the hybrids.

I do like the hybrids, though.

--James

[Tyghress]

We just ordered ours...it should be delivered in September.

Tyghre thinks we can get 90 mpg if we attach spinnakers, maybe put a few hamsters on exercise wheels, and maybe install a spring system.

Toyota SERIOUSLY doesn't need to advertise or promote this vehicle. They can't get them 'in stock' as the waiting list is...well, four months long right now. Their USED Prius's last a week on the lot.

We'll be using it mostly for in town driving, though it'll get its share of highway and distance travel. The tax break for the fuel efficient cars disappears at the end of this year, so we figured we'd act now to take advantage of that.