Rising gasoline prices - USA only or Worldwide Issue

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 7:37 am

As I filled up my little Ford Escort at the pump yesterday, and gas prices had gone up 15 cents overnight, I began to wonder at the significant increase we've had in the USA for the past year - our gas prices have more than doubled since about January 04, and they're predicted to increase throughout the summer. Granted, they were low in the past - too low compared to most other countries.

So I began to wonder if other countries have had their gas prices double over the past year?

Eric

avanutria · Post by **avanutria** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:04 am

Maybe the US is just catching up to the pack. Boy am I glad I don't have a car anymore.

On the other hand, I'll be renting one briefly at end of May; not looking forward to the prices!

Brian Lee · Post by **Brian Lee** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:07 am

You'd think it would snap people's reality into check wouldn't ya? Living in a state with moderate winters, everyone here seems to feel that they *MUST* have the biggest, most inefficient fuel guzzling SUV's they can buy. And of course, when the snow flys, it still comes down to the fact that they don't know how to drive and it's all the SUVs you see on the news in fatal crashes etc.

It seems that only now are some of the auto makers offering more fuel efficient models of their vehicles, including some hybrids and electrics - something that should have taken place two decades ago I think. With the cost of oil and fuel rising one wonders how much more the market will bear of our over-consumption. The prices at the pump are starting to worry more than just a few it seems....and perhaps that's as it should be.

susnfx · Post by **susnfx** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:07 am

I read an article the other day that said if you figure in inflation, gas today is actually not as expensive as it has been in times past. Tell that to my pocketbook.

Susan

Cayden · Post by **Cayden** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:11 am

Pices go up and down, they were well over a euro a liter here for a bit, went down again to the low 90s (depending on where you bought it) but they have been going up a bit recently.
You guys were getting it ridiculously cheap all the time so I suppose you're only catching up, comparison of European prices<a href="http://www.aaroadwatch.ie/eupetrolprices/">here</a> a comparison of Irish prices <a href="http://www.ripoff.ie/petrol.cfm"> here</a> .

emmline · Post by **emmline** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:12 am

Brian Lee wrote: Living in a state with moderate winters, everyone here seems to feel that they *MUST* have the biggest, most inefficient fuel guzzling SUV's they can buy.

Yeah, it's weird. Though I'm observing a slight downward trend in the average size of vehicles on the road from the last year or two.

TinwhistleJulian · Post by **TinwhistleJulian** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:13 am

well in europe the gas and fuel become even more expensive in following of tax programs in germany,where I life actually for a while, to save the nature (but they put the money into the rental system for the seniors),and the energy traders put the prices higher and higher(mainly cause of taxes and(as they always say) cause of the oil problems in iraq and rest of arabia.
but thats more just a saying than truth.
Julian

jbarter · Post by **jbarter** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:12 am

Does anyone know how fuel prices compare around the world if you factor out the variations in tax in the different countries?

Sunnywindo · Post by **Sunnywindo** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:27 am

So, um... curious.

In the states, we depend a great deal on truckers (big trailer trucks and the like), transporting goods (food, clothing, furniture; store goods) often across large distances. Trains to (which run on disel I think). Without trains and trucks in paticular, there'd be next to nothing on our shelves. (Can't speak for other countries I've never been to, not to say they don't rely on such things to, however....)

I've noticed since the fuel prices have gone up that the price of food/goods has gone up, my guess is to offset the cost of fuel to transport (and in some cases, manufacture) such goods. (I wonder what the truckers have to say about rising fuel costs.) Saw disel costing more than unleaded the other day (I recall it used to run less than unleaded, suddenly it's more?) Can't imagine the truckers would be happy about that. Rising fuel costs effect more than just our pocketbook at the pump.

Like someone pointed out in the passport thread, the United States is rather, um... big. People are used to needing to travel long distances in a car to see family or to commute to work (or sometimes just to get groceries). There are a lot of rural areas, even some cities, where public transportation isn't functional/practical or simply doesn't exist. Having regular access to a car is a necessity in many places, not a luxury.

I get the impression that people don't depend on cars as much in Europe/UK region as we do here. Is that impression an acurate one? Are big trailer trucks as common there as here? Even then, there's not such a distance to transport goods there as there is here, is there?

Guess what I am wondering is.... While high gas prices still have their effect anywhere, wouldn't high gas prices cause a bigger problem here in the states where there are such large distances involved and more people depend on having a car verses the UK/Europe where distances are smaller and (the impression I have whether right or wrong) that people don't depend on having a vehicle quite as much?

Sara (*who didn't write that very well, but has been up all night with a sick baby so that's as good as it's going to get right now*)

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:53 am

Good stuff all.

Peter - thanks for the with prices - we're still not paying nearly as much as folks across the pond.

However, it doesn't sound like there has been a big price increase over the past year for you all. Am I right?

I'm just wondering if the price increase is a USA only thing or worldwide.

I'd dearly love to have better public transportation in the US. In Kansas City, I'm able to bus to and from work, but there are a lot of places we can't reach by public transport so we need the car, too.

Eric

Cayden · Post by **Cayden** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 10:49 am

Prices fluctuate with the oil price which is rising at the moment they have been higher in the past and they have been down a good but as well during the year. They have certainly not doubled recently.

As to the other problem, I think providing and maintenaning of a good public transport system is a sign of good and sensible government. Dependance on cars in Ireland is higher than in most places in Europe.

Montana · Post by **Montana** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 10:58 am

Sunnywindo wrote:Like someone pointed out in the passport thread, the United States is rather, um... big. People are used to needing to travel long distances in a car to see family or to commute to work (or sometimes just to get groceries). There are a lot of rural areas, even some cities, where public transportation isn't functional/practical or simply doesn't exist. Having regular access to a car is a necessity in many places, not a luxury.

I get the impression that people don't depend on cars as much in Europe/UK region as we do here. Is that impression an acurate one? Are big trailer trucks as common there as here? Even then, there's not such a distance to transport goods there as there is here, is there?

Guess what I am wondering is.... While high gas prices still have their effect anywhere, wouldn't high gas prices cause a bigger problem here in the states where there are such large distances involved and more people depend on having a car verses the UK/Europe where distances are smaller and (the impression I have whether right or wrong) that people don't depend on having a vehicle quite as much?

Here is where we (the US) have done it to ourselves.

Yes, the US is big. But in many cases, people don't "need" their cars for their work commutes or travel. They have chosen a lifestyle where a car is required. The people in California (or anywhere, sorry, I don't mean to single out Californians) who have a 2-3 hour commute each way have chosen to live that far away from their work. They don't want to live closer because they don't have to with a car. If commuting wasn't so easy, they would probably live closer to their work. People like to have their cake and eat it too. Gas prices are only a problem to people who chose a lifestyle that makes it so.

(Granted there are instances where a person has no choice but to travel but I would say these are not the norm)

The western US developed with the car unlike the eastern part or Europe. Thus the European and eastern US cities have better mass transportation because it is not so easy to get around in a car. The older towns weren't built for cars; streets are tight and since traveling long distances was more difficult, everything is closer together and there are small town centers here and there. This is why people there don't appear to depend on cars so much. By accident, their cities were planned better.

The westen US is poorly designed to foster community and ease of travel without a car.

And the thing to remember about rural folks is they didn't used to travel into town everyday. Going into town used to be a big deal because you only did it every couple weeks or even monthly, and when you went in, you stocked up so you didn't have to go in again. Some still do it this way. So even rural folks don't "need" to travel long distances all that often.

As a population, we have become dependent on the car and take it for granted. IF for some reason, all the cars disappeared, we'd figure out how to deal without them. But until that happens, cars are like cell phones - a lot of people can't imagine living without them and refuse to do so.

I'll get off my soapbox now.

missy · Post by **missy** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:34 am

someone above brought up my "pet peeve" about some of those that complain about gas prices -

What are you driving? If it's a big, new Expedition, and you aren't daily driving gravel roads and hauling around 7 people, I don't want to hear your complaints. Our two "primary" cars get 25 - 30 mpg. We do have a gas hog conversion van, but we only use that for festivals, and only when we are going to be sleeping in it (so we are saving money by not renting motel rooms - and the price of gas is going to have to go up a lot further before that savings is offset).

What's your commute each day? If you live 30 or more miles away from where you work (quite common here, actually), I don't want to hear your complaints. I would LOVE to live in the country, but I hate rush hour traffic. I only live 2 miles away from where I work, and I purposely bought this house to be close to work. Kids schools are 1 mile and 2 miles away from the house. DH is retired, so other than if he needs to drive the youngest (oldest drives), there are days he doesn't take the car out.

We have lousy mass transit here (there is no way to go east - west, you need to go south to downtown to transfer to a different north bound bus). They've been "discussing" light rail - but it won't be where it needs to be to relieve congestion.

Missy

BillChin · Post by **BillChin** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 11:56 am

I posted this on another thread, but bears repeating. The average cost of car ownership is about $8000 per year. This includes depreciation, insurance, and repairs. Fuel even with a 50% hike in the past couple of years, remains less than 20% of this total. A handful of Americans are flinching at buying that big car or SUV. However, anecdotally, a friend recently bought a brand new car and chose the bigger engine for more power over the smaller engine for better fuel economy. This friend is as frugal as people get without being compulsive. To me that means, the price of gas isn't high enough to make the average American make substantial changes, not yet.
+ Bill

Caj · Post by **Caj** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 12:29 pm

Sunnywindo wrote:So, um... curious.

In the states, we depend a great deal on truckers (big trailer trucks and the like), transporting goods (food, clothing, furniture; store goods) often across large distances. Trains to (which run on disel I think). Without trains and trucks in paticular, there'd be next to nothing on our shelves. (Can't speak for other countries I've never been to, not to say they don't rely on such things to, however....)

It isn't mandatory, however, for the oven mitt in my local supermarket to be manufactured 3000 miles away. If gas prices ever make transportation genuinely prohibitive, you'd probably see local goods become more competitive, and some more localization in manufacturing to offset the change. This wouldn't negate higher gas prices, but the effect would be softened some.

Caj