Grawol

raiden29 · Post by **raiden29** » Thu Jun 26, 2003 4:45 pm

Hello everyone!

Last night I was at one of my best friends house, where he threw a little party. I went to his computer in search for some good irish tunes for his brother, who now got the irish "bug" from me. I found "Eb reels" by "Flook"(not sure about the name of the song).
It is truely a wonderfully fast song, very interesting and very well played(as I'm sure Dale would agree). At some point during the song the whistle player grawols. I don't know if that's the name, but if I recall that's the name to describe what he did in jazz. It means making your whistle sound like louis Armstrong. I do not know how to do it, and was hoping one of you knows...

Thank you very much,
Raiden29

Ridseard · Post by **Ridseard** » Thu Jun 26, 2003 8:10 pm

Grawol?

Jerry Freeman · Post by **Jerry Freeman** » Thu Jun 26, 2003 8:24 pm

Gravel?

Ridseard · Post by **Ridseard** » Thu Jun 26, 2003 8:31 pm

Jerry Freeman wrote:Gravel?

Yeah, that could describe Satchmo's voice, but not necessarily his trumpet playing.

Jerry Freeman · Post by **Jerry Freeman** » Thu Jun 26, 2003 8:40 pm

Yeah.

Singers do talk about "voice gravel."

Ridseard · Post by **Ridseard** » Thu Jun 26, 2003 8:48 pm

Maybe he means flutter-tongue: vibrate the tongue off the roof of the mouth while blowing the whistle. I heard that done on one of the Chieftains' recordings.

boomerang · Post by **boomerang** » Thu Jun 26, 2003 8:58 pm

ok i had fun doing this when i was bored, you can get some very interesting effects, simply speak into the mouthpiece of your whistle like you would a kazoo, if you try hard enough you can sorta hum the tune and have your whistle accompany with the excess breath...try it
its mildly amusing for a little while
some mouthpieces work better then others..
Good luck
David

Zubivka · Post by **Zubivka** » Thu Jun 26, 2003 11:09 pm

Ridseard wrote:Maybe he means flutter-tongue: vibrate the tongue off the roof of the mouth while blowing the whistle. I heard that done on one of the Chieftains' recordings.

That one (flatterzunge as we know it, thanks for telling the English term) I manage to do, but it always swings me up to second octave.

As for the proper growl I never heard it on a whistle, while quite a few jazzmen do it on brasswinds as well as single-reeds. It's a vibrato supposed to come from the back of your throat, without using the tongue. Don't try it with a sore throat! On my low C it sounds good, but less spectacular than with brasswinds.
Maybe it's me, maybe it's a question of back-pressure...
Also, the sound of the throat growl is distinctly audible over the sound of my whistle, like ventriloquism...
On a regular whistle, what comes out is an interesting "reedy" vibrato.

Now, if only Claudine read this thread, she's the brass-blower and jazz head who'd tell us the specifics...

LimuHead · Post by **LimuHead** » Fri Jun 27, 2003 12:28 am

Ridseard wrote:Maybe he means flutter-tongue: vibrate the tongue off the roof of the mouth while blowing the whistle.

That's what it is. Think of the 'r' sound in the Spanish pronunciation of 'arriba'. If you can pronounce the Spanish 'r' sound in 'arriba' and blow the whistle at the same time you'll make the sound.

Easier said than done, I suppose!

Aldon

Zubivka · Post by **Zubivka** » Fri Jun 27, 2003 9:45 am

boomerang wrote:ok i had fun doing this when i was bored, you can get some very interesting effects, simply speak into the mouthpiece of your whistle like you would a kazoo, if you try hard enough you can sorta hum the tune and have your whistle accompany with the excess breath...try it
its mildly amusing for a little while
some mouthpieces work better then others..
Good luck
David

I tried your trick--great! it does start the true jazz Growl, in both octaves (though a bit harder to get in second, for my taste). So I wasn't far when mentioning ventriloquism.

The fluttertongue I still can't manage in lower octave. Tried "arriba" in Spanish, but that gets me straight to speedy Gonzales pitch; tried in Russian as in borchtch (gesundheit!) and imagining I'm a deep bass chanting deacon, but no much better!

trisha · Post by **trisha** » Fri Jun 27, 2003 2:20 pm

Paul, we await the video with interest... :roll:

Trisha

One small step for mankind...

TonyHiggins · Post by **TonyHiggins** » Fri Jun 27, 2003 2:45 pm

I got a "growl" effect on a Bb Abell at the end of a tune by blowing a little harder than I normally do without pushing into the second octave. You can hear it at the end of King of the Fairies on the Clips site. It's under Misc, fairly recent post. It was unintentional, but sounded deliberate. I haven't fooled around with it. I'm wondering if it's easier on certain notes. Willie Clancy does it a bunch on a D whistle on the first track of Totally Traditional Tin Whistles. I don't know how he did it, but it's very dramatic.
Tony

boomerang · Post by **boomerang** » Fri Jun 27, 2003 6:06 pm

[/quote]
I tried your trick--great! it does start the true jazz Growl, in both octaves (though a bit harder to get in second, for my taste). So I wasn't far when mentioning ventriloquism.

The fluttertongue I still can't manage in lower octave. Tried "arriba" in Spanish, but that gets me straight to speedy Gonzales pitch; tried in Russian as in borchtch (gesundheit!) and imagining I'm a deep bass chanting deacon, but no much better!

[/quote]

I tryed the flutter tongue, very effective...for what other then amusement i dunno but, we can always wait for that "special" song

the kazoo method can make some great didgeridoo sounds, which might be ok for a few aussie tunes i am learning

its all good fun
cheers!!

Zubivka · Post by **Zubivka** » Sat Jun 28, 2003 1:43 am

TonyHiggins wrote:I got a "growl" effect on a Bb Abell at the end of a tune by blowing a little harder than I normally do without pushing into the second octave. You can hear it at the end of King of the Fairies on the Clips site. It's under Misc, fairly recent post. It was unintentional, but sounded deliberate. I haven't fooled around with it. I'm wondering if it's easier on certain notes. Willie Clancy does it a bunch on a D whistle on the first track of Totally Traditional Tin Whistles. I don't know how he did it, but it's very dramatic.
Tony

That unbalanced tricky twilight zone in-between two octaves at low end IS sounding as a growl (or bark if you make it shorter).
Thank you for mentioning this!

Smells of more practice, practice, practice...

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