Need some advice

[Jose' Scotte' Este']

Hey all, I need some advice. I have an (un-named) instrument made by an (un-named) maker. I had this instrument custom made for me and the maker lives on a different continent than me. I chose this maker because the maker was highly regarded. When I received the instrument, it was not well packed (it had bounced around in its case) and appeared to be poorly finished. When I questioned the maker about the packaged and finish, the maker indicated that was typical of the maker's work. With that said, the instrument played well... for a while. However, over time, the instrument changed physical shape and eventually became unplayable. I took care of the instrument the same way I take care of all of my other instruments, and had never had a similar problem. The maker suggested I send the instrument off to a buddy on this continent for repair, as shipping would be cheaper... I did this once, and also had a local maker look at the instrument. Everyone who knows about this kind of instrument and has looked at it says that it is so out of whack that it is not playable and has no value (did I mention that I paid alot of money for the instrument). Anyway, at the maker's suggestion, I sent the instrument back to the maker in a far away land. The maker agreed to rebuild/make the instrument to playable condition. I have been in touch with the maker, on and off for the last 14 months. The maker often does not respond to my e-mails, which have been cordial, and when the maker does respond, usually indicates that the instrument is almost (re)done. This interaction has been going on for about the past 6 months.
I am wondering if anyone has any ideas about how to proceed. I am wondering if I have any legal recourse, or if I can contact the police there to file a report, or what?? The instrument is insured here. Thanks.

[LorenzoFlute]

I have a suspect of who the maker might be... Anyway, you could first try to freak him out by telling him that you're gonna contact the police, this might work.

[Jose' Scotte' Este']

I doubt that anyone on this forum knows this maker. The point is not to bash the maker. I posted on this site because alot of folks seem to read the forum, and might have some good sound advice. I have thought about contacting the police, but I am wondering what their response would be. After all, I did send the instrument to the maker. I haven't threatened the maker with any particular action yet, as I really don't want to make an idle threat. If I pursue an action, I want to know that it can be carried through. I haven't contacted my insurance company yet, as I am assuming that I would need to have filed a police report. Again, I doubt that the maker has technically stolen my instruument, as I shipped it off myself. Thanks.

[Mr.Gumby]

I don't think either police or insurance will be avenues to pursue. You purchased a product that you found not up to scratch. A solicitor and consumer law as it applies to the country where the product was made provide the road that leads to resolving this sort of disagreement, which is over a business transaction, a faulty product and a promise to make good what was faulty.

[plunk111]

Not sure how it works across borders, but your state attorney general office is a good place to start. I've used them 3 times regarding Internet transactions and had good results every time. One of the incidents didn't even require paperwork! Just the mention of AG was enough to get action.

[jim stone]

There is also the option of patience. If the maker is highly regarded we probably do know him.
You might give it another couple of months, meanwhile seeing whether the soliciter suggestion
that Mr. Gumby made is practical. My own feeling is that, given that you and the maker are
divided by an ocean, it may end up costing you a good deal and not succeed. Gumby is
surely right that the police will not become involved. I expect a soliciter may be not
much interested in the case, but I don't know.

There is a highly regarded maker about whom board members have complained along closely
similar lines and I do think he ultimately comes through. If it were me I would give it another
few months, meanwhile see what I can learn about consumer protection and whether/how
its enforceable from afar, and send more e mails. You might write
personally to some board members in the maker's country who may be able
to give you more detailed info.

Bashing the maker isn't a good idea and you might consider revealing the maker's identity
to save other board members the trouble and expense you are going through.
It is nowhere written that this sort of thing can be done with impunity to a customer.
But that is entirely your call.

[Mr.Gumby]

I don't see why a solicitor wouldn't take on a case like this. It's their job.

Speculating about the subject of this thread may not exactly be in good taste, especially as the OP carefully avoids pointing a finger. Jim Stone has in the past shown time and again he has a bee in his bonnet about a particular maker, yet he has not dealt with the maker himself. If one is to comment about a maker at all, or the one Jim thinks he recognises as the subject of this thread in particular, I think it would be safer to only comment from personal experience.

[jim stone]

Soliciters (at least on this side of the Big Puddle) often refuse to take cases they feel
they can't win. This one may be one of those. By all means check it out. Julia Delaney might have
some advice. Might PM. S/he deals in flutes on the other side of the Atlantic.

[James_Alto]

Jose,

sorry to hear about your bad experience. Do you think the flute has warped, due to the nature of the wood itself, or because it hasn't been properly seasoned/dried out?

From what little I know, most flute makers aren't out to screw customers over: they tend to be honest and hardworking individuals, probably prone to idiosyncrasies and rough edges, however they aren't generally out to make it on Wall Street by flogging dead horses to customers.

Equally, you know nothing of the personal circumstances of the flute maker: one of the hardest things in the modern world for any of us to do, instead of fomenting in anger, is to extend a little grace.

Hope it get sorted out for you. If it doesn't, then perhaps you do have recourse to naming the flute maker on the forum, to warn others?

[Jose' Scotte' Este']

Thanks for thoughtful posts and comments. I am a member of several musical instrument forums and chose this forum to post this topic because there are quite a few smart and informed folks on this forum. With that being said, the instrument in question is not a flute. I really didn't want to get into the specifics of the instrument or the maker's name, because I don't think it is in my best interest to do so. My main objective is to get an instrument back that is playable and has some of the value that I initially put into it. I am going to explore some of the suggestions that have been made, and also wait a bit longer while I explore those options. I suppose I wouldn't be so frustrated and anxious if the maker didn't' keep telling me that the instrument is "close" to being finished (the last of heard from "him" was two months ago; and the instrument has been close to being finished for several months before that). I haven't e-mailed him since, as I am trying to balance being persistent with being patient. Given the history of the whole transaction, I have a bad feeling in my gut about this one. Thanks again for the thoughtful posts.

[jim stone]

I hope it works out. I rather think it will. Highly regarded makers do tend to come through, I believe.
It's hard to stay in business and not give people satisfaction sooner or later.
A little of this sort of thing, especially if it isn't ultimately resolved, can go a long way.
I do think if you can find musicians or, better still, dealers in instruments, on
the ground where the maker is located, they may give you suggestions as
to how to deal with the situation, and suggest people to call who deal professionally
with such issues. Good luck!

[Mr.Gumby]

An example of the angle you should take to approach this : Consumer rights EU/Ireland. The site includes information about complaint procedures and gives the appropriate complaint forms.
Ofcourse the details depend on where the purchase was made.

[yvie]

I doubt that anyone on this forum knows this maker.......

Jose I know you are after advice on how to proceed, but you mention that you paid a lot of money for this flute, I'm no expert, but I have either spoken to in person or e-mailed almost all the Makers that are crafting High quality flutes that are expensive, keyed or un-keyed so i'm sure we all must know the Maker, in name if nothing else, I know your not in the market for stirring up a hornets nest, but when I was in a similar situation regarding an expensive Hydrogen alpha telescope $4000, with a misaligned filter, I mention on a certain forum that I was having issues, very long replacement/repair times limited responses to my e-mails, someone on that forum new the owner and had a chat, within the month my scope was sorted, wether that was down to the publicity of the issue I was having on an open forum, I don't know, and like you I had only written the facts and not slagged of the person/company involved.

yvie

[LorenzoFlute]

"the instrument in question is not a flute"

[Jäger]

I doubt that anyone on this forum knows this maker.......

Jose I know you are after advice on how to proceed, but you mention that you paid a lot of money for this flute, I'm no expert, but I have either spoken to in person or e-mailed almost all the Makers that are crafting High quality flutes that are expensive, keyed or un-keyed so i'm sure we all must know the Maker, in name if nothing else [...]

In his last post Jose explicitly stated that the instrument in question was not a flute, and as such I think that it is his right not to state the name of the maker or the type of instrument.