Chiff & Fipple is both a topic-driven forum and a social network all in one, so expect diversions along the way. I find that it helps my OCD to have a topic go suddenly into left field. There's nothing that I can do about it but go with the flow. That there may never be a resolution to the topic in question is also a good lesson. This time, however, I hope that we can put this issue of McCarty flutes to rest. By the end of this thread we want to have a thumbs up or down with regard to Eric McCarty.
Tell us something.: Very much enjoy all flutes, bagpipes and whistles. I'm an older player; however, an active learner. I take current lessons from an Irish Flute tutor, a Boehm Flute tutor and a Highland Bagpipe tutor. I'm a great believer in lessons and without the assistance of a tutor, I find that I would be repeating the same mistakes over and over again, making me proficient in poor music.
I had an opportunity to meet with Mr. Eric McCarty this afternoon for about an hour and a half at his home in Ogden, Utah. He showed me his shop, which is actually in two locations on his property; he does his turning in the garage and the finish work is done in the basement. Mr. McCarty is an accomidating man, 40 years of age, soft spoken and very polite. He answered all questions that I asked him; I was prepared to take pictures of his shops, however, he wouldn't allow me to do so for "marketing reasons." I didn't quite follow the reasoning, perhaps I should have asked for further clarification, but I didn't. I can say that the pictures of his shop, found on his web site are identical to the set up he showed me this afternoon. I can tell you that Mr. McCarty is a man of modest means and his shop reflects that fact. Twice he mentioned that he makes little money and has a couple of jobs which pay the household expenses and bills. According to Mr. McCarty, making instruments isn't making him much money at present; in other words, he must work a couple of full time jobs to make ends meet. He did mention that one of his jobs was that of Chaplin (of a major Christian faith) in a hospital located on the Wasatsch Front.
With regard to the issue of where the flutes are made, Mr. McCarty was emphatic that he makes the flutes himself, he showed me the bores that he uses, and that these flutes as well as his bagpipes are not made outside of the USA and then "tweaked" by him. In addition, he mentioned that he has gone through this same process in the past and has answered many questions of a similar nature. He stated, "with all due respect, I doubt that whatever you (meaning me) say will make any difference." I was left with the impression that he felt that people were going to think what they were going to think and there was little he or anyone else could do to change their opinions. He stated that he hadn't seen this current post on the assessment/ evaluation of one of his flutes.
I asked to see a flute in current manufacture or see one that was finished as I wanted to also try my hand playing it. He didn't have one at the time that he could show me. There were, however, several Great Highland Pipe drones that were in the process of drying on his work bench. The ferrals, caps and slides were made of nickle and according to Mr. McCarty the hardware is purchased from Pakistan as are the brass rings that he uses on his flutes. He was careful to note that the wood portions were of his manufacture. When I asked why he would make a flute or a pipe look like a Pakistanie product, he said that he loves to turn wood and make instruments, it's an avocation for him. When he started out to make pipes and flutes he pruchased from Pakistan sources instruments which he could tear apart and measure and adjust as they were inexpensive. He did produce a stack of his drawings showing various designs of what looked like both bagpipes and flutes. I asked Mr. McCarty why he would produce a flute that appeared so similar to flutes from the Mid-East and he said that it was easier for him to do so at this point in time, that he could make a flute that sounded good and played well without changing the overall appearance of the flute. I asked if he was intending to change the appearance of his flutes due to all of the speculation in the past and he said that with regard to the flute that was assessed/ evaluated on Chiff and Fipple (I showed him pictures printed off of the web-site so that he would know exactly what flute I was talking about) that he wasn't going to change the outward appearance of that particular flute. In addition, Mr. McCarty had a stack of books which were on his work bence, books such as, "Simple Flutes" by Mark Shepard, Louis Paxton Price's book and one by Bart Hopkins. I didn't examine the books closely, but there were a number of reference books that looked used and appeared to address the topic of flute and pipe manufacture in addition to a large three inch thick stack of loose papers that appeared to be drawings that he had made and various measurements he had taken.
In addition, I might mention the stacks of blank wood in the basement of his home. There were piles of wood, neatly stacked in rows of three or four blanks, cris crossed, perhaps a foot and a half to two and a half feet high. As I recall there were five such stacks of various types of wood. These pieces of wood were in their present configuration for the purpose of seasoning before being turned into instruments, according to my host. Many of the blanks were covered in wax and I looked closely at the various kinds of wood and noted Black Walnut, Cherry, Pear, Rosewood, some Blackwood and Hickory. In addition there was a reference book on how to properly cure wood sitting on of a top shelf on a near-by cabinet. Each blank was stamped with its identifing name. Mr. McCarty said that he obtain his wood blanks from such sources as, Don's Hobby Lumber, from Turning Blanks.com and the out of country woods (Blackwood and Honduras Rosewood) from West Penn Hardwoods.com.
Mr. McCarty was quite detailed regarding his preparation of the wood. He had a rather large plastic tub next to the stacks of blanks that he said he would fill with Pentracryl, which is a wood stablizer, according to him, prior to turning the wood on the lathe. He stated that he would treat the wood in this fashion for a 24 hr. period and that the product kept the wood from splintering and cracking while in the turning process. It was clear to me that Mr. McCarty loves working with wood and that he was involved in his current venture "because I enjoy turning."
Is he what he says he is, a man who enjoys working with wood and making his own flutes and bagpipes? Well, you decide.
You know, I nearly posted early on perhaps he was modeling his flutes on middle-eastern made flutes. Darn, I would have seemed remarkably precognizant had I done so.
Thanks for making the trip to his house...it sounds to me like he is making his own flutes. Now, as to whether or not they're good flutes, that's a different question. Too bad you couldn't play one. It would be nice to have a more accomplished player give an opinion.
psychodonald wrote:I had an opportunity to meet with Mr. Eric McCarty this afternoon for about an hour and a half at his home in Ogden, Utah ...
Many thanks for taking the time to clarify Donald.
You know - everything you say here - reiterates the exchange I had with McCarty in his emails as a sincere and small modest flute maker - unlike the kind of insincere speculations littering this thread.
I'm not sure why people feel the need to attack a small flute maker, based on the similarities of his flutes in shape with other flutes. If it doesn't fit with the Chiff & Fipple crowd - that's fine too ...
psychodonald wrote:I asked to see a flute in current manufacture or see one that was finished as I wanted to also try my hand playing it ...
Thanks Donald. I guess Mr McCarty is correct: the majority of people will make up their opinions, regardless of the evidence, and mostly based on speculation. Back in page 1 - I was marvelling at the construction of the flute ... apart from the brass rings. This makes sense
I enjoy my McCarty flute, and I'm certainly not an accomplished player on the Irish flute or any flute for that matter, having only returned to the flute after a decade of neglect. Realistically - an accomplished player won't be very accomplished trawling for flutes costing $200 or so, unless he's looking for a vintage/antique flute to restore and work on.
It's pleasing to hear of your research and your meeting with Mr McCarty too. Thanks for your efforts and balanced report on what you found
It is my considered opinion that Pakistani flute parts, meaning brass rings, slides, and the like, come from Pakistan. I have thought long and hard about this, and nothing you can say will alter my opinion.
True. And I sheepishly admit, the one possibility I didn't consider was that an independent flute-maker would INTENTIONALLY base his instruments on the Pakistani design. It just seems so obvious in hindsight!
Charlie Gravel
“I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying.”
― Oscar Wilde
I must admit, seeing someone basing a flute design on one of the most roundly detested examples of the craft in existence fairly boggles the mind. I can't think of a worse business decision.
However, to be precise, the flutes are indeed partially constructed in Pakistan. Have a look at the pics - it's hard to concentrate on the wood bits for all of that Indus Valley bling.
I've no complaints with someone using Pakistani hardware -- fittings are one thing I have never enjoyed dealing with. Basing your flute on a known flawed design, though, there's no reason for that. For around $50 or so, you can buy plans for "real" flutes from a number of reputable places. Or you could find someone with a good flute and measure that.
Charlie Whorfin Woods
"Our work puts heavy metal where it belongs -- as a music genre and not a pollutant in drinking water." -- Prof Ali Miserez.
Personally, I could care less where the metal bits of a flute come from provided they work well...it's the body of the flute - bore, placement of holes, etc. that make a flute sound good not the rings.
In all honesty, I wouldn't care if the entire flute came from somewhere in the middle-east or central Asia provided the flute played well. The issue is they tend not to play well which is their key point of consistency.
If I were looking for a new flute, I'd buy one of Rod Cameron's tweaked middle eastern flutes in a heartbeat, though...which shows it's the design/care put into the bore, holes, embouchure, etc. that really matter not the province of the parts.
Tell us something.: I play fiddle, concertina, flute. I live in NH. Lived in Kilshanny, Co Clare, for about 20 years. Politically on the far left. Diet on the far right (plant-based fundamentalist). Musically in the middle of the pure drop.
it's the design/care put into the bore, holes, embouchure, etc. that really matter not the province [provenance] of the parts.
Not quite true. Provenance matters. The "cocus" wood that comes from Pakistan isn't anything like the real stuff. Most of the wood found on flutes made in Pakistan are poorly seasoned and prone to cracking and splitting. Certain sources are more reliable than others, which is why provenance matters.
As I recall, Rod Cameron hasn't reworked a Pakistani flute for years now. Why soup up a Yugo? The mid-eastern Cameron flute that I had didn't play any better than one of Dave Copley's, Dave O'Brien's, François Baubet's or Casey Burn's flutes. And one of those flutes wasn't made in a sweatshop, from inferior material, under horrible conditions. We still don't know how well -- or not -- a McCarty flute plays, and it is unfortunate that he sources his material from sweatshops, but fair play to him. It does seem as if he's trying.
I don't know about you, Eric, but I like the way a fine flute looks and feels in my hands. Brass or nickel keys may work as well as silver keys but I like the way the silver keys look and that translates into the enjoyment I get from holding and playing my silver-keyed cocus flute.
However, Rod is a master of instruments made of soft wood (eastern pine) and graphite: cheaper than a flute
Freedom is merely privilege extended, unless enjoyed by one and all. The Internationale
