Reason for choosing a particular key.
- narrowdog
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Reason for choosing a particular key.
I've just been learning 'Old Man Dillon' and 'Lark on the Strand'
from Sean Potts' album 'Number 6'.
'Transcribe' is a wonderful thing
Now, he plays a few tracks on the album on a 'C' whistle
including the above which is accompanied by guitar.
So the question is, why would he choose 'C'?
from Sean Potts' album 'Number 6'.
'Transcribe' is a wonderful thing
Now, he plays a few tracks on the album on a 'C' whistle
including the above which is accompanied by guitar.
So the question is, why would he choose 'C'?
Happiness is taking things as they are.
- DrPhill
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
All other things being equal......
Many musicians have pointed out that every musical key conjures up specific feelings. American popular song writer Bob Dylan claimed the key of C major to "be the key of strength, but also the key of regret." "French composers such as Marc-Antoine Charpentier and Rameau generally thought of C major as a key for happy music, but Hector Berlioz in 1856 described it as "serious but deaf and dull." Ralph Vaughan Williams was impressed by Sibelius's Symphony No. 7 in C major and remarked that only Sibelius could make the key sound fresh. However, C major was a key of great importance in Sibelius's previous symphonies.[3] Claude Debussy, noted for composing music that avoided a particular key center, once said, "I do not believe in the supremacy of the C major scale."
Wikipedia
Many musicians have pointed out that every musical key conjures up specific feelings. American popular song writer Bob Dylan claimed the key of C major to "be the key of strength, but also the key of regret." "French composers such as Marc-Antoine Charpentier and Rameau generally thought of C major as a key for happy music, but Hector Berlioz in 1856 described it as "serious but deaf and dull." Ralph Vaughan Williams was impressed by Sibelius's Symphony No. 7 in C major and remarked that only Sibelius could make the key sound fresh. However, C major was a key of great importance in Sibelius's previous symphonies.[3] Claude Debussy, noted for composing music that avoided a particular key center, once said, "I do not believe in the supremacy of the C major scale."
Wikipedia
Phill
One does not equal two. Not even for very large values of one.
One does not equal two. Not even for very large values of one.
- JackCampin
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
In a lot of genres the key is set by the instrument the tune was composed for. If a tune happens to fit the fiddle best in D minor, then you'd better have a C whistle handy if you want to play along with a fiddler, because that's the only key they'll do it in. ("Julia Delaney" comes to mind).
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
Some baroque instruments - especially flutes and recorders, maybe woodwinds in general, I'm not familiar with other families - produce a different sound depending on the key they are played in because of the use of cross fingerings. I've always wondered whether this is the origin of the characterisation of tonalities Phill refers to. Otherwise it never made that much sense to me, not having absolute pitch myself.
On the other hand, why play something in one key rather than another? To introduce variety in a set, because you like the sound of a particular whistle or register, because you can avoid a particularly shrill high note or unassertive low note, because your accompanist finds it more convenient... many reasons.
On the other hand, why play something in one key rather than another? To introduce variety in a set, because you like the sound of a particular whistle or register, because you can avoid a particularly shrill high note or unassertive low note, because your accompanist finds it more convenient... many reasons.
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The torture never stops.
The torture never stops.
- sackbut
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
Non-whistlers like to wind whistlers up by putting together sets of tunes that force the whistler to swap whistles - the oftener the better. In the Scottish tradition you usually have 4, sometimes 8 tunes to one dance, and box players like to show off with a key change at every new tune. This usually lets you in for at least two whistle swaps a set.
My (Scottish fiddler) wife has just come up with 'Farewell to the Creeks' in A followed by 'Cock of the North' in F (for the Britannia Two-Step). It sounds fine, and sure, it's only one whistleswap, but going from reading in A on an E whistle to reading F on an F whistle...
Reason for choosing a particular key? To stave off Alzheimers in aging husbands by keeping their brain cells hyperactive.
My (Scottish fiddler) wife has just come up with 'Farewell to the Creeks' in A followed by 'Cock of the North' in F (for the Britannia Two-Step). It sounds fine, and sure, it's only one whistleswap, but going from reading in A on an E whistle to reading F on an F whistle...
Reason for choosing a particular key? To stave off Alzheimers in aging husbands by keeping their brain cells hyperactive.
- Mr.Gumby
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
The counter question could be 'Why wouldn't he?'. Variety, liking the sound of a tune on a particular whistle, liking a particular whistle, reasons galore.So the question is, why would he choose 'C'?
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- Lars Larry Mór Mott
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
My thoughts as well.. It's not like D and related D whistle/flute/pipes keys are carved in stone for ITMMr.Gumby wrote:The counter question could be 'Why wouldn't he?'. Variety, liking the sound of a tune on a particular whistle, liking a particular whistle, reasons galore.So the question is, why would he choose 'C'?
the artist formerly known as Mr_Blackwood
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
I don't know if this is still true, but I remember hearing that Bill Ochs required all of his beginning whistle students to use a C whistle because it's easier on the ears, especially when you've got a class full of them.
My first whistle was a C, a Generation that I bought in 1976; it's still my favorite whistle and the only one I play at home for my own enjoyment.
My first whistle was a C, a Generation that I bought in 1976; it's still my favorite whistle and the only one I play at home for my own enjoyment.
- Lars Larry Mór Mott
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
I tend to spontaneously grab a C or Bb whistle at home too when i just feel like playing a tune, come to think of it i believe it is indeed because of the D and above can be rather shrill in my living room.bradhurley wrote:I don't know if this is still true, but I remember hearing that Bill Ochs required all of his beginning whistle students to use a C whistle because it's easier on the ears, especially when you've got a class full of them.
My first whistle was a C, a Generation that I bought in 1976; it's still my favorite whistle and the only one I play at home for my own enjoyment.
the artist formerly known as Mr_Blackwood
- James_Alto
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
I hear what you are all saying about the association of keys with the emotional vibes of the music.
For example - some russian composers made great use of the Eb minor key for symphonic pieces; equally, we see the same key being used in Japanese ethnic music, and chinese music - leading some musicologists to suggest that Eb minor is associated with 'orientalness'.
I tend to think that it is the repertoire, which defines our impressions of the key.
Personally, I prefer the keyless tune scale, but that requires a chromatic flute, and not a diatonic flute. Henryk Gorecki's music, is keyless, and impossible to play on a diatonic instrument. Some refer to it as atonal for that reason, but it's not so much 'atonal', as it is, 'liberated' from the tradition of writing music in fixed keys.
The Key of D, C, G, F are my most popular flutes/recorders/whistles. I have one low Eb minor key which I love, but the air volume required to shift it is exhausting.
But none of that is relevant. The reason to get a specific key flute is .... to have another flute.
Whoooaaaadd!
For example - some russian composers made great use of the Eb minor key for symphonic pieces; equally, we see the same key being used in Japanese ethnic music, and chinese music - leading some musicologists to suggest that Eb minor is associated with 'orientalness'.
I tend to think that it is the repertoire, which defines our impressions of the key.
Personally, I prefer the keyless tune scale, but that requires a chromatic flute, and not a diatonic flute. Henryk Gorecki's music, is keyless, and impossible to play on a diatonic instrument. Some refer to it as atonal for that reason, but it's not so much 'atonal', as it is, 'liberated' from the tradition of writing music in fixed keys.
The Key of D, C, G, F are my most popular flutes/recorders/whistles. I have one low Eb minor key which I love, but the air volume required to shift it is exhausting.
But none of that is relevant. The reason to get a specific key flute is .... to have another flute.
Whoooaaaadd!
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
Hello. This is my first post on CF so forgive me if I muck things up. There is a mystery to music that I try very hard not to unravel and that is the effect of keys on the emotions. I just enjoy them. On a 5 string banjo tuned gCgcd it makes a happy sound. But raise the C to a D as in gDgcd it becomes G modal and the instrument becomes a totally new instrument and the music becomes haunting. Put a capo on a diatonic dulcimer and as you move it up the fingerboard the changing modes evoke different emotions from the otherwise same fingering...Bob.
Oh body swayed to music, O brightening glance,
How can we know the dancer from the dance?... WB Yeats
How can we know the dancer from the dance?... WB Yeats
- narrowdog
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
and I think this was the reason for the post in the first place,Mr.Gumby wrote:......reasons galore.So the question is, why would he choose 'C'?
just trying to get some idea as to why.
We get so used to playing on D whistles and flutes because
we play tunes with others in keys of D and G.
Reasons can be simple, reasons can be complicated, I'm just curious.
Happiness is taking things as they are.
- s1m0n
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
Because it fits my particular lock.
And now there was no doubt that the trees were really moving - moving in and out through one another as if in a complicated country dance. ('And I suppose,' thought Lucy, 'when trees dance, it must be a very, very country dance indeed.')
C.S. Lewis
C.S. Lewis
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
Every key, when compared to itself will sound the same. C major will not be any less or more happy than C# major. the intervals are all the same. A major 3rd from B to G will sound like a doorbell, just like one from D to Bb will.
like the others pointed out, folk instruments (ones that often do not play chromatic, like whistles) are suited for some keys more than others.
many musicians, especially from a folk background, associate certain keys with certain emotions. if you only ever played a D whistle, you'd start to think of G as happy, E as sad, etc.
and to agree with another poster, I'll close with this quote about science, just change it to "music" in your head
"Science isn't about 'why', it's about 'why not'!"
-Cave Johnson
like the others pointed out, folk instruments (ones that often do not play chromatic, like whistles) are suited for some keys more than others.
many musicians, especially from a folk background, associate certain keys with certain emotions. if you only ever played a D whistle, you'd start to think of G as happy, E as sad, etc.
and to agree with another poster, I'll close with this quote about science, just change it to "music" in your head
"Science isn't about 'why', it's about 'why not'!"
-Cave Johnson
"By this we know we have passed from death to life: that we love our brothers."
- JackCampin
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Re: Reason for choosing a particular key.
On a lot of instruments, keys do NOT all sound the same, and that's why they got the emotional associations.
One to three sharps gives you a lot of open strings on the violin, particularly for notes closely related to the tonal centres most used when playing in G, D or A. And the same notes sound without crossfingering on a 1-key flute or simple oboe. So if you play in D you get a bright sound out of a typical 18th century band. Play in E flat and both strings and woodwinds have a more muffled sound for tonic, dominant and subdominant. On the other hand the brass and the B flat clarinets can really wail. So the whole balance of sound changes. Listen to Mozart's scoring in The Magic Flute for some typical examples.
I've deliberately used this. A lot of Carolan's tunes sound far too bright and assertive when played as usual in G on a D whistle or C descant recorder. It's better if the notes most central to the key have a more muted sound, so you don't get cadences terminating with an assertive bang. So I use something like a D voiceflute or A sopralto, playing the tune with the crossfingerings you'd use when playing in a flat key on a C recorder. The result is a gentler and more vocal tone that cuts out the over-dramatization.
One to three sharps gives you a lot of open strings on the violin, particularly for notes closely related to the tonal centres most used when playing in G, D or A. And the same notes sound without crossfingering on a 1-key flute or simple oboe. So if you play in D you get a bright sound out of a typical 18th century band. Play in E flat and both strings and woodwinds have a more muffled sound for tonic, dominant and subdominant. On the other hand the brass and the B flat clarinets can really wail. So the whole balance of sound changes. Listen to Mozart's scoring in The Magic Flute for some typical examples.
I've deliberately used this. A lot of Carolan's tunes sound far too bright and assertive when played as usual in G on a D whistle or C descant recorder. It's better if the notes most central to the key have a more muted sound, so you don't get cadences terminating with an assertive bang. So I use something like a D voiceflute or A sopralto, playing the tune with the crossfingerings you'd use when playing in a flat key on a C recorder. The result is a gentler and more vocal tone that cuts out the over-dramatization.