Was looking online and have found another new whistle being released that would put you in mind of a Sindt.
I don’t own a Sindt but i know people go mad for them.
But what is the deal with that type of whistle, seems alot of whistle makers are making in that style now.
Obviously the craftsmanship of the whistle wouldn’t be the same as a Sindt. The whistle is a Glenluce Wexford
Whats funny is I don’t even think these makers know they are copying Sindt, they are trying to copy Killarney. All the assorted whistle youtubers have Killarneys, like Gingertail, CutiePie, windy whistly, etc. Everyone on whistle reddit recommends Killarney. And theres no reason to spend a ton of money on making an injection molded head to compete with the $10 whistles when they can make a clone of what everyone seems to want.
The bandwagon is creaking at the seams.
Glenluce are the Pakistani crowd, aren’t they?
Yes Mr.Gumby,
A quick google told me made in Pakistan. There you go i never knew that myself
Yes Narzog, theres very little mention of Sindt in these review videos of Killarney’s etc. I don’t think they would play as well as a Sindt.
Iv never played a Sindt or any of the knock off versions so i couldn’t compare but I’d imagine.
Killarney are the perfect clone, because they seem really good, but cost much less than a Sindt. There was a thread a while ago of a guy who has a Killarney who bought a Sindt and he couldn’t really tell the difference. With these other clones I expect a much bigger drop in performance.
Killarneys have majorly gone up I’m price since they first arrived. I am not so sure they are still a cheap alternative.
I wouldn’t call Killarney indistinguishable from the Sindt. Far from it.
A curious thing is when you examine a Sindt whistle (actually, I’ve only ever had my hands on a Killarney), then you should realise that it is a development in materials but not fundamentally in design. It’s basically a Thin Weasel style fipple (and subsequently numerous other wooden whistles) but done in brass and delrin. Of course, the design may precede Glen Shultz’s work, I don’t know, but he certainly seems to have popularised it.
This is not a comment on the quality or worth of Sindt whistles, and, yes, it was John Sindt that came up with the idea to marry up these materials and that design of fipple with a thin Generation-style metal tube.
So, if there’s any “sin” in emulating it, it’s the same “sin” committed by Sindt and all those wooden whistles.
It also seems that some of these whistles are moving away from the Sindt setup and incorporating much thicker tubes, leading to a slightly different style of whistle.
As for the Glenluce whistle, I commend the honestly and openness of Hobgoblin in telling their customers where their instruments are made; unlike the practice of others. I’ll also make no assumptions about their quality simply based upon where they’re made.
Raising price is what all makers should do if they are selling well. I asked Gary Humphrey last week what the wait would be on a low G and he said at least mid October. I asked Ronaldo Reyburn how long I’d have to wait for a G and he had one in stock, which just arrived today (love it so far btw lol). The Reyburn cost almost twice as much as a Humphrey. Gary could 100% charge more and still sell. Any sales lost would be made up for in the raised price, and he should raise his price until he stops having a wait list. Humphrey and Reyburn are similar amount of build effort (Reyburn is a bit more because it has a tuning slide), but neither have special coating or anything that should make one cost way more than the other. It bugs me that Reyburn cost as much as Burkes and MK’s but doesnt have an extra nice nickel or anodized finish, but I also still bought it, so he apparently doesnt need to spend time on extra finishing haha. If Gary told me he had one in stock I would have bought it on the spot. I don’t mean any of this as an insult to Gary, hes doing great. Luckily for me I’ve wanted to try a Reyburn also so it was a good opportunity to get one.
Funny you should say that Narzog,
I have an order in with Gary at the minute for a trad D, its the first week in September, he has given me as the delivery time.
I placed the order about a month ago.
He must be doing well because we were E-mailing back and forth and he had given me an estimate of August (at that time).
I told him i would put the order in at the end of the week because i didn’t have the money spare at that time.
So in the space of 3 or 4 days he must of had a few orders come in, not a bad sign.
I understand he stopped making whistles full time for a while and started again so i thought i may aswell get one incase he stops again.
As for the Glenluce whistle, I commend the honestly and openness of Hobgoblin in telling their customers where their instruments are made; unlike the practice of others. I’ll also make no assumptions about their quality simply based upon where they’re made.
It doesn’t really matter where they are made but there has been lots of discussion here in the past about Glenluce flutes, pipes and wooden and plastic whistles. Given the reputation of the company, it would be adviseable to try beofre you buy. But that holds true for just about every make.
Raising price is what all makers should do if they are selling well.
I’d rather have a whistle that strikes a reasonable balance between price and what it delivers. There’s enough overpriced mediocrity as it is.
Sadly I don’t own a Sindt (truly my heart lies with my trusty Burke whistle so I’ve never felt the need despite them being great whistles). I do have a Killarney Eb whistle though which, as others have said, is clearly an imitation of Sindt (highest form of flattery so they say, right?) and I like it much better than some of the Killarney D whistles I’ve tried.
I also picked up a Wild Whistle from McNeela recently (another homage to Sindt it seems) as curiosity got the better of me and the price was right and I must say I greatly enjoy playing it. Would I give up my Burke for it? No. But would I choose it over some of the other Sindt-a-likes on the market? Definitely. Has anyone else here tried it?
As OP has said, there’s an increasing number of copycat Sindt whistles hitting the market these days but that’s bound to happen when something is popular. It’s not necessarily a bad thing as long as you don’t think you’re getting the same quality for a fraction of the price.
Has anyone here tried the new Lír whistle? It looks to me to be another Sindt-esque design but I could be wrong. It looks a little heavy for my liking though (I’m a fan of a nicely balanced more lightweight whistle myself) so I’m not sure I’d be willing to invest.
Killarneys were going for S110 around the time I got a Sindt from the maker himself for $160. There was a time before Killarney’s copies hit the scene that the Sindt waiting list was forever and a day. That made the aftermarket soar. When I contacted him in Dec. 2019 about an extra head for a Bb A set I had and a sense of his waitlist, he said the waitlist had caught up. So myself and 2 of my friends ordered Sindts and got them within weeks.
I am assuming that the waitlist dried up due to people picking up the perfectly serviceable Killarneys with the idea that the Sindt waitlist was beyond their patience. Having both, doing the close your eyes and pick up a whistle blind test I always preferred the Sindt to the Killarney. There is just something more precise about it? Less harsh? It is hard to describe. It is especially evident if I play them in my “office” a tiny room with lots of hard edges.
I am assuming the copies of the copies play OK. I’ve not heard anything horrible about them.
Is Sindt still selling new whistles? if so what is his website?
He doesn’t have a website, you email him with your order. Do a search.
Ha! You’re probably right.
Reminds me of when I was playing Highland pipes at a wedding reception, alternating with a folkish band playing Irish trad. Every tune they played was off late 1960s to early 1970s Chieftains albums, as if they had these as their only source, and set out to learn every set on every album. When I mentioned this to them, they didn’t know what I was talking about, seeming only vaguely aware of the Chieftains.
In any case the basic Sindt design is similar to the Susato, which in turn is based on recorders. The innovation is making the head out of solid brass, and refining the tone and performance. Here’s an original Susato, machined from PVC stock with a cedar block.
I used to have Sindts in D, C, B, Bb, and A and they are superb whistles. The Bb in particular was terrific. They have a dark sophisticated tone and butter-smooth voicing. However I found the 2nd octave to have a Generation-like slight flatness, and when I got a Killarney D with bang-on octaves I kept that, and my modified Generations in those several keys, selling off the Sindts.
I miss the brown Susatos’s, they looked nice. I think another key Sindt innovation is that he uses a tube over a tube over a tube (where the head is 2 tubes, over the body tube). Susato and many others inspired by them are just a tube over a tube (tube 2 being the inner mouthpiece and body, which would then need a seperate outer or inner tube for a tuning slide). Which is why the Sindt clones look so obviously copied (along with that they also use the same materials).
I never really looked at the whole copying Sindt, as a way of offering a similar looking whistle for alot cheaper, for those who didn’t have the patience to wait on him making theirs.
I never looked at it that way. If that was the case then fair play to Killarney.
I looked at it as the manufacturer thinking “Right lets under cut the John Sindt fella, hes making a fortune, sure who’s going to know the difference.”
Maybe im wrong but thats what i take from it
I can’t speak to the motivation of the Buckleys during the various stages of how their business developed but originally they started making these whistles for pupils of their music school in Killarney. There was a certain pressure or expectation that whistler’s entering Comhaltas competitions did so using an expensive whistle and Sindts were looked on favourably at some point. I would think that all played into it. It wouldn’t surprise me if things took off more than they originally expected.
But the competition thing will have played into the optics, and it was all about optics. A student of mine entered a county fleadh with a Gary Humphrey whistle I had at the time and was told she would need to get a better whistle. Which left me to find a second hand Sindt for her before the provincials. Which I did, though the forum. But my point was that the whistle she played initially was fine, it just looked too much like your run of the mill whistle with its plain black top: optics. I think the Sindt took her to the All Irelands.
I wonder if one should be sad or mad over that. Makes me think those people don’t really know their stuff. I wonder what they’d have said to Mary Bergin showing up with a Generation?