Thoughts on lessons for those who have been playing a while?

Whistle
1

I’ve been playing a tin whistle for over 2 years now. I play mostly for my own amusement and I still don’t really read music, although at a pinch I can just about decipher it.

I enjoy listening to various sorts of Irish, Scottish and “world” music incorporating whistles and flutes and enjoy having a go at playing what I hear. I wont say I’ve got a brilliant ear, but I can usually figure out the melody of most tunes after a few hearings.

I’m not really working toward any given goal - I just play the whistle because I enjoy it. I particularly like my very melancholy sounding Low D - I find playing that very therapeutic.

I’ve been considering taking some lessons locally. The reason for this is, being self taught, it seems to me that my playing is a mixture of some reasonably advanced techniques coupled with a total failure on some basics. For example, I can play some pieces with what I until recently considered fairly difficult half-holed notes without a problem, however I would characterise my breath control as poor at best. I find it difficult to maintain good tone on a sustained note when it occurs when my lungs are approaching empty. I also lack discipline in deciding where to breathe in a piece, so my phrasing is all over the place.

I do believe instruction would address these basic failures. Frankly though I’d be a little embarrassed to let a professional hear my attempts at music, especially since I have been playing a while now. The expense is also not particularly welcome.

What are your thoughts on instruction for self-taught tin whistlers who are a bit all over the place in their skills?

Will these things come together themselves if I keep listening and playing? Is instruction the best way to go?

2

I always think getting a teacher to give you some pointers is a good idea, at whatever age and whatever level of experience you are. It’s amazing what a few lessons will do. Skype is an option these days, which means that you can sometimes get hold of the best teachers wherever they are in the world.

3

I promise you, if you’ve been playing for two years, any teacher you choose will have heard much worse.

4

Lessons I’m not so sure about, although they never hurt.

Playing with other people is what it’s really about. Playing in a vacuum is never productive.

IMHO, your best bet is to find others of like mind. Then listen a lot, practice a lot, and keep moving forward. Have a blast!

5

I don’t think you need lessons unless you’re just doing it for fun.

You can learn to read music in very little time if you’ve got some helpful material.

I recommend the Clarke tin whistle book(on Amazon) and Blayne Chastain’s music guide. Blayne has a bunch of songs with notes/video/audio. I’m currently using both of them :slight_smile: It helps to be able to read the music and hear it at the same time. My rhythm is still pretty crappy but it’s getting better.

http://blaynechastain.com/foundational-tin-whistle-course/intro?a=556http://blaynechastain.com/foundational-tin-whistle-course/intro?a=556

Good luck

6

Maybe you should get together with a teacher or just a good player and don’t think of it as getting lessons. It is useful to get feedback every now and again from someone able to assess your playing and point out a few things to think about, to work on. The informed outsider’s view as it were. And a little exchange about what music is, what it does and what makers it work in the context of what you are aiming for, a bit of focussing the mind.

7

Like anything else in life, teachers can be a mixed bag.

You might get one who is so easygoing that he lets poor technique slide by. This sort really doesn’t help the learner play any better.

Or you might get a guy with some idiosyncratic style who is very dogmatic and makes all his students play just like himself. That’s not much good either, unless you want to play in his exact style.

A good teacher will listen to your tastes and your goals and will tailor his teaching to help you achieve those goals. He will listen carefully to your playing and not let poor technique pass unnoticed. He will be resourceful at coming up with approaches/stratagems to help you overcome any technical issues that are holding back your progress. He will be accepting of a variety of styles, but insist that whatever the style, that the playing be rythmically accurate, technically clean, in tune, and musical.

I never had formal lessons. Rather, I got together with a guy who was sort of a mentor. He would teach me tunes, both the basic melody and a series of variations, and show me various ornaments etc. Rather that a strictly teacher-student relationship we formed a band and played together, us two on whistles and flute and two other guys on various stringed instruments.

BTW the best book I’ve come across is The Complete Irish Tinwhistle Tutor by LE McCulloch.

8

I started taking lessons from a lady in town recently, and having previously only learned out of Gray Larson’s book, she was able to point out some things I was doing incorrectly and give a lot of insight into how things could be phrased and improved. I think a few lessons here and there could be awesome, as long as you don’t lose sight of whatever goal you had in the first place.

9

If you think someone else might find things you’re not seeing/hearing*, or you need advice on things you’re not sure how to fix yourself or need another ear, I would think lessons could work for you, yes.


*I find this rather valuable for skating and Highland dance. Intellectually I know what I need to do to do it right, and I can often feel when I’m doing it wrong and why… but not always. It still helps to have an extra pair of eyes to say “why is your arm doing that when you spin?” because apparently my proprioception (and ability to pay attention to more than one thing at once) is terrible and I usually answer “oh, was my arm doing that? But my feet were right!” :slight_smile: Sometimes having another person who knows what they’re doing to look at/listen to you and notice things you don’t is helpful! But YMMV.

10

Wow that’s the fanciest word anyone has used on this forum for a while. I wasn’t sure what it meant even after I looked it up.

Keep in mind we’re just a bunch of folk musicians here :slight_smile:

11

If you’d had a soft tissue injury in your leg, you’d know what it meant right enough. It’s one of those things you never think of til it disappears and you’re without it for a while.

12

If you’re in Angus, one place you might consider checking out is a whistle class which runs in Dundee on a Saturday morning, run by Helen Forbes in the Dundee City library. You’d need to check out that it’s still running, I think it was from around 11 or 11.30 am for an hour and a half. Helen’s a good player, with a good grasp of both the Scottish and Irish traditions.
It’s a bit up the road for you, but I’ll be running a 6-week whistle course on Wednesday nights, from April 25th in Harlaw Academy in Aberdeen, between 7.00 - 9.00pm as part of the “Scottish Culture & Traditions” group’s Summer term of classes. You’d also get the chance to meet some other whistle players, which is never time wasted. You can find out more about their classes from their website, or contact me through a private message here.

13

we have no idea what we are doing :puppyeyes:

bloody showoffs :really:

14

You have hit a very positive nerve in me. I have played whistles for probably around 16 years, or so. I had no lessons, but with the help of BOOKS and my ears, I had learned to follow the written word and kind of ‘fake’ much of the sound of traditional music, and was enjoying myself with my band.

This past Christmas, we played in a historic Pennsylvania church, for the second year in a row. As a counter to our more secular Celtic/American folk music, they had hired a harpist, for a more seasonal sound. She brought along with her two young men - 11 years old, or so - one fiddler and one whistle player. Both had entered all-Ireland competition and one had taken honors in his age category. I was simply amazed at both of them. ‘Effortless, clean, and musical’ describes their playing.

I talked with the woman after our last set, and asked if there was a chance she would take on an older (Heh. Heh) whistler who has played quite awhile, but does not do things exactly ‘right’ - either in rhythmic feel, embellishment execution, or placement - with mucho etc. She said I ‘faked things very well.’ Wow. Not only oxymoronic, but that one hurt.

We kept up the conversation via email over the ensuing weeks, and I now travel a 97 mile round trip, and pay top dollar for her lessons - and they are worth every cent. I am learning so much. Yes, I have to un-learn at the same time. My biggest challenge is that with my very active band, I have the need to ‘fix’ things I have been doing wrong not only on my lesson material, but in the band material, also. This has presented some lively challenges in front of audiences, when I either revert to my decadent old ways for a moment, or my hands and brain simply freeze, as processing goes on at a very quick rate. Never a dull moment.

I am loving it. So many doors have been opened, so many questions answered, so many ‘little’ things have become evident, so many discoveries made… In my totally humble opinion, I say go for it.

Best.
Byll

15

Hi Kenny,
Yes I’d thought about the Dundee class, but I too do not know if it is still running. The most recent webpage I can find hasn’t been updated in over a year.

There is a teacher in Kirrie who’s rates don’t seem to bad though, so I’ve been thinking about contacting him.

16

's okay. I had to look it up myself a couple years ago after someone used it in relation to my skating. I’m one of you guys, I promise!

I bet you’ll find a way to use it now, though. So much easier to have one word to use for “you know, like, awareness of what my body’s doing and stuff.”

17

hah!

I’m just glad it’s still doin’ somethin’

Whether I can notice it or not!

18

I tried learning the whistle on my own but found it to be frustrating so I put it aside for awhile. The only I instrument I ever played prior is the GHB. I’ve been playing the pipes for 8 yrs. and can do a pretty good job at site reading but last year I decided to take lessons again to correct some bad habits I picked up. In my search I was able to find a very good GHB instructor who also teaches the whistle both low and penny…I hit the jack pot.

What I’m getting out of my instruction on the whistle which also benefits my piping, is learning to listen. The technical aspect of it was picked up quickly now I’m learning to play by ear which I never thought would be possible for me. Playing the highland pipe is very structured with most pipers thinking there is only one way to play music and thats how its written. Learning the whistle with an instructor has given me the freedom to go outside those bounds. I still play the GHB they way most pipers expect you to play but the only time I refer to the dots when learning a new whistle tune is when I’m having trouble with a phrase. This has opened a whole new world of music to me thanks to my instructor.

Frank

19

Don’t worry, it’s just your propreteation or procreation or whatever.

20

Ahem. I believe that is a more personal issue. Though I suppose there might be tutors for that out there somewhere too… but if there are, I don’t need to know… :open_mouth: