We’ve been discussing Boehm flutes a bit of late and it got me to thinking…
While I have all the respect in the world for Mr. Boehm and his shiny tooters and what he did for jazz and classical fluting, it makes me cranky that the F# key is on the wrong touch (lowering ring finger instead of lifting index finger).
I understand that he was after a C scale not a D scale (and that it all makes perfect sense from that warped perspective), but I was just wondering if it would be possible to do a Boehm flute that was designed around D instead of C. Seems like once upon a time I saw an antique discussed here that was that way.
Anyway, does or did anyone ever do such a thing? Could a regular modern flute be somehow modified to do such a thing?
I’m sure the funky F# is the only thing keeping me from playing just like Joannie Madden!
I play Boehm flute, and (in Irish music) I never use XXXOOX for F#, except very occasionally when going down from G. Always XXXOXO. It works just fine for Irish music, a little flat but easy to push into tune, no harder than simple system’s XXXXOO.
There are oodles of mid-late C19th hybrid designs using Bohm’s tube (“parabolic” head + cylinder body) with anything from standard 8-key simple system tone-holes and key-work through Siccama-ish versions of the latter but using (more-or-less) Bohm’s enlarged and better placed tone-holes and rod-axle keywork to … well, all sorts, e.g. Clinton, Carte’s patents, Rockstro’s version of Bohm, Radcliff, Guards’ Model, etc. etc. Go browse the DCM or Rick Wilson’s website or … I could go on. Haven’t got time right now to patch links in, sorry.
Basically, Doc, loads and loads of C19th fluters, pro and amateur felt just as you have explained - and did things about it. Plenty of the results are still out there (and crop up on eBay or at dealers from time to time), though at least in the case of English flutes we tend to be talking about instruments made in the full flux of the High Pitch era, so many of them aren’t any practical use to us now. Read both Bohm’s own treatise and Rockstro (who gives pretty detailed accounts of many of the hybrids) and probably Powell and Baines - or just browse “flute history” online and see where it takes you - loads of stuff out there!
Just a minor quibble, I don’t think Boehm’s goal was actually to move the “diatonic” scale of the flute from D to C.
What Boehm wanted was a flute where each chromatic note had its own optimally-sized and, as much as possible, optimally-placed tone hole.
You have three fingers on the right hand that have to control four tone holes (I’m excluding the pinky because it doesn’t apply to the F# / F-natural issue). The mechanism he designed accomplishes that pretty elegantly, and even allows a “cheat” fingering for rapidly going from F-sharp to E.
Are there other designs that accomplish the same goals? Sure. But his design works, is fairly simple (the right-hand portion, anyway), gets the job done, is durable, is quiet (when properly lubricated, anyway), and best of all, allows for easy adjustment of the linkages, either with adjustment screws (on most flutes), or by gluing paper of varying thickness on an adjustment bar on the kicker for the key (on the very finest hand-made flutes).
Not bad at all. Quite an elegant piece of work IMO. And, even more impressive to me now that I’ve been made aware of the xxx0x0 option. It’s quite a lot better. Look out Joannie!
The 1867 model by Rudall Carte had the f# in the correct place as did a Radcliffe piccolo i had.
as a poster said u can use xxx oxo instead of xxx oox
Their are a couple of the Guardsman models on Ebay the now that incorporate some of the old fingering with Boehms fingering wish i had some spair cash just now, i bel;ieve the seller has loads of wooden flutes of different pitches on sale just now.
That has always been my biggest problem with the Boehm flute. Plus, I like to feel my breath on my fingers when I play, I think you can do more tricks with a simple system flute.
There’s usually not a whole lot of difference between xxx|oxo and xxx|oox on most flutes, just a few cents in pitch (if that much), and no real difference in tone.
However…
On older Boehm-system flutes, and even on some new very high-end Boehm-system flutes, there is a real difference in tone between the two fingerings. On these flutes, the tone of xxx|oox is no different from the notes around it, but xxx|oxo will have a very veiled, even unpleasant sound by comparison.
Not saying that there’s anything wrong with using xxx|oxo; on the flutes that respond well to it, it’s perfectly fine. Just be aware some Boehm-system flutes, including some really excellent ones, won’t respond well to that fingering.
Last year I had to play a bohem flute for some time because i needed the keys to play at a concert. I didn’t even consider the xxx oox fingering, xxx oxo sounded exactly the same and was very easy, it didn’t take much effort to get use to it. And you can even roll it!
Yeah, it’s the roll that’s the rub with the xxoox version. xxxoxo works fine with the roll.
I agree that a simple system flute is superior for IrTrad and other folk forms that don’t go off into odd keys. My McGee GLP isn’t going anywhere.
It’s interesting how our instrument molds our repertoire. I don’t play any Irish tunes that have accidentals. Maybe I should get some keys so I can learn some new tunes.
I’m not one of yer “Boehm is the superior flute” guys. (note my avatar )
It’s a nice instrument, with a particular set of strength and weaknesses.
Keyed simple-system flute is also a nice instrument, a very different instrument, with a different set of strengths and weaknesses.
The mistake some folks make is assuming they are the same instrument: they are not.
The mistake some other folks make is assuming that what you can play well on one can’t be played well on the other: it can, though each requires a somewhat different approach.
The mistake some folks make is assuming they are the same instrument: they are not.
The mistake some other folks make is assuming that what you can play well on one can’t be played well on the other: it can, though each requires a somewhat different approach.
Very well said. My first simple system keyed flute is coming in a few months, and you can be sure that i WON’T play just trad music. I like the open holes so much that i don’t care if is a bit more difficult to play classical music with it, they did it in 19th century and i’ll learn to do the same.
I wonder how much money it’d take to get Chris Abell to make a radcliff flute. Maybe we can all chip in and get me one, and I’ll let you know how it is
I can feel it… keys vibrate pretty strongly when I play with the right tone. Open holes are nicer tho, yeah. I wonder if you can “feel your breath” on an open-key boehm? I haven’t played them enough to know.
There’s a catch with that:
There’s usually not a whole lot of difference between xxx|oxo and xxx|oox on most flutes, just a few cents in pitch (if that much), and no real difference in tone.
However…
On older Boehm-system flutes, and even on some new very high-end Boehm-system flutes, there is a real difference in tone between the two fingerings. On these flutes, the tone of xxx|oox is no different from the notes around it, but xxx|oxo will have a very veiled, even unpleasant sound by comparison.
Not saying that there’s anything wrong with using xxx|oxo; on the flutes that respond well to it, it’s perfectly fine. Just be aware some Boehm-system flutes, including some really excellent ones, won’t respond well to that fingering.
I wasn’t aware of that. Thanks! Though, I wonder if you could adjust the screws on the keys to overcome that. I had loosened and tightened certain keys on the bottom hand of my boehm to give a harder D and a cleaner XXXOXO, which as a result made the XXXOOX F# pretty weak. But at first that was in response to my instruments’ mechanisms being pretty worn out, and in the end it didn’t fix it so I had to take it to the repair. So I don’t know enough to say that’s safe.
Fiddling with the clutch adjuster screws will NOT allow any such fine tuning of intonation of notes as you speculate. They are solely to ensure that all the keys interlink and close accurately with the same depression distance and pressure. If tweaking them got you a better low D it can only have been because it ensured they were sealing properly for that note and had not been before, whereas there must have been some leak not cancelled out by closure of an extra key for the note that became weaker.
You absolutely should NOT fiddle with the mechanism unless you understand what you are doing! That said, it isn’t actually all that mechanically complex and anyone who isn’t a mechanical ninny should be able by careful observation work out the linkages and interactions and make adjustments.
On the alternative F# fingering thing, I’m rather amazed by you guys who didn’t know it??? I can’t now remember from my early days as a fluter on Bohm flute whether I was shown it or whether I discovered it for myself (by same observation of the mechanism!). I know it isn’t in beginners’ fingering charts and early stages teachers will discourage its use in order to insist on development of and improve facility with the main fingering which should be used preferentially as the middle finger alternative is noticeably inferior (because less well vented - only one open hole before a closed one as opposed to two) on virtually all flutes. However, it is perfectly acceptable to use it in fast sequences in contexts where it is clearly more convenient than the normal fingering. I certainly used it thus before I switched to simple System - and indeed I do E rolls to this day as if on a Bohm flute, cutting with R1.
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