My Sam Murray flute developed a crack in the third section a few weeks ago. The crack goes from the ring to the F# hole and went from being fairly unoticable to fairly obvious when the tenon was slipped into the joint. I had it repaired at a very good shop and got it back yesterday, but within ten minutes of playing, I noticed that moisture seemed to be either seeping out of, or collecting along, the outline of the crack. Does this mean that the repair was ineffective and that it should be taken back for additional repair, or is it fairly normal for condesation to buld up around an abormal surface on the wood. I had noticed that my flute does seem to sweat a bit normally, in that condensation will appear on the outside of the flute after a good bit of playing. I will probably take it back to the shop to get it looked at again, but i was wondering what are some peoples experiences out there with repaired cracks, especially in the body of the flute.
I’m sure Jessie and some of those guys can tell you a lot more about this, so I completely & utterly defer to their wisdom & experience … but have you thought about your oiling habits? My understanding is that as you play, even a well-repaired crack expands – especially a newly-repaired one – and in a too-heavily-oiled flute, that moisture has to get out somewhere, so the crack edges are the logical weak spot – sort of like a leak in plumbing. And naturally, the crack repair isn’t as well-waterproofed as the rest of your flute. Anyway, if you are oiling the flute a lot you might want to cut back to doing it just once a month, let it absorb a wee bit of moisture from your playing more uniformly, and thus see if it sweats less, esp. around the crack.
(Anyway, that’s what worked for me.)
Of course there is, unfortunately, also the possibility of another crack beginning to form, maybe even in the region of the first one. So here I’ll step aside for the C&F experts … but if it was me and I suspected that, I’d get the shop to look at it again. If worse came to worst, Sam could make you a new foot. Or you could sell the whole thing to me Oops, sorry. I’ve developed a bit of a Murray obsession of late …
good question, matt. the exact same thing has happened to me on my flute, but with the head joint. I’ve been in touch with Hammy about it and hope to have a diagnosis (and cure!) soon. Pat olwell gave me some tips on humidifying (which went to the effect that i have probably been overdoing it) that are captured pretty well in threads on that topic that can be found here in the flute forum.
Wow! That’s a nasty one. All the way to the F# hole? I have had a couple of flutes that have cracked at the socket but the crack never travelled that far. Sounds like the crack is in the bore as well as the socket which makes it a little more complicated than what I have expereinced. If its leaking water then air is probably leaking too and no that is not the norm for a repaired crack. Better to have an expert take look at that one.
Where’s Murray located? If his climate is on the humid side -and I notice that you guys are in the midst of winter aridity, judging from your own locations- then humidification is probably more important than anything. Noys and Olwells, for example, are seasoned and built in relatively non-arid climates, and ought be kept humidified enough to prevent additional shrinkage that wouldn’t normally happen in the regions they were built in. Noy recommends a 40-45% humidity level, at least in the case, preferably in the room. Playing humidifies flutes, too.
We are in high winter over here where I live with a temp range so far this year of from 34 below zero to 45 above. I have know idea what the humidity levels are but my house is dry as a bone. My flutes live in a cigar humidor with a humidity level of around 60 percent. I oil them when I think about it and I have never had one swet. I may get a little condensation seep out of a finger hole but thats about it. I have repaired cracks on my old 8 key Eb and they have shown no sign of re-opening. There are so many differing opinions as to how to treat these things that I have just stopped looking for answers and treat them like I treated the wood on my boats. My rule of thumb there was to never let it dry out. Thats how I treat my flutes. I dont worry about mold because I never let them go unplayed for more than a day or two and always clean them and scrutinize them before I put them away. I dont quite have a handle on black wood though as it doesnt act like any wood I have ever dealt with, except maybe iron bark and I never understood that stuff at all. My list of flute woods has narrowed down to boxwood and rosewood. You can have the rest of these exotic substances. Of course, bare in mind I dont realy have a clue what I`m talking about. Just my feelings about things. :roll:
Check woodenflute.com and also the House of Musical Traditions website (I think that’s where Mr. Olwell’s flutecare treatise lives). Terry McGee has a good one too I think, and Hammy has a nice guide at his site. Everything I’ve read suggests that once they’re played in, they’re a lot more tolerant & regular playing = reasonable humidification. So you really shouldn’t over-oil, either – no more than every two weeks or once a month is fine on a well-seasoned and regularly played instrument. What’s more, sometimes you shouldn’t even dry a well-oiled flute out after playing; just shake it out gently & let some of that condensation remain to keep the wood alive.
My teacher also tells me that it’s new flutes that have the greatest risk of cracking. Loose rings around a joint are also a BIG crack invitation … (personal experience, there)
Anyway, it seems pretty simple – oil keeps the moisture out & playing puts it in, so you just try to balance the two, I think.
Nevertheless, I do keep a couple of cut-off drinking straws stuffed with soaked bits of sponge (McDonald’s straws seem to have the widest bores and are thus the most easily stuffable) in my flute cases; and when it’s really dry (we’re currently at about 20% humidity here), I wrap the cases in plastic bags.
(Looks pretty funny when you show up for a gig and get your flute out of a garbage bag, though )
Anyway, no fun on that crack. But overall, my experience is that condensation is my friend. I’ve noticed it seems the more damp the flute gets inside, the better it plays. When the flute sweats on the outside, I’ve likely oiled it a bit too much. So I just have to manage it all from there.
Thanks to all for the posts and advice. I am going to bring the flute back to the shop this week, but it was comforting to hear that others have had the same issues with cracks.
Oh and yes the crack was probably caused by the severe arid conditions we have been experiencing in the north east. I thought my digital hydrometer had been malfunctioning for the last three weeks as it had been displaying #### on the readout. It turns out that that is what it does that when the humidity is 0%… sheesh. I had previously had a small sponge in the case, put had not kept the case in a sealed container or anything. It was probably not enough to keep the flute from drying out. I now have the flute in a lidded tuperware container with a larger sponge. The hydrometer is in there as well and it has been reading about 60% humidity which I hope is not too much. I had not really been in the habit of oiling the flute. The flute is second hand and was made some time ago, so I assume it did not need much oiling at this point. I have read much of the debate on oiling and tend to fall in with the camp that believes it is not essential.
Anyway… I hope this problem is either confirmed as normal or repaired by the shop. the bottom line is I can’t wait to be able to play the Murray for more than ten minutes at a time. It is a beauty of a flute… really. Cathy, your Murray obsession is well founded. The only way I would part with it, is if I had another only with more keys.
"I had not really been in the habit of oiling the flute. The flute is second hand and was made some time ago, so I assume it did not need much oiling at this point. I have read much of the debate on oiling and tend to fall in with the camp that believes it is not essential. " Amanderthad
Here in Sweden it can get very dry in the winter, and the central heating doesn’t help, mind you I turn off my heating during the winter. The Wilkes I purchased 6 weeks ago I have oiled once, 3 weeks ago, inside and out, although I read that oil doesn’t penetrate very deep into blackwood? I believe the flute has been looked after by the previous owner, but I oiled it anyway just to be on the safe side. Before playing I try and warm the wood of the headjoint up by placing it under a suitable vacant armpit. So far so good. I’ve heard that a number of Murray flutes have cracked over there in the US. Would this be through owner negligence/ignorance or through wood quality?
I’d have to say that I would have agreed with your initial assessment of not needing to oil a flute that’s past its first couple of years post-completion. HOWEVER, that said, 0% humidity isn’t a great environment for the flute, and oil might have tempered the efflux of moisture from the timber. Just a thought.
As for the timber quality issue . . . I’m assuming the instrument is blackwood. Three or so years out seems like an awfully long time for an instrument to crack suddenly. Who knows! It’s awful to have that kind of thing happen, that’s for sure.
I don’t have any ideas on the condensation around the repaired crack. And you say you get condensation on the outside of the flute when you play? And after a while? That seems really weird to me. Like, noticeable condensation?
No kidding, when I over-oiled mine for a while, it literally ‘sweated’ condensation. The problem went away when I eased off; finally I guess the condensation was able to go into the wood, where maybe a bit of it belonged???
flutes can and do crack regardless of their age. whether they are over 100 yrs old or 2 months old.
anytime a flute is exposed to a rapid change in humidity (atmospheric pressure) or hasn’t been played in a long time and is suddenly played too much too soon (true for new and old flutes) or things of this nature, it can cause cracking regardess of the age of the flute. oiling won’t stop an old flute from cracking it might help a newly turned flute to develop an “outerskin” sealing the outer most cells.
Thank you, rama, for a good reminder on the value of proper playing-in for flutes of all ages. With a flute that’s been sitting (or a just-acquired one that might have been sitting – after all, the reason we often sell one of these things is because we’re not using it much anymore) for a while, it seems wise to ease it back into work. Especially in weird/different humidity and temp. conditions. In fact, I just had that epiphany myself – did a bunch of quasi-repair on my old Lark stick that was badly cracked, and was so amazed by the fact it was not only playable, but actually reasonable-sounding, that I had to stop myself from playing it too much. In fact, that’s probably part of why it cracked in the first place, because I didn’t know about playing it in when I got it. (Didn’t know about oiling occasionally or the value of quickly gluing the rings back on either, but that’s another story)
Yup, that was life on the flute frontier 'way back in '94 Praise Molloy for this board!!!
cathy,
it’s a sad thing to discover a (new) crack in a flute.
i was speaking from my own unfortunate experiences too! flutes 8 years old cracking, and over 100 years old cracking. in the latter case my room humidifier broke (which was the primary source of humidity that i used at that time).
so now i store flutes in a plastic container with a damp sponge and a hygrometer during the dry winter months and monitor it.
i guess some of us had to learn the hard way.
Several years ago I had a wooden Seery flute for about three days before it virtually exploded in the middle of the night. it had just came over from ireland, a friend brought it back. i stored the flute in my bedroom(no humidifier at this point in time, didn’t know better). I was in bed one nite and suddenly heard a loud “PING!” . I thought “who the hell is throwing rocks at my window.”
I got up and looked around and realized the noise seemed to have come from the area of the room where the flute was stored. When i found the flute the headjoint had split wide open. Bummer!
Mattt – ARGH! It almost seems like we’re doomed, doesn’t it? And an unlined head, what a bummer. There goes my metal-lining-expanding-at a-different-rate theory… At least with lined HJs you can still get a sound out of 'em sometimes …
I recently bought a new-used flute (unlined head, yikes!), and the guy I take lessons from basically said " … And it’s five years old without any cracks — that’s great!" But he’s also pretty philosophical about cracks as a fact of life (inspecting his old flute, its barrel wrapped with electrical tape – a useful temp fix for barrel cracks, BTW, and might I recommend the royal blue color? – he calmly said “Wow, I toured the world with this”)… maybe it’s another one of those ‘part of the tradition’ things we Yanks just don’t understand?
But still … I hate that. And thanks for the wisdom, hard-earned as it was. Hopefully it’ll save someone else’s flute today … Meanwhile, I think I’m getting a plastic box! Thanks again …
It seems that Irish players will put tape on their flutes at the slightest provocation. Electric tape, duct tape, whatever color, whatever the reason. The older and more valuable the flute is, the more tape it gets.
Man, that steampacket must have some serious armpits! Sweden is COLD in the winter. Do your fingers ever freeze to the flute? G.
Ni hao ma? No, I live in a flat so it’s enough that the other flats in the building have their heating on. I wouldn’ take a flute outside though in the weather we’re having now, snow all over the place and even with ice tires my Bdub was sliding all over the road this morning at 7 am on the way to work, luckily next to no traffic about. I have to remove the flute from the armpit though in order to play you know
Oops, sorry. I’ve developed a bit of a Murray obsession of late … 
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