CJ Dixon or Uilleann Pipeworks of Boston?

Uilleann Pipes
1

Hi forum,

Newly logged into the forum, hi. Also have the unbelievable fever to learn what I hear is the hardest damn thing to learn, and something I can’t afford. But I’m pretty sure I’m taking the leap anyway. :slight_smile: They sound too sweet not to try.

I was pretty much set on going with C.J. Dixon, but just found Uilleann Pipeworks of Boston. Their price is slightly better (I’m broke); not to mention they come from the old hometown. Both sets sound great in their soundclips…does anyone have an opinion? I’m totally new to piping…but I have read enough to want to get a nice playable set. If I fail trying to learn uilleann piping, I don’t want it to be because I went with a lousy starter set. Please help!

~phil

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I have been very pleased with CJ Dixon’s work.

DJones

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And I was pleased with the sound of the UP of B chanter when I was at the Pipers’ Gathering in August.

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Out of respect for Both makers mentioned I believe any comments or concerns of said makers should be made to Uilleann915 via Private message.

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I agree.

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Lads, if anyone has a legitimate comment on a particular make of pipes it should be OK to post it here. As I said before it seems perfectly OK to have people who don’t know their arse from their tit post glowing comments about pipes here that in reality are dubious at best without anyone raising an eyebrow. For the sake of clarity and fairness it should be possible to raise any legitimate issue here.

Which does not mean I have any issues to raise with any of the makers named in this thread. Just a general remark.

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Here, here.

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That is the trick. How to go about a fair and honest critique without damaging someone’s business or reputation. Not an easy thing to do, as has been notably recorded in past pages of the Uilleann Pipe forum.

I’m not going to disallow critiques which are fair, honest and well researched from well known and experienced pipers with sound arguments to back them up… even if they are negative. But I would caution all who may attempt this that their words are chosen carefully and that what gets posted isn’t defammatory in nature or simply “so and so’s stuff sucks, and they’re cheats”.

I’ll reiterate that I’d prefer that any critique be off-board, but I’ll allow those that conform to board policy.

Here’s a link to what I am referring to, please read it.:


http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?t=28878

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Rather than make specific suggestions on any given maker, allow me relate to something that happened a long time ago. It was at Irish Week at Davis and Elkins College in West Virginia and I had been playing and making pipes for a while. The craik was ninety back then, and the Ice House rang out with tunes till daybreak every night. I was young and strong, playing away on my pipes when I noticed a young gent who was listening intently. He eventually made his way over to me one night and made some nice comments about my playing. We talked for a while, and he told me he was very interested in learning the pipes. An accomplished whistler, he was from a musical family in the North. He had brought with him a practice set, which he showed me, made by a well known gentleman in Ireland. I gave him a handful ofd crappy reeds dug out of the corners of my satchel, and told him that if he was ever in the Washington area to please come and visit. A week or so later he did just that, and ended up staying for a few days. We whiled away the hours at Nanny O’Briens, drinking and playing and became friends. The practice set that he had, I explained, was not satisfactory by any stretch of the imagination, and though I did not want to crush his spirits, I pointed out many of the numerous problems that it had. Now at that time, my shop was a miserable little hovel in a basement, and my lathe, which cost me 70 dollars used, and my 99 dollar Delta drill press were about all the tooling that I had. Undeterred, he asked if I would make him some pipes, which I told him I would not do. Although I had made and sold pipes before, I simply didn’t feel qualified. Before he left, he told me again of his desire to become a piper, and he asked if there was any advice, any advice at all that I could give him. I told him in ernest that he should know beforehand that the pipes are extremely difficult, and there are a million ways to make unpleasant sounds on them. I told him the very best advice I could give him if he sincerely wanted to learn the pipes was to put all of his efforts- every fibre of his being- into obtaining the very best set of pipes there are, and to spare no expense and to choose wisely and happily pay whatever the cost. And i made it clear that his troubles would not end there, and that they would be just beginning, but at least he would have fighting chance. That was Cillian Vallely, and he did get a fine set of pipes, and the next time I saw him, he was piping away in concert at Nanny O’Briens with his brother on conceritna, and he sounded great.

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I understand Joseph but part of my point is that it seems perfectly fine for people to come on and respond to questions about quality of any particular make and say ‘well wow they are great and I’d recommend them to anyone’ without any further backing or a hint as to what they know of pipes if anything. That is damaging to people who stary onto the forums and think ‘ah well so and so’s pipes are great because C&F says so’. While really they may be buying a bunch of totally useless stick that will never work properly.
If someone is indeed flogging instruments that will never tune properly then let it be said and if it damages a reputation or business, well it was really the comment that did it, was it?

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Hear, hear! :swear:

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I do understand Peter’s point but do in fact agree that while people are allowed to sign up an acct for free and come on this board to agree or disagree about a certain makers’ pipes without a shred of substanance, but…it is the ultimate responsibility of the purchaser to do the research themselves, and discern what is accurate.
There is tonnes and tonnes of info. on the internet and this board, true to false of what lies out there about the instrument.

That’s my take. :smiley:

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So what is the criteria for review (this deserves a post of it’s own) that Dale and the forum administrators will permit and agree on?

There are a few things we seem to forget to do here… ESPECIALLY when we talk about newbies coming to the forum and the rest of the experienced pipers who refuse to post here but rather talk about ‘us’ in a negative way…

Hey, I’m new here… who are these 2 companies you are talking about?
(I’m glad you asked)

The websites in question are:
http://www.uilleannpipeworks.com/
For: Uilleann Pipeworks of Boston

http://www.cjdixon.com/
For: C. J. Dixon

(thank you)

To answer Uilleann915’s question:

There is no magic here.
Pipes are (at best) a simple yet complex instrument that frustrates the hell out of many. EXPECT any entry level set of pipes to be just that. Entry level. Less features? Possibly. Notice the word… possibly, something or two an experience piper might not want on a second or third purchase of pipes? Possibly.

It’s normal for someone to ask for the cheapest, quickest obtainable set of pipes on the market. Hey, you are just starting off and you’re asking for the best sound and quality too? Oh…
Part of that is the reed… another part is the piper.
Yes, that very same chanter that makes squeals and noises in your hands makes music in the hands of an experienced piper. This is a fact. Would a more expensive instrument sound better? Sure.

Peter is right to say many bad instruments are sold and re-sold to unsuspecting new pipers. I doubt this will completely stop. Certainly no forum wants to accept responsibility for a ‘hit list’ of certified bad or marginal makers.

This happens at higher levels too. How many times did someone have a good set of pipes and sold them when a ‘better set’ became available, only to their amazement, they preferred the set they just sold. The key word is preffered. Sometimes it’s the feel, or the tone. Maybe a maker has a really quirky personality and you were turned off when you queried having a set made.

Do you want the best right from the start? You might be more frustrated having waited so long and paying so much… you’re still making squeaks and noises. You could go to a tionol, listen to a few different makers pipes being played, get on a ‘preferred’ makers waiting list. Do you want to do this now? Take your pick. Many are 4-7 years wait!

Perhaps entry level is the right choice. Something to get you started. After you have a feel for the instrument you may decide to drop it. Maybe it’s not want you want afterall.


Personal opinion?

Both websites display well for what they offer. I think Dixon has a wider range of options, in the way of woods, chanter styles, drones as an upgrade. Dixon has marketed his product well with the endorsments… Does it make for a better chanter? No. It’s icing on the cake (as they say)
What did I dislike? The sagging back D on the sound sample. Was it the reed? is it the chanter’s design? I couldn’t tell. If I were to order from either maker I would ask for another sound sample.
Many would dispute my request for hearing the pipes over the phone. Sure. Say whatever you want. It’s not an accurate determination. We are talking about entry level pipes here. Yes?

Enjoy your musical journey!

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There are other makers to cinsider as well. One who’s reputation as both maker and player is quite good on these boards (when he’s mentioned) is Pat Sky. You may want to add his offerings to the list of hopefuls.

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…what I hear is the hardest damn thing to learn…

That’s not true. But, like any other instrument , there are only a handful of people who will become the true masters of this instrument over the course of their lives. Still, most who put forth the effort and time can learn to create a pleasing sound out of the Uilleann Pipes.

You must obtain a set worthy of playing, though. It’ll cost ya. Keep in mind that a starter set is just that. you will wish to move up in quality once you get some experience if you decide that you will continue pipering.

Peter Laban is right on the mark.

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Great story that, and the wisdom behind it is sound. Newbies would do well to heed this advice.

Personally, I have no argument agaisnt what you have stated here, and I fully support the sentiment.

I cannot, however, as a moderator allow posts that simply say “crap, shighte, bollox” etc.. etc.. there has to be more, substance, pros, cons and valid arguments.

As a moderator, I can say to those who are newbies among us and are on the hunt for pipes: “Don’t believe everything you read in these forums”. Like Uillmann’s story above, look for the best you can possibly find. The instrument is demanding enough, give yourself a running head start.

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There’s a terrific endorsement of Uilleann Pipeworks of Boston here http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?p=398286

A few months ago I got to play a practice set made by Patrick and Alex. It played staight away right out of the box. Good reed and in tune. The thing I noticed is that the chanter seems a little smaller than normal to me. Not as small as a narrow bore Roberts D though. Just not as large (the feeling of holding it in your hands) as I’ve been use to. But that should not be an issue, esp to a beginner.

Now, back to the mountains! I’m getting ready to put the roof on next week!

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If you truly are “broke”, then perhaps one of these until you can afford the actual pipes:

It beats going into debt and then having to sell the pipes for financial reasons.

Just my tuppence worth.

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Already have a tin whistle by Walton’s…was told it’s a good place to start while you wait for your pipes. BUT…I won a C.J. Dixon chanter on eBay today! Also gonna order bellows/bag. Very excited…the chanter even came with 2 reeds from our very own moderator, Joe Smith! Can’t wait to hear them…but I promise, I’ll blame the hideous sounds on myself as a beginning piper, not on the handiwork of Mr. Dixon or Mr. Smith. Cannot wait to get started. :slight_smile: