Has anyone got any experience of playing a single keyed baroque flute? I’m asking because I’m thinking of getting one and I thought that ther must be someone on here who has some experience -thanks in advance
I do, and several other board members I believe do as well.
My Baroque flute is a low-end Ralph Sweet maple flute, but I do enjoy playing it from time to time.
If you check http://www.flutesite.com/baroque.htm you can find photos and a recording of this flute.
–James
Thanks - now I know I want one - that is beautiful
It’s not a bad flute. I got it in college, years ago.
If I were going to get one now, I’d probably go for one of the polymer Aulos flutes. The Sweet plays pretty well at A=415 but really takes some work for it to sound good at A=440.
Or even better, one day I’d love to have one of these:
http://www.flutes.fsbusiness.co.uk/ordinary.html
Best wishes,
–James
I had an Aulos polymer (the matte finish A=440 version). I thought it was pretty darn good, but I had another keyed flute and really didn’t have a need for another chromatic instrument.
The Stanesby model at A=415 is supposedly even better, but it also costs more.
Eric
There have been a lot of discussions–if you search on
baroque flutes, you’ll find em.
james peeplj,
my understanding is that a one keyed Baroque flute is chromatic because it is responsive to cross fingering on account of the small tone holes and other factors.
This is not my experience with Irish flutes so I guess the Baroque flutes give an advantage if you are after a minimal keyed chromatic instrument?
I woulld appreciate your comment on this and anyone else’s also.
The size of the bore, the very small size of the tone holes, and the small embouchure (which is usually alot rounder than on an Irish flute) all go together with the player’s technique to make it a chromatic flute.
You can’t just blow and finger and have the notes be there, in any octave. This is a kind of flute you continually and lovingly not only adjust into tune with your lips and breath, but also into voicing. The cross-fingered notes will sound very vieled and weak unless the player knows how to bring them out to match with the rest of the notes of the scale.
Baroque flute is challenging to play, and there is nothing preventing you from playing traditional music (or any music) on a Baroque flute even if you wanted to, though I think the tone would be far too mellow and the volume far too small for any but a tiny session.
I have read that the modern Catterall “ordinary flute,” based on the Baroque flute but with changes, is more projective and easier to play. I hope one day to get to try one out. I know Glauber had one for a time, but I don’t know if he still hangs out here?
–James
talsiga - your absolutely correct. Some of the cross fingerings are perfect, others create more of a shaded note but it is in tune (that’s part of the baroque sound). It’s the small tone holes that allow this. So yes, you can be fully chromatic with only one key. However, the higher end baroque flutes are every bit as expensive as many fully keyed irish flutes.
Eric
Yes but there is an appeal in the minimal keyed flute for some.
Thank you both for your comments (peeplj and jayhawk).
Hmm … peeplj’s comments incline me to view the baroque flute as one demanding an AMOROUS approach to playing. The sensitivity comes through in the end product IMO. I recall a comparison of various Irish pieces played by peeplj on his range of flutes and I recall liking the mellow baroque flute rendition the best.
Peeplj, for the benefit of this thread’s initiator, would you care to post audio clips of your baroque flute and an Irish flute of similar value playing the one piece of music? May I tempt you? It is, after all, for a charitable, educational purpose. Hmmm?
Let us make this topic come alive!
Thanks for the tips and advice - keep ‘em coming. I love playing ITM but have started to explore other styles of playing on my eight keyed wooden flute. Since I already play early pipes i thought I’d try an early flute too- the thought of composers writing in different keys to exploit the flutes’ different tones intrigues me. Does anyone know of an online resource for early flute pieces too. I don’t know where’d I’d be without C+F these days - too much useful information to be had! Once again thankyou folks
I will be glad to…what I’ll do instead of posting a link here is just to put them up on flutesite and give a link to the page intstead of to the recordings themselves.
In the meantime, a page you might be interested in, which was mentioned above:
http://www.flutesite.com/comparison_recordings.htm
See “All Instrument Comparison Recordings” just a bit down the page. You have the same reel played on a German 8-key, a M&E 6-key, a M&E R&R model, the Baroque flute, a military fife, a Boehm-system flute, the Hamilton 6-key, an M&E piccolo, and even a Hall crystal flute. There are recordings of the Baroque flute using both corps for A=415 and A=440.
I’ll try to get some specific Baroque-to-Irish comparisons up this weekend on the same page.
–James
By happy coincidence, I had read this thread then went off in the car, surfing for music on the radio, and Vermont Public Radio (which I didn’t even know I could get) was playing a flute concerto by CPE Bach. Didn’t catch the performer–but what a lovely sound. I could hear the attention to shaping each note, or at least I could after reading the description above of what’s required to play the baroque flute.
I got off work early today and got you some recordings on this.
Please see http://chiffboard.mati.ca/viewtopic.php?t=28662
which will in turn direct you to
http://www.flutesite.com/comparison_recordings.htm
–James
The Aulos is the great forgotten FLUTE when people speak about instruments for beginners. Excellent, I repeat, excellent flute. It´s sweet like a whisper or louder than a typical baroque flute, with a very good low register, better than you expect. Perfect intonation and responsiveness, needs minimal care, very good price, nice looking, good weight, it´s one of the easiest flutes I´ve played… and it´s fully chromatic. Anything else? Definitely not only for beginners.
I’m going to buy a Baroque flute in the future, after a web reserch and a lot of questions made at some good flute players I could advise you those links…
http://www.tutz.at/sp_11.php (or only http://www.tutz.at/)
http://www.concertflutes.it/
the first one is very very nice…
Of course Rod Cameron
(Mendocino, USA) is a wonderful maker
Frank
Well I spoke to the guy who made my eight key flute and he’s confident that he can do the business for me so I’m going to go with him - he says he’ll have a prototype for me to try in the new year, and after getting an eight key off him I’mm happy to wait
I’ve played the baroque flute for 15 years (Folkers and Powell, after Thomas Lot). Good ones are often more expensive than ITM flutes. There are a lot of good originals by many good makers in various collections (the Folkers and Powell website is exceptionally informative, with lovely pictures and reliable info). The originals themselves vary a lot in tuning, voicing, projection, so before spending a lot of money, it’s worthwhile having an idea of what you are looking for a in flute. Of course, the modern makers ofen adapt and improve the originals in light of current knowledge, so knwoing that you are buying a “Rottenburgh” is a good indication of the style, but different makers can interpret the flute rather differently. The only two flute makers for which I have direct experience are Rod Cameron and Folkers and Powell, and both of these are fine. So I’d say play them, or listen to skilled performers playing them, to get an idea of the range of tone colours out there.
I have one of the Aulos “Baroque” flutes altered by Rod Cameron which plays well at A415 and A440 (I am using the 440 version now to begin my foray into ITM). That being said, most flutes by good makers are made to play at A=415, and it is very hard to get a baroque flute that plays well at modern pitch. I found this very limiting, and it’s a major reason I am switching to ITM, because it is easier to find people to play with.
It’s true, the baroque flutes are chromatic, but every note is different, and one has to constantly adjust the tuning using embouchure, and rolling the flute in and out. Composers skilfully used the facts that some notes sing out, and some are muffled to create different tone colours in a piece. They have great capacity for shaping and colouring each note. Since there is only one key, most of the notes are cross-fingered. Reality is that the further one is away from the home key of D, the more cross-fingerings there are, and the harder it is to play in tune, and play rapidly. For complex later baroque music where the key signatures can modulate quite far from the nominal key of the piece, it means lots of practice. I quite enjoy playing ITM on my baroque flute, but it is no match volume wise for modern instruments.
I spent the first 2 months tonguing all the time when learning ITM, now I find that when I play baroque music I am slurring too much. The brain adapts relatively quickly to playing different kinds of music on different flutes. If anything, playing ITM has improved my tone on the baroque flute, but it has made me lazy about tuning.
My two cents.
Hugh
Flutefry, welcome to these forums and congratulations on your finely crafted first post with salient points supported by golden experience !
I think your post is a good guide for those of us who play other simple system and simple system derived flutes who may be tempted by the amorous Baroque flutes. I mean that both positively and negatively.
Till we meet again - best wishes and beware the peanut gallery …