Tuning Slide Rogge D chanter??

[bobkeenan]

I just did a trade and picked up a narrow bore D chanter made by Andreas Rogge. Looks good, sounds good. I have a question though. It has a tuning slide built into it. Do all of his chanters have this?

[Hans-Joerg]

Yes. All after ~ 1995.

[ChristianRo]

Yes. All after ~ 1995.

Well, not exactly, Hans-Jörg. Andreas has been offering the tuning slide as an option for many years. But you have to ask for it. My own Rogge D chanter is from 1998 and has no slide, for example.

[geoff wooff]

Moving the reed up and down is akin to shifting the bridge on a fiddle, only on a fiddle it is possible to compensate for those notes in the scale that are displaced slightly by doing this. On a Guitar , having Frets in fixed positions, it is not a viable thing to do and you can relate that to a chanter having fixed note holes as well!

A nice feature in theory, no doubt, but some people would use it to adjust the overal pitch of their chanter when playing with others... ie... the piper comes into a session... finds that the chanter is a wee bit flat ( due to being cold and as yet unplayed today), so the reed is pushed in. A little later on the piper notices that the pipes are getting sharp and thus the reed gets pulled out, usually back to the exact position it was in the first place.

The trouble is that when the reed is moved its relationship to the upper holes is more quickly altered than it is to the lower holes... on a sort of sliding scale..... in simple words ; pushing the reed in will more quickly sharpen the Back D than the bottom D.

So, there is an exact position where a reed will perform best in a chanter and moving it away from that spot will not improve the situation and only effect a compromise to the overal tuning.

Therefore, although a tuning slide for the chanter reed does make finding the best position easier it can also encourage the piper to fiddle with the reed more than is good for it.

[nwhitmer]

I like tuning slides. Assuming the chanter works well with a reed that has tubing for a staple, the ability to easily move the reed up & down in the chanter is an advantage. Both in fitting a new reed and in adapting to changing playing & performance conditions. Wrapping and unwrapping winding at the reed seat can be a real imposition.

If I'm playing with other people and a sliding adjustment is going to be helpful, I'll do it. In unusually dry or unusually humid environments it is sometimes helpful. Then when I return to a normal environment the reed is restored to its usual position.

Nick Whitmer

[bobkeenan]

Ok... Second part of question. What kind of staple? Nick suggested tubing. And I think the rogge reed that came with the chanter is tubing. But it seems to play better with a Brad Angus Reed that came with it which is a rolled tube with a wire rush. the other odd thing is the NPU video that shows Andreas making a reed has specs that show a staple of 5mm OD which would be too big to fit the glued in slide (4.5mm or less would work). And if a rolled staple will work then I could taper the OD of the last half.

I will figure this all out buy making different reeds for this chanter but if anyone has any insight I would love to hear it.

[tompipes]

Keep in mind that most European makers use 5mm tubing and not 3/16" tubing for wide bore D chanters.

NPU video that shows Andreas making a reed has specs that show a staple of 5mm OD which would be too big to fit the glued in slide (4.5mm or less would work).

Yep, you'll need to roll a staple. No idea what size, but there's info about a Hunter narrow bore D chanter a few thread's down. Might work?

4mm tube might work? Look on Amazon for mm tubing.

[Calum Stewart]

It's a really interesting topic, and especially at the moment as a few makers are offering this addition to chanters.

Personally, for what it's worth, I'd agree with Geoff 100%. Keeping in tune at 440, wether in sessions, or at home, recordings or on the road doing concerts can be a joyful experience

I've never used one of these tuning slides on a chanter before, but I know that moving the reed around a lot during concerts for example (with lights etc), for me is really 2nd option. 1st port of call is to rush the chanter. I've made myself a small selection of rushes, going up the whole chanter, and different lengths right down to a tiny rush to flatten only the bottom D. Whilst this takes a bit of getting used to (and I still find myself "automatically" snatching off the reed cap occasionally, to pull out or push in the reed), I personally find it better as it messes around with the intonation of the chanter, a lot less than moving the reed around.

Having said that, rushing also has it's downside. I guess (Geoff I'm sure you will have something to say here!) too much rushing isn't great as it eventually changes the contours of the bore, and also it does change very slightly the timbre of the chanter. For me, more rushes, gives a smoother somewhat rounder sound, whereas just one rush or no rush really lets the chanter open up.

Want to be in tune all the time? Answer is probably to play the flute

[boyd]

Hi Calum

It would be great to see a photo of your rush selection if that were possible

Hope life is treating you and the family well.

Boyd

[Calum Stewart]

Hi Boyd,
Your wish is my command! Coming right up.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... =1&theater

All good Boyd, perhaps catch you for a few tunes at the end of the year? Coming back to Strathspey / Speyside for Christmas.
Calum

[boyd]

Grand job !!
Wow, that's impressive to say the least.
How do you decide between them?
Which are the handiest (most used) ones ?

Boyd

(sorry I missed you last year, I was heading out the door for Brodie when I got new orders from my officer-in-chief which required me to stay at home.)

[Calum Stewart]

It really depends. The medium sized brass one (third from the right) is most commonly in use at the moment, pretty much stays inside the chanter. If I need to flatten even more, then I'll either beef it up by taping one of the rushes without U bend (left hand side), or put a second full (but thinner) rush inside. Depending on which one, or which combination it can flatten to varying degrees. I've never used the tiny brass one as I've never had a problem that means flattening from F sharp down only. The wee D ones are quite handy as they dont mute the sound as paper, tape or devices that cover the bottom hole do. Otherwise there are a couple of other ones in there, just in case - and a couple of lengths of rush ready to be made into whatever size needs be.

The trick is figuring out the right combination, to compensate the humidity or heat, in any given moment, and get the octaves right with the particular reed - and also keeping on top of it, and riding the wave and compensating as you go along. I think I'm getting the hang of it, but there are always surprises that jump out now and again!

[geoff wooff]

Variances in chanter tuning, due to temperature and humidity fluctuations, are caused by the opening and closing of the Reed head, for the most part, as the material reacts to those changes. Therefore it would appear to be incorrect to start altering the chanter to suit the changed reed apperture. However, for the professional piper who needs to arrive at a specific pitch the use of some other controling device is a tempting option.

Rushes and wires will lower the pitch by effectively making the bore smaller , so how would you deal with the need to raise the pitch if your chanter has gone south for the winter ( you are playing outdoors of a summer evening and the temperature is dropping ).... I can see that some would say to keep a wire up your chanter and tune the reed to give you A.440 at 'normal' conditions. This way a rush can be removed when the need to raise the pitch occurs.

Rushes and wires have the most effect on notes in the lower octave, sometimes hardly changing the upper octave notes... now this is ,for the most part, not a problem with their use in regulators, where most people are not interested in obtaining overblown notes. So care needs to be used when shoving things up your chanter bore to check the effect it has on 'all' the notes.

I'm not an advocate of the rush, just as much as I am not in favour of moving reeds up and down. I never use rushes, but then I am a Flat set player who would rarely play with fixed pitch instruments... seeing the Pipes as a solo instrument , or for dueting best with a Fiddler. I try to make my chanters in such a way that they are in tune and voiced with nothing up their hole. One should only need to carefully adjust the Bridle of the reed to suit climatic changes.

Then there are changes to the climate that necessitate the placement of the Pipes in their Box and the lid closed untill the weather improves.

Sponsored by The Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Beautifully made Chanter Reeds!

[mke_mick]

Then there are changes to the climate that necessitate the placement of the Pipes in their Box and the lid closed untill the weather improves.

E.g., importing the instrument to Minnesota.

--Mick