Michael Grinter Flute,

[fsharp]

Hi all,
What's the secret of producing a great tone with a Grinter?
I just purchased the one advertised on the forum, and after footling around with it for a couple of days I realised that it needs to be played loud and hard to really sing! Anybody else with any ideas and experience of Grinters?

[Lars Larry Mór Mott]

Seems like you answered your own question..
Seriously, a more focused embouchure perhaps? I have played 2 Grinters, but i am not qualified to pass judgement, being so fresh at it myself. Sam Murray told me after buying his keyless flute i have now "don't be afraid to push it, they like that!"

[Etruscan]

I played a Grinter (old model) during 8 years, the secret is a very very focused embouchure... and even so I had the impression that you need to blow quite hard to obtain that sound you are referring to. A good idea is to keep the mouth hole in line with the finger holes or just slightly turned in: I found the flute had better tone that way, unlike other flutes which work better and easier with the headjoint turned more toward the player (like my Wilkes). By the way, with my Wilkes it's a different story: it too needs a focused embouchure, but you don't need to blow the hell in it and in fact it gives its best with much less effort. I found my Grinter a very difficult and unforgiving flute: it's a top flute obviously, but it needs to be played THAT way in my opinion, and untill you discover the way it gives you nothing... In any case, what I did is to sell it, it wasn't my cup of tea I think, and now I'm a happier flute player with my Wilkes...

[LorenzoFlute]

I noticed that few of the Grinters I tried require a slightly different approach to what I'm used to, just give it a month or two to adjust your lips.

[Jonathan]

I don't own a Grinter, but I've played a few, and they are brilliant. I don't think playing it "loud and hard" is the answer if your embouchure's not in order. That might give you an approximation of the sound you're looking for in the short term (at the expense of using way too much air), but to really get the power and focus, you need to work on getting a more focused air stream as mentioned above. It's all there, you just have to find it!

[Jonathan]

Got a good chuckle from the Third Policeman reference--Thanks for that!

[fsharp]

"The Workmans Friend"
When things go wrong and will not come right,
Though you do the best you can,
When life looks black as the hour of night -
A pint of plain is your only man.

When money's tight and hard to get
And your horse has also ran,
When all you have is a heap of debt -
A pint of plain is your only man.

When health is bad and your heart feels strange,
And your face is pale and wan,
When doctors say you need a change,
A pint of plain is your only man.

When food is scarce and your larder bare
And no rashers grease your pan,
When hunger grows as your meals are rare -
A pint of plain is your only man.

In time of trouble and lousey strife,
You have still got a darlint plan
You still can turn to a brighter life -
A pint of plain is your only man.

-- Flann O'Brien (Brian O'Nolan)

[Jonathan]

[monkeymonk]

= 5 pints of plain

Now i know why it took me so long to get my embouchure sorted out.

[Akiba]

I've been playing a friend's Grinter here and there, and I don't think it has to do with blowing hard. I think it's more a matter of finding the optimal airstream with the best embouchure/throat opening/air angle--some alchemical amalgam of a myriad of factors. Another point is that Michael McGoldrick is not a hard blower, but gets a great sound out of his Grinter.

[rama]

i had a few grinters. don't overblow - instead focus the airstream - go for quality of tone over loudness. the notes will pop out with just the right amount of air. practice dialing into the sweetspot. in time, it will become second nature. the sound carries more than you realize.

[Ronnie]

I have my Grinter eight keyed flute now for a year. I must go with Lorenzo on this one. They don't need to be blown hard (I regard myself as an intermediate player) but very focused. A friend tried my Grinter out and didn't came to terms with it after blowing it for 30 seconds. He found it not suitable for his taste which I respect BUT it took me six months to get the dark sound. A focused embouchure is the secret here IMHO. I talked to Louise Mulcahy who had also a new Grinter and : presto! she tamed it after a short period of time and she ordered it also right from the shelf. I won't part with mine because its a wonderful flute. Having said this, next to the R&R model Grinter (is it a R &R? I'd like to name it the new model), I play an Olwell, and that went right away into the dark regions of Irish trad (what sound concernslol). These two flutes are not comparable because the Olwell is a Pratten and I found this flute the most easy flute to start playing : what playing-in time concerns. On the other hand I read about people selling their Olwells so I guess it comes down to which flute suits you the best. That why I sold some flutes, they weren't for me and others enjoy them now. In the case of the original post : I would get to know the flute first and then decide if its the one for you. I mentioned earlier on this forum that I am not a big believer in Trying out flutes at sessions for a few minutes or so. You'll have to be a real experienced fluter to judge a flute right away in two minutes. My two cents.....

[Steve Bliven]

......I would get to know the flute first and then decide if its the one for you. I mentioned earlier on this forum that I am not a big believer in Trying out flutes at sessions for a few minutes or so. You'll have to be a real experienced fluter to judge a flute right away in two minutes. My two cents.....

Ronnie - I fully agree that it takes some time to decide whether flute is what you really want. Unfortunately, given lead times and expense, that seems to be pretty hard to do. I'd love for someone to loan me an Olwell or Gallagher for a few months to see if they are "my kinda flute" (hint, hint). But, sadly, that probably won't happen......I'd be happy for just a few minutes.

Best wishes.

Steve

[Ronnie]

Hi Steve, I understand. However when flutes are bought they can be sold with very little loss. That's how I did it. I still believe you can't judge a flute by blowing it a few minutes. But that's me, opinions differ. Of course there is the issue of money, I won't go into details but I find that the most important thing is to end up with a flute that fits your embouchure. I know people who don't care and I respect that too. I only write whatI think. I can be wrong but it worked for me

[tin tin]

Flute shopping is indeed a dilemma when it comes to handcrafted instruments.

When I was still playing classical/Boehm flute, I chose a flute by having three different models sent to me on trial. The one I liked best at first was not the one I ended up purchasing. There was another one that offered immediate rewards as well, but didn't seem to offer much beyond a big, in your face sound. I had to spend the better part of a week focusing on the third one and found it capable of depth, color, and dynamics the other two didn't have. (I also had the assistance of my then flute teacher to assist with the whole process. She was the one who had a hunch about flute #3.) Later I had two more headjoints by that maker sent to me, and I picked the one I liked best.

I went through this selection process after I'd been playing for more than a decade. I don't think there's much sense getting all picky about finding the 'perfect' flute before about the 10 year mark.

So that's an ideal scenario...but not really approachable when ordering directly from a maker. By the way, before the proliferation of professional flute models and flute shops, Boehm flute players were in the same boat we're in--they'd order a Powell or a Haynes, get on the waiting list, and meet the instrument on its terms (which, among other things, meant playing an instrument scaled for A=435 at A=440!).