Cutting D'

[Rhadge]

So, how do you go about when cutting D'?

I use the oxx xxx fingering, because that's what I learned to do from Bill Ochs book.
But, when cutting I get a considerably "lower-sounding" blip than other cuts, probably because the cut is made with Cnat. oxxoxx

[MTGuru]

Use the xxx xxx fingering. Cut with T3 or B1 or B2 (I favor B1).

[Rhadge]

Thought of that too, alas I think xxx xxx doesn't sound as good as oxx xxx.
The transition between octaves seem smoother with the latter.

Maybe I should continue to use oxx xxx, and when I know I'm gonna cut I'll just play a D' pre-emptively with all holes covered... maybe that's what most people do?

[FJohnSharp]

I learned OXXXXX for the second octave D and to cut all my D's with the T-3 finger ( XXOXXX and OXOXXX). Sounds fine to me.

[MTGuru]

Maybe I should continue to use oxx xxx, and when I know I'm gonna cut I'll just play a D' pre-emptively with all holes covered... maybe that's what most people do?

Right. There's nothing sacred about the oxx xxx fingering. Try this: play xxx xxx, then quickly trill the T1 finger. On most whistles, there's no audible difference. Sometimes oxx xxx speaks more easily when approaching it from a different note. So learn to use both fingerings, whichever one gives your fingering a smoother flow.

TMTOWTDI - There's More Than One Way To Do It.

If you must cut on oxx xxx, cut with B3 (oxx xxo). That works better for a mid-cut d{e}d than for an open, initial cut {e}d.

I usually avoid D/d cuts anyway. I find them to be awkward. They're not needed for D rolls, because you cran the D. Instead, I usually substitute what I call the flip: {de}d, {dg}d, etc. - basically a single trill or mordent. It's "punchier" on the lower D. And on the 2nd octave d it's more stable and easier to finger, and can be used with either d fingering.

In general, you can almost always substitute a flip in place of a cut. Think of it as just a variant of the same ornament.

I learned OXXXXX for the second octave D and to cut all my D's with the T-3 finger ( XXOXXX and OXOXXX). Sounds fine to me.

The problem is - as Rhadge said - you're then cutting from below, which sounds quite different from a true cut from above. In the case of oxoxxx {=c}d, the c-(super)nat kind of slides up to the d, and is not nearly as crisp. In the case of xxoxxx, I don't know any whistles on which that cut note is stable. You're either cutting with 1st octave A (4th below), which gives a weird burble, or you're venting the whistle to play 2nd octave a - where the whistle wants to "lock in" and stay there. Too many problems, IMO, when there are multiple better alternatives.

[Rhadge]

Informative as always MTGuru.

I find that the difference between xxx xxx and oxx xxx, is that the airflow is a bit more "pronounced" in the tube, with the former. It probably varies between whistles though.

Your way of cutting indeed gives it a more lower-sounding punch. But I'll stick to lifting T3 though on the lower octave since I've gotten used to it, but it'll probably be a nice addition in the future to my technique repertoire. TAMTOWTDI, was it?

Regarding D', flipping the note worked quite well. Thanks.

[StevieJ]

I rather like the sound of a cut D' with the top hole vented. Micho Russell seemed to, as well

MTG, what is a "flip" - maybe what I describe below?

A nice thing you can do to accentuate a long D' is a kind of rapid trill at the attack of the note: {c#dc#}d. I use T2 and T3 together to do this, which is easier than using the 3rd finger alone:

[| ooo-xxx]
[| oxx-xxx]
[| ooo-xxx]
[| oxx-xxx]

I find this a more punchy alternative to a cran for say, an accented dotted quarter-note/crotchet at the start of a reel. You can omit the first c# for a less fussy-sounding version.

[Rhadge]

That trill thing with T2 T3 is a nice trick.


Anyone has advice regarding performing a cut between a D' and an E'?

[anniemcu]

I find that it does differ between whistles. On my new Overton tenor D, the XXX_XXX gives the clear and accurate note, while the oxx_xxx gives a slightly sharp note. I am relearning some tunes, as I was used to using the alternate, but I really like the fuller sound of the xxx_xxx. On other whistles, I still have to use the 0xx_xxx to get the clearer note.

I tend to use B1 or even B2 for the cut on the lower whistles, and T3 on the high.

NOTE: Any opinion expressed by me as to the authenticity or accurateness of a technique is strictly amateurish and untrustworthy.

[MTGuru]

I rather like the sound of a cut D' with the top hole vented. Micho Russell seemed to, as well

Agreed, actually. I really just want the OP to be able to hear the difference between the two.

A nice thing you can do to accentuate a long D' is a kind of rapid trill at the attack of the note: {c#dc#}d. I use T2 and T3 together to do this, which is easier than using the 3rd finger alone

Nice. I forgot about that one.

MTG, what is a "flip" - maybe what I describe below?

It's just my term of convenience for simply starting the cut on the target note. In other words, instead of e.g. {B}G you play {GB}G. It stands sort of in the same relationship to a simple cut as a condensed long roll stands to a short roll. So maybe "long cut" is a better label.

It happens naturally in descending cuts anyway, if you're a tad lazy coming off of the cutting finger. That is, e.g., instead of B{c}A you get B{Ac}A. The tiny difference in timing gives you an "A flip". And on its own at the start of a phrase {Ac}A it can add some nice definition. My friend Ben Power thinks it perhaps sounds more Northern or Scottish, and I do hear it quite a bit in the fiddling style of, say, Natalie MacMaster, Alasdair Fraser, etc.

[MTGuru]

On my new Overton tenor D, the XXX_XXX gives the clear and accurate note, while the oxx_xxx gives a slightly sharp note.

Hmm, not on mine. The two are identical.

Anyone has advice regarding performing a cut between a D' and an E'?

With d xxx xxx, just cut the e normally. With d oxx xxx there's a lot of awkward finger movement on both hands. Cutting with B1 is probably easiest. But this is another situation to prefer d xxx xxx.

[anniemcu]

On my new Overton tenor D, the XXX_XXX gives the clear and accurate note, while the oxx_xxx gives a slightly sharp note.

Hmm, not on mine. The two are identical.

It's probably me, but there is a noticeable difference. It requires more control and attention than I have been used to paying, but wow! What a gorgeous tone and volume when I get it right.