Any sailors here? Advice please...(revisited)

brewerpaul · Post by **brewerpaul** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 5:45 pm

Years ago I had a Sunfish which I loved. For various reasons I had to get rid of it and have only sailed rental boats a few times since then. However, now I'd love to get back into the sport in a small way. I don't want to spend a lot, so I was considering something used. It needs to be able to be cartopped on a PT Cruiser with a set of Thule rails. My wife and I need to get it up there unassisted. Another option might be a trailer, but the PT won't tow very much weight.
I have a line on a used '86 Sunfish ($900) and and '86 Zuma ($1200-- same owner bought two sailboats that year!).
Any recommendations? How does the Zuma compare to the Sunfish?
Other inexpensive choices? Thanks.

mutepointe · Post by **mutepointe** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 6:02 pm

I only canoe. Will the current owner give you the opporunity to take both boats out with him and trade off at some point in the day? Every boat has it's own character. Until you see how they act and react to you, you'll never know.

springrobin · Post by **springrobin** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:18 am

While I have never sailed a Zuma, I have owned Laser, Sunfish & Minifish sailboats. The only one of these that I cartopped was a Minifish. I doubt I could easily lift a Sunfish to the top of my car even with help. The hull weight of a new Sunfish is around 120 lbs and of a Zuma is 130 lbs. Older Sunfish can be a lot heavier due water trapped in the foam blocks that support the deck so you'll want to lift both boats to see if two of you can handle the weight. Waterlogging might not be an issue with Zumas. Although both boats are advertised as cartoppable, trailering would be my preference and one of these boats on a trailer should be fairly light if the trailer isn't a tank.

As for the difference between the two boats, the Zuma sail goes onto the mast before the mast is stepped. This means you could have issues setting the boat up in a breeze. The Sunfish sail is hoisted after the mast is set into the step so this isn't as much of an issue. The Zuma looks like it could be a faster boat, though. Take a look at the www.teamvanguard.com for specs of these boats.

What is the condition of the boats? Is the gel-coat nice & shiny or is it chalky? Are the hull and deck surfaces smooth or wavy & are there any major dings, repairs, spider-cracks or soft spots? What do the sails look like? The prices of the two boats seem good. If you have photos, I'd be happy to give you my thoughts on them.

chas · Post by **chas** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:50 am

I'm with Robin, I could never lift a Sunfish onto the top of a car.

'way back when, there was a little Sunfish competitor called a Sunflower, which weighed maybe half what a Sunfish weighed. I had a friend who had one, and as might be expected from something so cheap, it didn't handle well at all. I presume you'll be sailing on lakes, so it might be much better there than on the coast.

djm · Post by **djm** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:54 am

My sailing experience has only been with AP dinghies and whalers, but I have always wanted to try a small kat.

djm

MarcusR · Post by **MarcusR** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 2:01 pm

Hi I use to sail one of these in classic racing with my dad, it was made in Stockholm in 1914.

I really wish we hadn't sold it, they are very rare to come by these days.

/MarcusR

JS · Post by JS » Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:35 pm

Paul, I wish I had more to offer than my nostalgia about all the time I spent sailing a Sunfish off my grandfather's place on Lake Ontario. I do remember that it was a chore getting it on and off the car, although two people could do it. (I saw a couple car-topping a small sloop up at Round Lake, not too far from you; it had to be heavier than a Sunny.) Would a trailer be a solution?

If I were going to get back into sailing, here's what I sure would like:

http://www.rfagstore.com/cs/catspaw-dinghy-p29796.html

I'm kind of curious about sailing rigs for canoes. Any info out there?

Beautiful boat, Marcus!

djm · Post by **djm** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 5:58 pm

Rigging a canoe: http://homepages.rya-online.net/ocsguk/ ... _canoe.htm

djm

chas · Post by **chas** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 8:19 pm

MarcusR wrote:Hi I use to sail one of these in classic racing with my dad, it was made in Stockholm in 1914.

Wow. Wow that's lovely.

Kind of makes me think I was wrong about wooden sailboats being no good. When I was about 8, we got a wooden sailboat from a local builder. Problem was, he built rowboats, and the sailboat was basically a 20 foot rowboat with an undersized sail. It took an incredible amount of wind to move the damn thing.

JS · Post by JS » Wed Jan 02, 2008 8:20 pm

Thanks for the canoe rigging info.

brianormond · Post by **brianormond** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:19 pm

-Dad built a "Sailfish" when I was a kid, a plywood equivalent of a Sunfish but without a footwell. A wet ride! Its tough to hold a course straight downwind with one, but fine off the wind. You can likely point higher into the wind with a Bermuda rig, the most common around with sail going to masthead. I'd be tempted by something like a Laser or Laser II or even an old Lightning.

Happy Sailing!

tansy · Post by **tansy** » Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:56 am

you might consider a sailing dinghy, it will be dryer than a Sunfish. Nothin' more miserable than a wet arse, especially this time of the year. I have a 9' Dyre Dhow sailing dinghy that weighs 105 #s. It sails and rows very well. Also consider keeping a small boat at a marina on a hand trailer. Nutshell prams are good little boats, fairly easy to build.
Good luck, Tansy
I am posting this from the cabin on my cruising sailboat "Strayaway", the pipes and heater are a ragein' down below here

brewerpaul · Post by **brewerpaul** » Sat Mar 22, 2008 8:25 am

JS wrote:Paul, I wish I had more to offer than my nostalgia about all the time I spent sailing a Sunfish off my grandfather's place on Lake Ontario. I do remember that it was a chore getting it on and off the car, although two people could do it. (I saw a couple car-topping a small sloop up at Round Lake, not too far from you; it had to be heavier than a Sunny.) Would a trailer be a solution?

If I were going to get back into sailing, here's what I sure would like:

http://www.rfagstore.com/cs/catspaw-dinghy-p29796.html

Beautiful boat, Marcus!

Here's an option that I just thought of last night: building a boat from a kit!
I have very fond memories of the wooden dinghy I learned to sail on back in the early '60s. Turns out it's quite possible to build a nice wooden boat quite inexpensively. I'm currently investigating these:

http://www.shellboats.com/sbboats.html

tansy · Post by **tansy** » Sat Mar 22, 2008 8:55 am

Hi Paul, those kits look like fun to build and sail but, sailboats go pretty cheaply, at least in nawth alabama. For instance last month a pretty clean Catalina 22' with trailer and outboard $2100. There are many buys to be had. Of course there is much fun in building, but a tremendus amount of hard and chemically ridden work(paint, varnish, epoxy, lacquer thinner, etc). I've built 2 small boats and gutted 2 large ones and put in an all new interiors. That took care of my building needs- forever.

springrobin · Post by **springrobin** » Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:59 am

If you build it they will admire it. We had a strip-built canoe for awhile. If I'd been fishing for a man, that boat would have had 'em palming their wedding rings. Not only was it pretty but it was one of the most satisfying boats to paddle- the wood just seemed to blend with quiet lakes, waterfowl and the occasional curious muskrat. If I was alone, I'd take a flute out and play while the wind pushed me down the lake. Surprisingly, it was one of the lightest boats I've owned. If you have a hankering to build, go for it. It will be in a completely different class from a Zuma.