silver simple sytem cylindrical flute by flute makers guild

[david quinn]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/old-henry-potter- ... dZViewItem chesk this out a simple system flute cylindrical by flute makers guild made for H Potter i have had a shot of one of these before very powerful and play all notes very clear.

David

[Loren]

Simple system flute

Loren

[david quinn]

Yes Loren a simple system flute usually has 6 holes and usually 6 keys sometimes 5 depending whether it has the long f natural. In this case this flute is simple fingering with all covered action each hole covered by a key but the same fingering.

David

[Loren]

Ok, I guess we just learned different definitions for "simple system flute" - that's the way it goes sometimes with regards to these things.

Loren

[Chiffed]

"Old System"?

I can buy Brille keys on simple-system, but this is a bit further into the transitional systems, eh?

[Jon C.]

This was competition for the Bohem flute back in the later 19th century. Everyone wanted to get into the new "Improved" flute market! Kind of like watching this last "Star Wars movie",I guess we know who one out...

[Terry McGee]

I'm not that fond of the expression "simple system" (sounds a bit derogatory), but it seems to work and I don't know a better one. "Old system" might work, but these days people might think that means the Boehm! I get customers referring to their Boehm as the "traditional" or "normal" flute.

"Old system" was an expression used by Rudall & Carte to describe flutes that fingered on the 8-key system, and like the Potter David has pointed us to, that didn't necessarily mean they looked simple. They worked simple though - although they had lots of keys, these were not interlocked as they are on the Boehm, for increased functionality. This flute gives the idea - normal 8-key in fingering:



(More at http://www.mcgee-flutes.com/BallBeavon.htm )

If anyone know who bought the Potter, I wouldn't mind a better image of the keywork!

Terry

[Loren]

Ahh, so you're a Dayton C. Milller Collection definition man then Terry.

I'm with Hammy

"Simple System Flute
1/ The head of the flute has a cylindrical bore, but the body tapers towards the foot.
2/ There are six open finger holes giving diatonic scalse in several keys. Other holes controled by keys give the semitones of these scales. (Although there are keyless flutes as well.( see below))

3/ The flute is always made of wood."



Rick Wilson http://www.oldflutes.com/19C-keys.htm (too long to repost here)



And more or less of the rest of early music crowd, who seem by and large to feel simple system flutes end somewhere before the point where all the tone holes of the flute are keyed, particularly when the flute is metal as well, and cylindrical as well.

But hey, like much of this stuff, viewpoints and opinions differ. Damn transitional instruments


Loren

[Congratulations]

3/ The flute is always made of wood."

So does my M+E polymer count?

[C age ing]

Not sure if this is off topic, but i have heard in the dim and distant past, the term 'Albert System'.
Was this the same as simple system?

[Loren]

3/ The flute is always made of wood."

So does my M+E polymer count?

I believe when Hammy wrote that, he was referring to historical flutes, of which the M&E is a modern, copy.


Loren

[I.D.10-t]

I'm not that fond of the expression "simple system" (sounds a bit derogatory)...

I kind of like it. It makes me want to call the others Rube Goldberg flutes.

I can see it now.

Rube Goldberg flutes are a marvel of modern science.
The parabolic head compresses the sound waves that travel down the
cylinder to a vent of almost equal diameter. A mechanism, manipulated
digitally, is used to open and close these vents changing the length that the
sound wave travels. By changing the velocity of the air stream, the standing
node of these sound waves can be altered in such a way that two or more
notes can be played with the same venting scheme. Indeed, this scientifically
designed mechanism allows the flute to play in all keys in near perfect pitch
in an equal tempered scale.

Compare this to the appropriately named simple system flute that uses
holes covered by the fingers of the player to change pitch. This method
of changing the pitch has remained almost completely unchanged since
the times of the Neanderthalsounded a note from the hollowed out bones
of his prey. The holes of this simple flute are neither equal in size nor distance
and appear to be random as if a mollusk had made the holes resulting in
notes that are not equal in volume and colour. Indeed the key mechanism
is such an integral part of the modern flute, that some scholars do
not consider the unkeyed flute a flute at all. The bore of this instrument is equally
random in it's dimensions.

A sub-class of the simple system flute is a higher pitched instrument called a fife,
which many do not even consider a musical instrument.

[talasiga]

3/ The flute is always made of wood."

So does my M+E polymer count?

Not according to that inward looking definition.

BTW, the oldest simple system flutes (as supported by textual and archaelogical evidence) are Chinese dizis , indic bansuris and middle eastern nays. Of these, only the first two are transverse flutes and even these are not covered by that "definition".

[Jayhawk]

I'm not sure I like Hammy's definition, and I'm not sure you totally buy it either Loren.

Any Delrin flute, Clinton's flute for India, and 19th century ebonite flutes (along with Talasiga's flutes which are made of dried grass) wouldn't cut it. What was that polymer flute Hammy made...I'm thinking even he would describe it as simple system.

Eric

[TheSpoonMan]

3/ The flute is always made of wood."

So does my M+E polymer count?

Not according to that inward looking definition.

BTW, the oldest simple system flutes (as supported by textual and archaelogical evidence) are Chinese dizis , indic bansuris and middle eastern nays. Of these, only the first two are transverse flutes and even these are not covered by that "definition".

Yeah... I'd say simple system is just six holes, take 'em off one by one to get diatonic major scale. So that includes irish flutes, that thing up there, tinwhistles, the ones you listed, etc. Maybe with a thumbhole or pinkyhole possible, to include quenas or recorders for instance.