Help!

Flyingcursor · Post by **Flyingcursor** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 3:41 am

Tonight my oldest daughter will ask me how I liked her new short story. She told me it's very important to her that I read it. I read it.

The plot is great. It embodies many of her personality traits I find endearing (and some not so).

However, to put it nicely, the quality of the writing needs a lot of improvement. I don't think she realizes how much a writer "rewrites" their initial draft and thinks that once it's written it's done.

With her self-depreciating personality I know that if I try to offer any constructive ideas she'll interpret that as she's no good at anything and maybe not write again.

I don't know how to answer her and be encouraging so she doesn't get lost in her penchant for self-pity.

avanutria · Post by **avanutria** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 4:02 am

Maybe if you approach the rewriting as "the normal next step" (which it is) she'll be more amenable to the idea.

Something like, "excellent work, my writer! I really like the plot, and you've incorporated your personality well. I'm looking forward to reading the next draft - how many do you think you'll do?"

missy · Post by **missy** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 5:01 am

I'm sorry - Flydood - I don't remember your daughter's age.......

Is there a teacher, mentor, older adult she can send the story to for critiquing? Noah has a teacher from the past two years that has continued to be interested in his writing, and is more than willing to read and critique anything he creates (in fact, Noah sent him a story just 2 days ago). Having an "outsider" is always better than having a parent do it. Especially for the parent!

Father Emmet · Post by **Father Emmet** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:30 am

Don't say anything other than how much you like it. Fostering a love of writing is more important than the quality of this particular story. She will eventually edit and rewrite on her own. Of course should she give an opening, such as 'I wasn't sure about this part', then tell her about drafts and how that's what writers usually do.

avanutria · Post by **avanutria** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:32 am

Good point, Emmet. If she doesn't seem interested in anything other that whether or not he liked reading it, that's all she needs to be told.

Flyingcursor · Post by **Flyingcursor** » Thu Aug 11, 2005 7:35 am

Thanks Ave Missy Emmet and Ave again.

I'll do just that. In fact I see the similarity to this and a post I made on the dulcimer site about my granddaughter.

Great idea.

anniemcu · Post by **anniemcu** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 9:43 pm

I agree with the 'just let her know that you liked it' replies. My 19yo daughter is a budding writer, and the feedback she wants from me is approval... she has friends who are also fledgeling writers to hammer out the rest with. Now, if she comes to you for editing... then you have the chance to offer more.

Good luck to her. Writing is a great thing. Almost as good as reading!

s1m0n · Post by **s1m0n** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 9:51 pm

Speaking as a writer, if you don't like it, STFU. She isn't showing it to you for criticism, whatever she says. She wants approval. Give it to her.

As a general rule, no writer is telling the truth when they show work to a social acquaintance and ask for "honest" criticism. We are all lying.

~~

Your daughter will get feedback enough from strangers. She needs support from you. Be unstinting in your praise.

You don't need to lie (much). Focus your remarks on the parts that work, and completely ignore the problems.

~~~

In fact, feel free to praise her so much that you suggest--and offer tp pay, or whatever--that she join a local writing group or workshop.

Let them give her the instruction you think she needs. You stay out of it.

Jack · Post by **Jack** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 9:55 pm

This is why Emily Dickinson so rarely or never showed her work to other people--because she was afraid of "honest" criticism. I is too.

Mabey buy her a "basics of writing" book or something as a gift, and tell her you hope she reads it all and improves...or something.

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 10:35 pm

She will improve through practice and experience.

It takes time. Criticism won't speed it up much, if any.

Just my $.02, probably worth exactly what you paid to read it.

--James

Lambchop · Post by **Lambchop** » Sat Aug 13, 2005 11:08 pm

She needs your approval for her efforts in writing, not for the quality of the end result. She needs validation of her "writerness," so that she can see that it will be worthwhile to continue.

Nobody's writing doesn't need improvement. We all know that, especially young people. If they could write well already, they wouldn't need to be in school. If we could write well, we'd all have prizes by now.

Think about it this way. If she was riding her bicycle, or playing tennis, or making a salad, would you focus only on a wobble, or on a missed ball, or on irregularities in the cut of the tomatoes? No, of course not. If you did, you'd recognize right away that you were being unnecessarily critical.

When she rode her bicycle for you the first time, or invited you to a tennis match, or made a salad the first time, she sought your approval as a person, not as a bicyclist, a tennis star, or a Cordon Bleu chef.

Closer to home, if she plays a musical instrument for you, do you focus first on telling her everything she did wrong, or do you enjoy the piece because it's your daughter who's playing it and you love the musical nature she is showing? If you focused on what was wrong, you shouldn't be surprised if she never picks up the instrument again.

If you lost your daughter tomorrow, wouldn't you treasure what she wrote today? Of course you would, no matter what the quality of the writing. You'd treasure it because it was a part of her.

Your response to her writing should be based on that -- on the love you have of your daughter and way she expresses herself.

You don't love your daughter because she writes in complete sentences and knows the use of the semicolon. You love her because she's herself and you love her writing nature.

The technical details aren't all that important right now . . . encouragement is. Once she has that, she'll feel comfortable coming to you for advice on technique. Maybe.

When that happens, it's often very effective to praise everything that is done well, even if it's small, and then gradually, over time, make suggestions for ways to do things differently. Not "better," but just "differently," because there are any number of ways to accomplish one end, even though we have our own pet ways and often think our way is the only way. "Here are some more ways to do that same thing."

"I notice you're really using a variety of words. That's very good. Have you heard of a thesaurus? Writers use them to find even more words. Would you like one? They're really fun!"

"You're really expressing a lot of feeling and complex thoughts here. That's really good! Did you know that there are ways of writing things that help express feelings and thoughts? If you'd like me to show you some, I can. Maybe we can go to the bookstore and look for a book on writing. Maybe you'd enjoy that. Writers actually study up on these things! It's amazing, but they do."

I.D.10-t · Post by **I.D.10-t** » Sun Aug 14, 2005 4:00 am

This makes me miss my days of poetry readings. People sharing their poems and the feedback of whether the poem had people quiet and listening, or ignoring me and talking to each other. I guess that finding a writing club could be taken one of two ways, either “He sees potential” or “He thinks that my writing sucks”. I must say that from my experience, most people’s concept of good writing is poor, and that most clubs are not worth while, but a few are helpful. Researching clubs and providing opportunities is the best thing that a relative can do for their related youth.

Poetry readings… … now I am craving a cigarette made with Kuala flavored pipe tobacco and a cappuccino. (my old poetry vices)

Flyingcursor · Post by **Flyingcursor** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:52 am

It went very well. Thanks for the tips.

chattiekathy · Post by **chattiekathy** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 9:49 am

Glad to hear it Flydood!

I didn't have any helpful info to give you, but was awaiting the good results.

Cheers,
Kathy