Newbie question re memorizing tunes...disgruntled oldtimers

Lizzie · Post by **Lizzie** » Fri Mar 15, 2002 10:22 pm

Been playing at the whistle for 7 months now....at this point my biggest problem is memorizing tunes I have learned. If it is a tune I have learned by ear, that is not so hard because I have the tune I know well to guide me. Tunes I have learned by reading the music are much harder. I feel I will never have a repetoire of session tunes, for example. At this point I have a grand total of three of these,
1 jig, 1 polka, 1 air....I mean, how far will that get me?

Any tips to make this task easier? it may be partly my advancing age, but I am far from my dotage.

TIA

ndjr · Post by **ndjr** » Fri Mar 15, 2002 11:01 pm

I usually try to put down the sheet music as soon as I can. As soon as I can get through a couple of measures from memory, I start weaning myself away from it. If I don't, I continue to depend on the printed page, and it just delays the memorization process. Also, I find it difficult to start improvising until I've got it memorized.

I think you will find to a great extent that the more songs you memorize the easier it will get to memorize more of them. It's a skill, like other skills, that improves with practice.

jim_mc · Post by **jim_mc** » Fri Mar 15, 2002 11:06 pm

Here's an idea: Re-learn the tunes by ear. Get a recording of the tune and play along with that instead of the sheet music. Or make a recording of yourself (playing from sheet music), and then play along with that. I don't know if this burns the tunes into your memory faster, or just increases your confidence in your memory of the tune, but I do know that it works!

Jeferson · Post by **Jeferson** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 1:30 am

My question would be, how far along in the tune do you get before you forget? Does your mind blank out at the title?

I have experienced the same problem, and when it happens it occurs when I look at the title and think, "Sheesh, how does this song begin?" This has even happened at public performances a couple of times. I'm up next, and all I can think of at that moment is the title. This is when I look over at the accompanist and tell her to take the first verse

. (Actually, the tune came to me only after I heard her play the intro on piano)

Anyway, after this happened a couple of times I determined to use the following trick: when performing, I make a list of the titles and write the first six or eight notes after each one. For example, "Sally Garden GAB AGA BDE." It looks a bit foreign, but it works for me. Never perform without it.

Call me Linus

Jef

JohnPalmer · Post by **JohnPalmer** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 2:25 am

Hi Lizzy,

I am an old-timer to the board and an old guy--I turned 44 a couple days ago. Anyway, I think that repetition is the key. I know it is boring to stay glued to the music, but I think that by just playing the song over and over for a certain period of time, maybe ten minutes, on a daily basis, a couple things will happen. You might find yourself going over the song in your head while you're just going through your daily routine. That's when you can get some serious work done. And you'll also find that your fingers will gain strength, dexterity, and speed. Whether this works for you or not depends on your perseverance (had to look that word up-- didn't have it memorized). As for songs you have memorized, you do have some, and the number will grow. Also, if you ever get a chance to play some of these songs with other players, you'd be surprised as to how easily your memory brings out the song.

I remember that there was a virtual session website, where the music is displayed, and you can hear it being played by an Irish group. And so you can play along, too. Does anyone know where that site is?

Thanks,
John

AngeloMeola · Post by **AngeloMeola** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 2:36 am

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio2/folk/acoust ... unch.shtml

SteveK · Post by **SteveK** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 3:19 am

Chris Smith has some instructional material, including learning by ear, at

http://www.geocities.com/coyotebanjo/instruction/

There should be a couple of other helpful articles there too. Chris writes sensible stuff.

Steve

aderyn_du · Post by **aderyn_du** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 7:28 am

I know a lot of people here dislike the use of sheet music, but having played clarinet for most of my life has me predisposed to it. :

: I approach memorizing my whistle music the same way I did for clarinet... I play a few bars over and over again, until I can play it sans sheet music, then off to the next few bars. When I have the next few memorized, I go back and attach them to the first few... so on and so on. It helps me get my fingering down too. Once I've got the whole thing memorized I go back and work on the feeling and the heart.

Just my two pence,
Andrea ~*~

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: aderyn_cyrdd on 2002-03-16 08:30 ]</font>

TelegramSam · Post by **TelegramSam** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 8:29 am

here's a hint: Don 't try to memorize the whole tune at once. Break it up and learn it by bits.

Same goes for memorizing pretty much anything. I've had to memorize poems and such for school, and they only way to do it is to break it up line by line. The same holds true for music.

Bloomfield · Post by **Bloomfield** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 8:55 am

Start by lilting (singing the tune). Do that until you can do it without the sheet music. You may have to teach yourself to lilt it with you whistle, but it's better not to skip this step.

Then understand the tune. Many sections of dance tunes are broken up into 4 phrases of two measures each, that go Call-Answer 1, Call-Answer 2.

Now start learning the phrases. Start at the end of each section (Answer 2) and work backward. (I know that is a bit weird, but someone suggested here on the Board and it works.)

Make sure to practice the transitions: From the end of a part to the beginning, from the end of the tune the the top (and try not to breathe there).

Learning more than two tunes a week is going to be very tough. I am not a raw beginner, but I am at best intermediate, with less than 50 tunes under my belt. To learn a tune from having heard it a lot to being able start it and maintain it at the session, over noises, different versions, and rushing bodhran players takes me at least 8 hours practice, often more.

While you are impatient to build your repertoire, go to sessions a lot to listen. That is a way of memorizing tunes, too.

Kendra · Post by **Kendra** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 9:57 am

One thing that helps me memorize is to recognize patterns in the tunes. For instance, I am currently working on "The Star of the County Down" and the whole song is based on, basically, two patterns with variations at the end of each. It goes: Pattern 1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 1. As soon as I realized that, the memory process became much easier - I just learned the two patterns and the variations for each.

I can't begin to start memorizing until I can play the song up to speed, and I can't even find the patterns until I do that.

I've been playing the whistle now for only about a month and a half (I played recorders for years, though, years ago), and I have two whole tunes memorized, which I think is pretty good and is much better than I did with the recorders. One of the tunes is memorized so well that I can really play with it (improvise) without having to think about "what comes next."

I've found that the more I play the two memorized tunes, they get better and better and makes learning the next tune easier. So I start each practice session playing them two or three times each, again in the middle of the session, and then at the end for confidence

Captain Dilettante · Post by **Captain Dilettante** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 10:07 am

If my experience has been any indication, do <b>not</b> ask your spouse/children/parent/pet if you've "improved" from repeated practice of a specific tune. After they've heard it every day for a month, squeaks and all, they won't care if your latest repetition sounds like Joanie Madden or John Madden.

I'm a big fan of the "sing it/lilt it" crowd. You need to translate sheet music from the "read this logically" part of your brain to the "feel this artistry" part. Once you've both read and heard the tune, you have two parts of your brain working on the same problem. At that point, all you have to do is convince the other parts (like the one that controls the fiddly bits at the ends of your hands) to play along. (I'm sure there are really long 4-syllable names for all these brain parts, but I didn't do so well in Psychology class.)

As the saying goes, "I don't know that tune, but if you hum a few bars, I can fake it".

Chuck_Clark · Post by **Chuck_Clark** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 10:56 am

Bloomfield's idea of first learning to sing the song works fine for some - except those of us whose singing voices frighten children, alarm dogs and curdle milk.

For those of that ilk, just keep playing the tunes over and over. It may take weeks, but at some point you stop and think, "wow, how'd I ever learn all this stuff?" I almost never lack a whistle - in the car, walking the dogs, sitting at the computer, even one by the bed for insomnia. Even just a few bars, played a couple of times while stopped for a light, add to the eventual goal of learning the tunes.

Eldarion · Post by **Eldarion** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 8:12 pm

Just to say that I agree with Bloomfield's advice. I also think it is better to learn tunes by ear because I find you'll absorb more details and etc - hardcore listeners will be able to tell the difference when they hear you play. And like you say, you remember the tunes better if you learn them by ear. The skill may take some time to aquire but its very very worth it.

If you're not the lilting/singing type you can always hum or duplicate the tune in your head. Listening more is important too.

nickb · Post by **nickb** » Sat Mar 16, 2002 10:34 pm

Hi. I'm an oldie, but I've still got lots of gruntle so here goes. Try practising new tunes to a metronome. It not only helps with the rhythm, but I find it improves the memorising of the tune.