All that jazz?

mdutr0 · Post by **mdutr0** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:22 pm

Those of you who know me, which aren't very many I would think, know that I don't exactly play the whistle in the traditional fashion. Normally, I play in a praise band at my college in New York where my duties are more like that of a saxaphone player than anything else (no melody to speak of, mainly free improv). This is easy since many praise songs are in the keys of D, G, A, and E (I kinda have to fake E on my Shaw A).

Now, I'm considering trying to get together a group of jazz musicians....
Something fairly simple a guitar or piano player, a bass, and me on the whistle!

Which key of whistle do you think would be useful to acquire? So far, I have whistles in D, A, and C.....

Thanks,

Micah

P.S. - For the nay-sayers go and check out clips and snips in the misc. section - look for "Sing Like the Saved" and my name

glauber · Post by **glauber** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:26 pm

This is kinda funny. You're going to put together a jazz band but you don't want what keys you're going to be playing in?

mdutr0 · Post by **mdutr0** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:37 pm

Well no, not really. This idea is in its extremely initial stages. The only other person i've even talked about it with is the guy I recorded the thing on snips and clips with. He thought it was an interesting idea, so I thought I'd bounce it off the community. I know that there can be some resistence around here sometimes to some of the non-trad stuff, but I've read many posts from many people and know that you are a relatively open-minded group.

The whistle may not exactly lend itself to many of the jazz standards. It's gonna be kind of an experiment anyway and we may find that it's easier to write our own stuff. I may not have been playing the whistle as long as many here, but I've been a musician for 12 years now. I've never played an instrument that seemed to lend itself more to improvisation. I can't help but feel that not to seize the opportunity to give it a whirl would be a waste.

Is it entirely thought through yet? No, of course not. That's part of the reason I'm asking the community for their opinions, and additional keys that might be useful to me in such an endeavor is a part of that.

Sorry, didn't mean to preach

Micah

michael_coleman · Post by **michael_coleman** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:52 pm

I'd say get a jazz fake book first and see what kind of keys you guys will be playing in and go from there. True jazz has a lot of accidentals so the whistle might not be the best thing to play jazz on (unless you are amazing at half holing at great speeds), Irish flute with keys might be a better idea.

Or you could play tunes without as many accidentals like Irishmusic with a kind of jazz feel, check out Phil Hardy http://www.kerrywhistles.com he has a few cd's and has that bent, as well as Flook.

Best....

emmline · Post by **emmline** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 6:42 pm

I listened to those clips...they were superlative! I love the whistle as a jazz instrument, but I know that ain't traditional!

IDAwHOa · Post by **IDAwHOa** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 9:35 pm

If you send Phil an email and ask for the Whistleworks CD he will (or at least he has done so) send it to you for free. I thoroughly enjoy mine.

mdutr0 · Post by **mdutr0** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:09 pm

Jazz does have a lot of accidentals, which is why I would be interested in original compositions possibly. Modal jazz might be doable as well.

That's the great thing about jazz: there are so many different kinds and so much space for new stuff!

Thanks,

Micah

Jack · Post by **Jack** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:57 pm

Isn't the word jazz itself an Irish word?

Wombat · Post by **Wombat** » Thu Dec 04, 2003 11:11 pm

mdutr0 wrote:Jazz does have a lot of accidentals, which is why I would be interested in original compositions possibly. Modal jazz might be doable as well.

That's the great thing about jazz: there are so many different kinds and so much space for new stuff!

I play jazz on whistle. I have to be careful to select the right kind of tune. Blues is very doable. You will find the five finger starts and two finger starts the best for blues, E and A on a D whistle. which you choose depends on where you want easy accidentals. If you want to play both major and minor third a lot, the two hole start is easier. If you want flattened fifths more often, the five hole start is easier.

Good styles of modern jazz to listen to for tunes would be any folksy kind of jazz: Jimmy Guiffre trio Atlantic recordings, Chico Hamilton quartet in the Charles Lloyd/Gabor Szabo days, Herbie Mann, Abdullah Ibrahim, part 4 of Coltrane's A Love Supreme. Modal jazz is straightforward on any single mode piece but might require quick changes of whistle if the mode changes a lot.

Key shouldn't be a major problem with the instrumentation you describe. Piano, guitar and bass should be able to play in any key. You'll get a preference for keys like Eb and Bb if you start playing with trumpet and saxophone players.

You would also find one of Daniel Bingamon's Ahava Raba whistles very useful—you could play Coltrane's Ole.

Zubivka · Post by **Zubivka** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 2:33 am

To chime in with Wombat: better select carefully what you'll be playing.
Even some of the simplest standards are so full of accidentals you'll wish to find a chromatic instrument.

This is why I wait so eagerly for my fully-keyed whistle(s). No need to tell they will be slower for ornaments, but that kind of music hardly takes rolls...
And I'm even not sure about this slowness ( <--- izzis correct? ) : cross-fingerings and half-holings do take time, too...

mdutr0 · Post by **mdutr0** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 8:51 am

What is an Ahava Raba whistle?

I've never heard of that....

Thanks,

Micah

Wombat · Post by **Wombat** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 9:50 am

An Ahava Raba is a whistle in a mode commonly used in Arabic and Jewish music. It's most distinctive feature is a jump from minor second to a major third which gives a very unusual 'Oriental' sound to mainly classically trained European ears. You can't get that scale easily on any standard whistle no matter which note you start on.

riasgt · Post by **riasgt** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 10:51 am

I can't remember the whistle maker, but someone out there does make a chromatic whistle. Does anyone know anything about them?

Bloomfield · Post by **Bloomfield** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 10:58 am

riasgt wrote:I can't remember the whistle maker, but someone out there does make a chromatic whistle. Does anyone know anything about them?

Aren't those called recorders?

Tching-boom. Thank you, thank you. I'll be back next week, same time, same place. Please don't forget to tip our lovely waitress. And the other one, too.

tuaz · Post by **tuaz** » Fri Dec 05, 2003 11:31 am

mdutr0 wrote:... Now, I'm considering trying to get together a group of jazz musicians....
Something fairly simple a guitar or piano player, a bass, and me on the whistle!

Which key of whistle do you think would be useful to acquire? So far, I have whistles in D, A, and C.....

Thanks,

Micah

...

Get them in any many keys as possible/you can afford. If the stuff you're doing has many key changes, or changes to an inconvenient key on the current whistle being played, you'll need to switch. Get whistles in keys that are hard to play with your current A, D and C whistles.

At least get Eb/Bb whistles, since these 2 keys are troublesome to do on the C/D whistles (though not impossible for slower pieces). And like Wombat says, sax players are happy to play in Eb/Bb.

And...oh! They also like to play in F, and while you can play F on a C whistle, your whistle part's going to be really high, so why not a low F as well ? My Overton low F can be played pretty funkily....

...and, um, since you have a guitarist, you might also want to get an E, since E appears to be a popular key for guitarists. Why not a low E? I've never tried an Overton low E, but if it's anything like the low F....

...and, hey, what about a B whistle?

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All that jazz?

All that jazz?

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