Getting conical

[genau]

I suppose it will be an obvious subject for many of you,but not for me.
Could anyone tell me the real effect in the sound of a conical flute and the advantages it represent instead of the cilyndrical bodies.
Thanks a lot.

[dcopley]

The high notes on a cylindrical flute will be flat. Also, if it is a "D" flute, the stretch between the lower two tone holes is uncomfortably long. A Boehm flute has a cylindrical body and a tapered head joint. This corrects the problem of the flat high notes, and the stretch between the holes is solved by using keys. The conical bore of a simple system flute also corrects the tuning problem, and it allows the two lower holes to be spaced closer together.

Dave Copley
Loveland, Ohio

[Gordon]

Conical isn't better, or worse, really, if you're talking modern (Boehm) flutes versus conical classical-based flutes, or Baroque flutes. It's just different. Originally, making flutes conical enhanced intonation from the earlier cylindrical flutes and fifes from the bottom octave to the 2nd and even third octave, and was a great improvement in sound overall -- this was true in recorders as well, going from cylindrical to conical. The head-joint of these flutes were/are cylindrical. Boehm returned to the cylindrical bore body, but made the head joint conical -- same effect, re intonation, but cylindrical worked better with his key system, and the Boehm is efficient up through the 3rd octave.
Then there's the sound difference between these two systems, sonically. It is simply different, not better or worse, and well-made flutes of either sort create very wonderful, well-intoned music.
Irish music is generally played on classical-based, conical wooden flutes, further tweaked to get sounds that, with proper embouchure, is recognized as "Irish." These flutes are also quite capable of playing other musical genres (since it evolved for/during the classical period), as is the Boehm for a variety of musical forms.
I believe there is a recognizable difference in sound from Boehm-based flutes and those conical body flutes, but -- if played very well -- these differences will be minimized to the point of insignificance. Ornamentations played on an open-holed vs. the Boehm keyboard is yet another issue at play, but has nothing to do with the bore.

Oh, I added this before Dave Copley jumped in -- his answer is certainly more concise, and accurate. If the original question is about truly cylindrical flutes (no taper in the head or body), then Dave answered your question completely.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Gordon on 2003-02-25 21:10 ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Gordon on 2003-02-25 21:13 ]</font>

[genau]

Thanks guys.
Actually I was talking about related irish flutes.I´ve got a couple of those called student flutes, wich in fact are only aluminium or whatever cylindrical pipes.
Also I´ve got a susato Low whistle(All in D)but in any case I think that the upper octave notes sound in the right tuning and my hands feel confortable when I play them,so thinking about"upgrading"to a true irish flute,I was wondering about the real difference and if it was worth the expense-excuse my english-.having that on mind,Why low whistles are cylindrical(most of them).
Thanks a lot

[SuiZen]

The third octave tuning is better on conical.

Bill

[genau]

Yeah, but I can hardly remember any irish flute performance in wich the musician goes up to the third octave, so Why is it used??

[Gordon]

The upper 2nd octave may be off a bit as well, and there are Irish tunes that go to about the 3rd D. Generally, the sound of a conical is more consistent throughout the range, and there is a nice compression of sound that a cylindrical flute, without a conical head, can't match. Depending on what your demands are, though, cylindricals, such as a good cane flute, are fine enough; not as good as a well-made conical, but, as they say, close enough for rock n' roll, um, Irish music.

[genau]

so do you think that a cylindrical flute with a conical head should have more or less the same advantages that those of a conical flute??

[Gordon]

On 2003-03-02 15:28, genau wrote:
so do you think that a cylindrical flute with a conical head should have more or less the same advantages that those of a conical flute??

Yes, pretty much, but I'm not sure I'm comfortable with the idea of the word "advantage."
What you are describing, in effect, is a Boehm flute (conical head, cylindrical body), so unless you are talking some other hybrid I can't comment on, you're comparing a Boehm to a conical flute.
Not getting into the key systems, and assuming we're talking the best of both types, the Boehm has more advantages in terms of playing evenly into the third octave, and has very good intonation all the way to the third C. Conicals generally give up around the third E, and definitely by A, and those are usually not great-sounding notes. So, if range is a big issue, the Boehm has the greater range.
The Boehm was also engineered for a uniformity of tone colors throughout all three octave, note to note. Now, whether this is an advantage is a subjective issue, fought throughout flute history, and it has more to do with preferred trends than which is better. The varying tone colors of a simple system conical flute are, to my ear, nicer and are generally cherished by players of wooden conicals playing trad or early music. But I can't really say whether a good Boehm or a good conical wooden flute is better, as ultimately they are simply different sorts of flutes.
The original question was about simple system D flutes (6 holed flutes) that are cylindrical as opposed to conical. The conical system is better intoned and easier physically to play in low pitches because of hole spacing. Depending on what you're using the flute for and how demanding you are about pitch and octave range, none of this may matter much.

[genau]

Thanks a lot.You´ve been a great help.