Amazing Grace

[MTGuru]

I found our lost sheep! It's Lamb [singular], not Lambs.



^ Click for source page ^

Is this like Händel's "All We Like Sheep"? Yes, I am loving lamb ... with a bit of mint sauce.

[benhall.1]

St Mary's, Gallaher and Harmony Grove look like the same tune as is commonly used for AG to me. Loving Lamb looks just a bit different - doesn't seem to have some of the typical features. Don;t know what others think ... ?

[MTGuru]

Well, I'd say that Little Lamb satisfies my own smell test for basic tune identity.

What's interesting is that if you reverse the halves of the second repetition of the tune, you basically get the Judy Collins version of Amazing Grace. In other words, instead of playing A1-(1st ending)-A1-(2nd ending), do A1-(1st ending)-(2nd ending)[GF]-A1 ... with the added G and F to fill in the cadence, and a few other adjustments.

[s1m0n]

Liking the tune and realising that (unlike most hymns) the tune fit perfectly onto the scale of the Scottish pipes, the bandmaster wrote an arrangement for pipes & drums and military band. The album featuring this arrangement, called Farewell to the Greys, came out in 1971. The single sold over 30,000 copies and was No 1 on the British pop charts for six weeks. It was one of the biggest instrumental hits of all time, sales estimated to have topped 12 million worldwide..

I grew up with a copy, and then a while back I was flipping through old vinyl in some used record store and found another. For 3 bucks I figured it's worth having, cuz I don't know what happened to the one at my folks.

[pancelticpiper]

Thanks MT for looking up and sharing that stuff. I suppose we all now, having read this thread, know about as much as anyone will ever know about the origins of the tune family Loving Lamb/NEW BRITAIN.

By the way, it is common in hymnody for tune names to be a place-name somehow associated with the tune, and NEW BRITAIN seems to fit that trend.

About the differences between the Judy Collins/RSDG melody and the usual hymnal melody, they are enough to make the playing of the two simultaneously not work well. Many's the piper and congregation who have discovered this the hard way. I suppose they do sort of harmonise in places.

It's more than just the notes: the overall feel is different, the hymnal version being faster and more foursquare and the JC/RSDG version being slower, rounded, and lilting.
The hymnal version is usually sung in strict time while the JC/RSDG version is usually/often played with the third beat of each bar elongated.
(I once heard a professional "legit" musician who had recently taken up the GHB defend his playing of AG, when criticised by an experienced piper: "I played it in strict 3/4 time!" "That's the problem!" the experienced piper answered.)

The JC/RSDG version has had an influence on the church music world and I have come across recent church choir arrangements that use it rather than the traditional hymnal melody. (One is a horrid thing where they try to turn AG into a canon or round.)

[A-Musing]

Wow. Thanks, everyone, for such info!

For meditational/slow-speed/"internal-meadow" types..."Amazing Grace" can be a strong base for thoughtful variations-on-a-theme.

Now. Thanks to you, as I enjoy this way of playing, there'll be more "internal-meadow-happenings" flowing through my A-Mused little mind.

I'm glad, to have found the Whistle, and this place!

[MTGuru]

A few other AG lookalikes ...

o NEW PROSPECT / Land of Rest. This appears in The Sacred Harp (1844) and others. If the Loving Lamb tune is a folk tune Ur-source, this seems like another derivative. Nice organ setting on YouTube.

o Swing Low, Sweet Chariot. Closely follows NEW PROSPECT. Again raises the interesting question of African-American connections with AG/NEW BRITAIN. Swing Low has a documented history - see Wikipedia and here. But given the chronology, the "composition" of the song attributed to Wallace Willis between 1849-69 is likely based on either the hymn or the Ur-source.

o Delta Dawn! The country-pop hit for Tanya Tucker (1972) and Helen Reddy (1973). "Written" by Larry Collins, but the chorus is clearly based on AG or one of the hymns. A 13-year old Tanya performs her breakthrough hit on Hee-Haw here.

There may be more, but I'd better quit before my atheist circuits are completely overloaded.

[Denny]

A 13-year old Tanya performs her breakthrough hit on Hee-Haw here.

oh, yeah! Someone makes sure that Nano hears that one!

(vague reference to vibrato, mentioned in some thread.....somewhere most likely on this board)

[caedmon]

I love the internet! One little post about the first song I learned on whistle turns into a history lesson lotsa cool information.

[Daniel_Bingamon]

To go even further back, the tune to Amazing Grace was really African!
I read a biography of John Newton, who was the son of a British Navy commander. He was absolutely without any redeeming qualities, and after much trouble in the Navy he was transferred at his own request to serve on a slave ship. In time he was captain of his own slave ship. As he was crossing the ocean with a hold full of slaves, stored side by side on what amounted to shelves (the death rate was high) he heard, from his cabin, all the slaves humming this tune in unison. He recognized it as a tune of mourning or plea for help. It deeply affected him.........

There's a good movie about this called "Amazing Grace" that is about the ending of slavery of England from the commitment of William Wilburforce.

Also, a version of Amazing Grace was sang on the Trail of Tears by the Cherokee.

The Jewish tune of Adon Olam (Lord of the Universe) is compatible with Amazing Grace.

[benhall.1]

I'm actually in the movie Amazing Grace. I'm the second violin in the string quartet on the ship.

[Daniel_Bingamon]

I remember that scene. I'll have to look for you next time I watch.

[boomerang]

Try singing the words of amazing grace to the tune "the house of the rising sun" works surprisingly well. its a bit of a head bender, but good fun
Regards
David

[Sandy McLeod]

Some years ago Bill Moyers did a special on the song on PBS. I think the DVD is still available in their catalog. As I recall it was quite good with examples from many of the different musical forms mentioned above as well as others.

Sandy