Looking for Praise and Worship songs

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dryer
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by dryer »

markbell wrote:
dryer wrote:I'm amazed by the responses this question received! I thought I was alone here. :D
Ah, then ya haven't spent much time over on PWA, I'd have to guess. I thought the same, before my own enlightenment, and discovering a network of garden-level (that is, semi-underground) folks who like to whistle in church.
Wow!....uh,.... and all this time I had myself convinced I was forging new ground in church music technology.
:lol: :lol:
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markbell
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by markbell »

There's even a notable contingent of Texans on the board. Be sure to join and give a shout out!
sibilo ergo sum
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by TheSpoonMan »

markbell wrote:There's even a notable contingent of Texans on the board. Be sure to join and give a shout out!
It's our deep, dark secret. Don't let him on too early!
dryer
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by dryer »

TheSpoonMan wrote:
markbell wrote:There's even a notable contingent of Texans on the board. Be sure to join and give a shout out!
It's our deep, dark secret. Don't let him on too early!
To late. I've joined. :devil:
TheSpoonMan
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by TheSpoonMan »

dryer wrote:
TheSpoonMan wrote:
markbell wrote:There's even a notable contingent of Texans on the board. Be sure to join and give a shout out!
It's our deep, dark secret. Don't let him on too early!
To late. I've joined. :devil:
Well in that case I'll head on over to welcome you :D
Tommy
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by Tommy »

violinmyster wrote:Anyone know of any good praise and worship music available for high D whistles?
I have found some on Whistle and Squeak and was wondering if there were any other sites.
Hi VM, have you been to http://www.tinwhistler.com ?
click on the tunes,
click on tunes sorted by type,
click on religious & Christmas carols,
click on Amazing Grace in G.
This is a very good version to play on whistle with triplets. I have played on two praise teams for several years and in one group there is a piano player, clarinet, and myself on whistle. I was hesitant to play with a clarinet player remembering them in high school as being screechy instruments. But when we play harmony the music blends to something new.
The piano player has degrees in music with over thirty years experience. When we put a hymn together that goes out of the range of the whistle she is able in a moment to find another note in the chord that works. The other group is a contemporary with guitars, keyboard, and vocals. The whistle is very good for playing the refrain part of a hymn. Or the melody. Whistle all the way through is not that good unless your playing an instrumental. It is not good to play in the key of D when the congregation sings. It is to high for them. But the vocals in a contemporary group should be able. One of the hardest parts of playing whistle with the groups is trying to convince the directors to print the whistle part in the Key of D and then I will play what ever key they want with a different whistle letting the whistle do the transposing. I have not seen music just for whistle so you play the melody line. Whistling in praise music is like a good food seasoning. To much is to much. But you will also want to offer a solo now, and then on the low whistle.
''Whistles of Wood'', cpvc and brass. viewtopic.php?f=1&t=69086
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mutepointe
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by mutepointe »

I don't think any of us are treading new ground. I was hoping to be the first person to play a harmonica at a Catholica Mass but the nun who gave me her flute said she'd seeen it done before. I played my new ocarina last week. I got a concertina last year for Christmas. I sound too much like a pirate and have only played this at practice with the folk group. If anyone knows of any Catholic hymns that need a pirate's touch, please let me know.
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sackbut
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by sackbut »

Why only a high D whistle?
Where folk music (not only Irish) gives you relatively few keys, that you can mostly handle on the high D with C as a back-up, church music uses any and every key, so you need more whistles.
Folk music gives you almost nothing for the E flat whistle (why do Gen still make it?) but pick up a hymn book, and you can rip into 'How marvellous, how wonderful' or relax with 'Oh the deep deep love'.
Any hymn book will give at least some arrangements that double as four-part harmony, so you have three harmony lines you can play, if you don't want the lead.

Having said all that, for high D 'Thou who wast born beyond all splendour' sounds gorgeous on a Clarke Original - start practising now for next Christmas!
Or try 'A Debtor to mercy alone'.
dryer
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by dryer »

church music uses any and every key, so you need more whistles.
One of the handiest things I own is a 3 whistle Susato set. D, C, Bb. That covers most songs and my keyed flute covers the rest. Most of the old favorites and praise music are in G or D, thankfully. Interestingly.....it's the youth that come up with most of the praise songs, and droney G/C is the first and easiest thing they learn on guitar. A whistle can give those tunes some life. :)

Ever notice that the 3/4 and 6/8 hymns have a suspicious link to Celtic jigs? Play 'em fast and they are downright snappy! Go figger... :D
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hoopy mike
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by hoopy mike »

mutepointe wrote:If anyone knows of any Catholic hymns that need a pirate's touch, please let me know.
How about Aaarrrhhh vey Maria?
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by MaryC »

TheSpoonMan wrote:I agree that if a church can afford it, CCLI is great. Especially if you get the lead sheets/chord sheets. (my own opinions on Christian music copyrights set aside... heh heh heh)
If a church can afford it AND if that church is not "liturgical". If it is traditional (eg Catholic) church using hymns (not juse P&W) material by the folk/contemporary composers of the last 30 years, then one of the other companies should be used, because CCLI doesn't cover much of this (for example, the St Louis "jesuits", much Marty Haugen and Bernadette Farrell).

Those who are interested may like to read through this blurb that I've written and used elsewhere (warning, it's kinda long, those who aren't interested, tune out now!).

NB a later post said: "making tapes was legal, but now we want to make CDs and it's not" - sorry, you just didn't know that the tapes were illegal. If CDs are illegal (without appropriate licencing) in your country, then so are tapes, DVDs, etc etc etc.


***

There is an international convention, implemented in many countrys' copyright law, that allows any piece of music to be performed within a worship service without any copyright considerations or performance licensing needed.

However this only applies within the service: if music is used (either live or canned) before or after the service, or piped into the foyer, or played at the wedding reception in the hall (etc) then the VENUE needs an appropriate performance licence. These can be purchased from Performing Rights Organisations (PROs) like APRA (Australasian Performing Rights Association), BMI, ASCAP etc.

Commercial use (eg performing pieces at a public concert for which tickets are sold) requires yet another type of performance licence. This must be secured for each performance, but is generally also handled by the PROs.

Also, churches usually want their congregation join in the songs. If everyone knows the lyrics and tune, then it's just a big "performance". But typically they don't, so the church needs to show the words, and maybe the notation. Previously churches purchased hymn books, so the publishers sorted out copyright and the fee was included in the price. But when technology provided cheapish photocopying, overhead projectors and then data-projectors, churches started showing words and sometimes notation, without having a book for each person. Initially, they were breaking the law, so publishers complained and perhaps even sued.

Enter CCLI, and subsequently other church copyright organisations (CCO's). For a modest annual fee, you don't need to deal with the administrative and financial nightmare of copyright compliance--for printed copies. Instead, the CCO negotiate's with copyright owners for the right to represent them.

The best marketed CCO is, CCLI a privately owned company founded in the US in 1988, which focusses on the needs of the evangelical/pentecostal/praise-and-worship type churches. But there are others, eg Word of Life in Australisia, which focus on the needs of the more liturgical/traditional churches, and OneLicence which is an off-shoot of GIA Publiciations.

Churches buy licences from CCO's that which allow projection of words/notation, and photocopying music (provided a minimum number of copies have been purchased). Typically one of the conditions is a return saying which song-words etc were displayed, how often and/or how many people were there, and these returns are used to calculate payments to composers and publishers.

However, there are still some things that some churches do that aren't covered by most of the common licences, including CCLI. Basically, if your church does anything more than just singing the songs on Sunday, you'll need additional licenses: mechanical licenses if your services are recorded on tape or CD (though CCLI covers distribution of these, up to 115% of your church's license size class), synchronization licenses if you produce a video that contains a copyrighted song, and let's not even go into the horrific issues if your music makes its way onto the Internet--some companies like Word Music don't allow their music online at all.

Some other miscellaneous notes about restrictions of the licences:

* You may not alter the lyrics of a song or the tune (melody or harmony)
* You may not make arrangements of the music (even if no published version exists, or if the publication is out of print.
* Rehearsal tapes, CDs etc are not covered by CCLI and therefore require a mechanical license
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mutepointe
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by mutepointe »

hoopy mike wrote:
mutepointe wrote:If anyone knows of any Catholic hymns that need a pirate's touch, please let me know.
How about Aaarrrhhh vey Maria?
You are so going to get smited. I am not standing anywhere near you. I can't wait to tell my brother that one. He's a priest.

Regarding the Catholic Hymns and Jesuit and Marty Haugen stuff, our folk group just transposes songs to simpler keys. It's either that or someone buys me a boatload of whistles and flutes. The music is already transposed for guitar, our electric keyboard has a tranpose feature and I just transpose in my head.
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markbell
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by markbell »

You've hit on the greatest incentive for whistling in church - so many different keys! My whistle-bag contains the following (and all have been used in worship music):

Low D (Chieftain)
Low E (Hoover)
Mezzo G (actually, a bamboo flute)
Mezzo A (Hoover and tweaked Shaw)
Mezzo Bb (Generation)
C (Clarke Original and Walton's)
D (Clarke Original)
Eb (Generation nickel with Hoover Whitecap)
E (Jubilee)
F (Jubilee)
Amon Olorin NAF, F# and G pentatonic
Paul Jones cedar NAF in G pentatonic

Accounting for cross-fingerings, relative minors, etc, I can pretty much pick up and play with anything from four flats to five sharps. When that fails, I just sing...

Mark
(No, I don't have problem with WhOA. I have no problem at all. I'm perfectly happy with all my whistles. Besides, it's doin' the Lord's work, innit?)
sibilo ergo sum
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Daniel_Bingamon
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by Daniel_Bingamon »

I play a Wind Controller at my congregation. We have a few who like the change the key too often and the Wind Controller takes care of that problem. The pianist has even thrown F# minor at us a few time.

A lot of people start out playing melodies and a notes from the chords, what really seasons the music is to learn little licks or rifts. Play pieces of the melody but not clear though and sometimes holding notes while another instrument plays.
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hoopy mike
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Re: Looking for Praise and Worship songs

Post by hoopy mike »

MaryC wrote:Some other miscellaneous notes about restrictions of the licences:
* You may not alter the lyrics of a song or the tune (melody or harmony)...
A good post that illustrates the problem and pitfalls with CCLI nicely. Churches pay money to an organisation so they think they've covered all the copyright and performing issues, when in fact they've just paid some money to someone to appease their conscience. Show me one music group that doesn't alter harmonies to tunes. And how many churches have the correct licence to allow them to play music from CDs before, during or after the service? I'd guess not many.

Oh, and if anyone's interested, here's something else with little to do with whistling:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CtjMpN9hhg

Caution - may contain yak.
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