The Essential Guide to Irish Flute and Tin Whistle

OutOfBreath · Post by **OutOfBreath** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 8:10 am

What are the two metal whistles near the bottom with the very pronounced "wings" beside the fipple? They appear to be conical and look almost like a Copeland -- except that the finish looks a bit rough and my Copeland doesn't have nearly so pronounced sidewalls...

brewerpaul · Post by **brewerpaul** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 8:38 am

[quote="bearbro"]Just a few words from a totaly new begginer. I have been searching the web trying to learn about these fantabulous inexpensive instruments. And I have yet to find a tut for begginers. Oh do not get me wrong. I have found dozens that say they are for begginers and then start talking like us beggingers already know what everything is all about.

My favorite for total beginners, as well as people who already play some instrument but want to "cross over" to whistle is Bill Ochs' "The Clarke Tinwhistle". Starts at absolute zero, teaching simple tunes with tablature ( pictures of the fingering of the notes, not musical notes) but quickly moves you into reading real music. The CD which comes along with it plays each and every example and tune from the book at a nice slow pace. If you start at page one and work through the book lesson by lesson, you WILL be a pretty fair whistle player by the end of the book, with a good selection of ornamented tunes under your belt.
LE McCullough's book is invaluable too, but perhaps not for a total newbie. Eventually, get it too.

raindog1970 · Post by **raindog1970** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 11:36 am

brewerpaul wrote:For anyone who has seen Grey's book already: Gary told me he thinks that one of my wooden whistles may be on the cover. Can anyone verify this? I have never sold one to Grey, but whistles do tend to make the rounds, and you never know... thanks. This is not a sales pitch, but you can see details of the whistle heads at my web site. Note the double raised ring on the head ferrule, which I don't think any other maker has.

Well, after seeing the good clear photo of the cover that Jerry posted, it looks as though it's a Thin Weasel after all... I never thought to check the Mel Bay website for a photo.

bearbro · Post by **bearbro** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 12:17 pm

Brewerpaul said............
"My favorite for total beginners, as well as people who already play some instrument but want to "cross over" to whistle is Bill Ochs' "The Clarke Tinwhistle".

This is just the opinion of a total newbee. I bought the complete set on eBay, only mine includs a cassette instead of a CD. I have read through it from cover to cover just to see what I was getting into. And so far I will have to agree with Mr. Brewerpaul, this seems to be a tut that even us non-musical dummies can understand.

So I would say this would be the first step. Then maybe one of the other books.

I also would like to make a comment on the Clark whistles and maybe get a little feedback from some of you experts. Keep in mind that I'mt a muscian, as a matter of fact I dont know one note from the other. But I do know what sounds good to me.

The Clark tutorial set came with an Clark one piece whistle that has a wood plug in the mouth piece. I understand this is their standard whistle. I have also bought a couple of Clarks MEG whistles (with a plastice mouth piece) that is a lot cheaper then the standard Clark whistle. In my opinion the standard whistle from Clark is not very good as its sound is crapy. The MEG's on the other hand sound pretty good to me.

I have also bought a couple of other whistles and one I have herd a lot of good things about is the Walton. The Walton I have sounds really bad. Not impressed with it at all. I have a couple of Generations that sound pretty good.

IDAwHOa · Post by **IDAwHOa** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 1:02 pm

OutOfBreath wrote:What are the two metal whistles near the bottom with the very pronounced "wings" beside the fipple? They appear to be conical and look almost like a Copeland -- except that the finish looks a bit rough and my Copeland doesn't have nearly so pronounced sidewalls...

They look like Copelands to me.

Don't have a clue about the rest of them.

MarkB · Post by **MarkB** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 2:39 pm

Just ordered four copies; one each for myself and a friend, and two for the library system. I'm sucker for tune books, self instruction music materials,I have more than I can get through in a life time, but I have been waiting for this one. Not having a tin whistle or flute teacher anything that explains the great mysteries of playing to me is worth purchasing.

MarkB

MacEachain · Post by **MacEachain** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 4:09 pm

bearbro wrote: I also would like to make a comment on the Clark whistles and maybe get a little feedback from some of you experts. Keep in mind that I'mt a muscian, as a matter of fact I dont know one note from the other. But I do know what sounds good to me.

The Clark tutorial set came with an Clark one piece whistle that has a wood plug in the mouth piece. I understand this is their standard whistle. I have also bought a couple of Clarks MEG whistles (with a plastice mouth piece) that is a lot cheaper then the standard Clark whistle. In my opinion the standard whistle from Clark is not very good as its sound is crapy. The MEG's on the other hand sound pretty good to me.

I have also bought a couple of other whistles and one I have herd a lot of good things about is the Walton. The Walton I have sounds really bad. Not impressed with it at all. I have a couple of Generations that sound pretty good.

Hi,
1st off, I'm not an expert but I know where you're coming from regarding Clarkes and Waltons. I think the Original Clarke (wooden plug) is a whistle that you either like or you don't, it's quite soft sounding and I actually like it for some stuff, the Meg/Sweetone I find is a little clearer sound wise and I like it too. I've never played a Waltons that I liked, brass or LBW (black painted), I found them to be screetchy, but maybe I didn't play it properly. The other cheapie whistle is the Feadog, I prefer the painted versions rather than the brass or nickle. Generations, I find that I seem to get on better with the brass/red top versions. My favourite d whistle so far is my Dixon tuneable with brass slide even though 2nd 8ve A is a bit flat. All this IMHO, No doubt someone else will have a different take on it.

Cheers, Mac

bearbro · Post by **bearbro** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 8:54 pm

Mac, I thank you for the feed back. I do agree with you about the Clarks. The original Clarke (with the wooden plug) does have a breathy sound to it. I did some tweeking on mine (fellowing a couple of tuts I read) I evened out the tone edge of the sound hole. Mine looked like someone bent it down with a hammer & nail, then I mashed down the wind channel a bit and flared the end up a touch which made it sound a lot better. Although still quite breathy. There are a few songs I think would sound nice on it. But I still like a pure sounding tone myself. As for the Waltons, I have a brass D and the LBW, they both sound squeeky, more so on the lower notes. Me thinks I'll be trying my hand at making a couple of mouth pieces myself......... LOL

I have not tried any of the Feadogs or Generations yet (except a little Generations G) but will. As for the Dixon? Since you bragged on it I'll be trying that to...............

Mommy is WhoA real? Yup............. He He

OutOfBreath · Post by **OutOfBreath** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 9:40 am

NorCalMusician wrote:
OutOfBreath wrote:What are the two metal whistles near the bottom with the very pronounced "wings" beside the fipple? They appear to be conical and look almost like a Copeland -- except that the finish looks a bit rough and my Copeland doesn't have nearly so pronounced sidewalls...
They look like Copelands to me.

Don't have a clue about the rest of them.

I guess that's what they must be, I can just make out the Copeland stamp on the nickel one. Maybe they're Copeland low whistles, I understand that those have a much more pronounced sidewall than my Soprano D -- I should have thought of that.

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:12 pm

I've got the new Larsen book and I'm working my way through it.

Here are my thoughts on it so far, grouped by what the book is good for, and what it isn't:

First, there is a lot of ground this book doesn't cover: maintenance and instrument repair; what to look for in a flute or whistle; and lists of makers' names or contact info are absent, as is any recommendation of what flutes and whistles are good and which are to be avoided.

Also this book isn't going to be much use to a beginner who's still figuring out how to read music and play simple tunes.

What this book does cover extremely well is the ins and outs of Irish ornamentation, including more varieties of rolls and cranns than I've ever heard of till now, presented in a notation system (over standard musical notation for the tunes) that is very clear and easy to understand.

It's also got transcriptions of tunes as played by master players, notated in his "expanded" ornamentation system, as well as some good history and theory info on Irish traditional music.

That brings us to the next point: I would think this book would be next to useless for someone who didn't read music. That said, I don't know how you could write an advanced ornamentation tutor without using some kind of notation, either traditional or roll-your-own. After all, if you're gonna write it down, you gotta write it down.

Ok, so is the book worth the money and the time it takes to go through it? If you are one of the lucky ones who has a good teacher, then the book is a nice addition to your library, but where the book really shines is for someone (like me) with a burning desire to play it right, but without a real live local teacher to help them.

I think that if you have that genuine desire to learn but no one to teach you, then this book is a godsend, especially if combined with Scoiltrad lessons or some other similar form of online learning.

--James

emmline · Post by **emmline** » Wed Jan 07, 2004 8:36 pm

My thoughts on the book: (have gotten about 1/2way through...)
I read music, know theory, play piano...and just working at technique on whistle...but...

I will ultimately use it primarily as a reference, because I just don't have the attention span to keep slogging through it to the depth it asks me. After a while I just can't read 8 pages on short rolls, with 23 examples. I started skimming and skipping. BUT...at those points when I'm thinking something like, "I'm just not getting the hang of that double-roll. Let me study it again, in painstaking detail," the book will be very useful.
He recommends at the beginning, that you work through the book in order...maybe I'm just one of those people who are too right-brained.

Emily

jimr · Post by **jimr** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 10:27 am

For the record, both are Copelands, the Nickel whistle is a Copeland C. Grey told me that the shots of whistle fingering in the book are using his Copelands as well as using them the recording.

Michael and I really like Grey's book, although it is not for the beginner. We decided to include a free copy with a Copeland whistle or flute purchase.

We're looking forward the the next book soon which will be for the whistle.

Jim

burnsbyrne · Post by **burnsbyrne** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 10:39 am

I don't know if this has been posted already but, inside the book there is a silhouette drawing of the cover with a key to identify all the instruments in the picture.
Mike

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Thu Jan 08, 2004 11:00 am

jimr wrote:Michael and really like Grey's book, although it is not for the beginner. We decided to include a free copy with a Copeland whistle or flute purchase.

Jim

Hey Jim,

That's very cool of you guys!

Hope all is well in Jersey, I swear I'll make to the shop next time I get up...or over...down that way

Loren