new kind of whistle?

PhilO · Post by **PhilO** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 10:38 am

Although I do agree it's the music and the player that counts first and foremost, I also agree that it's fun to collect whistles and try out various ones and ultimately it doesn't matter what whistle you're playing. At the same time, it's logical that those that are so inclined will pick out favorites that complement them well (whether this is subjective is no matter). Snobbery as to what type or how expensive a whistle is just as silly as reverse snobbery in saying that people are foolish to spend money on various high end whistles. As long as someone is not deluding him or herself or trying to imply to others that just because they have many high end whistles he or she is a player of some particular level of talent, there's no harm and lot's of fun.

As I posted in a recent other thread, I collect and enjoy different whistles, esp. high end at this point, but also play every single day (this is not a comment as to my prowess).

I have various moods and frankly lately I've been saying to myself quietly over and over in the back of my mind, ok everybody be quiet, save up, wait and get just one Copeland soprano D and forget about the rest of it!

Also, when I pick up the new Elfsong , I actually do feel a bit of the Lord of the Rings, a wonderful feeling!

So all enjoy and best regards,

Philo

Sandy Jasper · Post by **Sandy Jasper** » Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:11 pm

Some folks here may think it bad form for a whistle producer to deride another producer in order to promote their own product.Generations do justice to just about anything in my opinion,even slow airs. peace,Mike

Mike.

In my post, I was speaking more as a teacher than a whistle maker, hence I left the name of my product out of the posting! But just to reiterate, it is not Generations I am so concerned about as I find most of them very playable and my FAVORITE low end whistle. My concern is in students buying the first thing they see at a fair, second hand store or music store. I myself played the whistle for 2 years before being given a whistle that didn't play well. Unfortunatly it seems that approx 1 in 3 of my students come to class's with whistles that physically can't get notes they should be able to and most of the students are blaming themselves!

The last time I taught a class I came to it with a dozen cheap whistles to sell to my students. Ones I believed had a good quality control. It is more important to me that a beginner have a functional whistle and get the joy from his or her music than it is for me to sell mine. As a believer in such, I have given away more whistles to children and beginners than I have sold.

Sandy

lawhistle · Post by **lawhistle** » Sun Sep 29, 2002 9:25 pm

On 2002-08-31 22:34, lawhistle wrote:
Hi, thought I'd add that Pat Collins, Craicmore's whistle player leads our session at the Celtic Arts center often. Great player and a heck of a nice guy. He's had that Sweetone for as long as I've known him. Of course each whistle is variable, and it's got the best tone of any Sweetone I've heard. I think he tried a Waterweasel for awhile, but it wasn't a few weeks before it disappeared and his old standard was back. lol

I wanted to bring this thread up again to let anyone in the L.A. area know that Pat, who was a much loved friend and session leader here in Los Angeles, passed away unexpectedly last week. Anyone in the area, the memorial session for him will be at the Celtic Arts Center, Monday night at 8pm. Pat was the kind of leader every session needs, he was always considerate to everyone who came to play, and encouraged all to participate and we will miss him so very much.

Patrick · Post by **Patrick** » Mon Sep 30, 2002 1:01 pm

Gotta respond to this one, Mike:
________________
Some folks here may think it bad form for a whistle producer to deride another producer in order to promote their own product.Generations do justice to just about anything in my opinion,even slow airs. peace,Mike
________________

I have recently become friends with Erik Tullberg (Tully whistles) and he gave me an insight into the mind of whistle makers. He said that he used to collect different whistles looking for one that has all the characteristics that suit him. He'd like the head on one, the responsiveness of another, the feel of a third. And he started making his own so he could get what he actually wanted in a whistle.

Now, Erik is a friend of Colin Goldie and he is very proud of his blue Overton low D. He also loves his Overton high D. But, I notice that when Erik plays a tune, he tends to pick up a whistle he made. This is not dissing Colin's work. I doubt it actually loses Colin any business.

When Sandy mentioned that her own whistles are more expressive than the average Generation, I take it to mean that she prefers the ones she makes. AS SHE SHOULD. I would not buy a whistle from a maker who admits to a preference for a different maker's product. If the maker isn't happy with it, why should I expect to be? Sandy isn't asking us to buy one of hers. And I suspect that anyone who does get one of her whistles already has tried a Generation. I doubt Generation is losing business over this. Their quality control would lose them a lot more business than a whistle maker saying she likes her own whistles better than theirs.

We can be reasonable people without being PC, here. I have several Generation whistles and I do try to play them now and then. I think they suck. I'm not willing to go through a whole box of whistles to find the one that will do what they all are supposed to.

There are stories of folk musicians who can make a pawn-shop junk guitar sound great, but those same players would probably tell a student to start with the best he can afford. Learning to play an instrument is enough work to begin with. There's no good reason to stack the deck against the student with an instrument that is hard to play well.

-Patrick

blackhawk · Post by **blackhawk** » Mon Sep 30, 2002 3:26 pm

On 2002-09-29 23:25, lawhistle wrote:
On 2002-08-31 22:34, lawhistle wrote:
Hi, thought I'd add that Pat Collins, Craicmore's whistle player leads our session at the Celtic Arts center often. Great player and a heck of a nice guy. He's had that Sweetone for as long as I've known him. Of course each whistle is variable, and it's got the best tone of any Sweetone I've heard. I think he tried a Waterweasel for awhile, but it wasn't a few weeks before it disappeared and his old standard was back. lol
I wanted to bring this thread up again to let anyone in the L.A. area know that Pat, who was a much loved friend and session leader here in Los Angeles, passed away unexpectedly last week. Anyone in the area, the memorial session for him will be at the Celtic Arts Center, Monday night at 8pm. Pat was the kind of leader every session needs, he was always considerate to everyone who came to play, and encouraged all to participate and we will miss him so very much.

Wow, that's a major shock. I enjoyed his playing so much that day. I was looking forward to hearing him again many times in the years to come. He was younger than me, too.

mike.r · Post by **mike.r** » Tue Oct 01, 2002 12:29 am

On 2002-09-30 15:01, Patrick wrote:
Gotta respond to this one, Mike:
________________
Some folks here may think it bad form for a whistle producer to deride another producer in order to promote their own product.Generations do justice to just about anything in my opinion,even slow airs. peace,Mike
________________

I have recently become friends with Erik Tullberg (Tully whistles) and he gave me an insight into the mind of whistle makers. He said that he used to collect different whistles looking for one that has all the characteristics that suit him. He'd like the head on one, the responsiveness of another, the feel of a third. And he started making his own so he could get what he actually wanted in a whistle.

Now, Erik is a friend of Colin Goldie and he is very proud of his blue Overton low D. He also loves his Overton high D. But, I notice that when Erik plays a tune, he tends to pick up a whistle he made. This is not dissing Colin's work. I doubt it actually loses Colin any business.

When Sandy mentioned that her own whistles are more expressive than the average Generation, I take it to mean that she prefers the ones she makes. AS SHE SHOULD. I would not buy a whistle from a maker who admits to a preference for a different maker's product. If the maker isn't happy with it, why should I expect to be? Sandy isn't asking us to buy one of hers. And I suspect that anyone who does get one of her whistles already has tried a Generation. I doubt Generation is losing business over this. Their quality control would lose them a lot more business than a whistle maker saying she likes her own whistles better than theirs.

We can be reasonable people without being PC, here. I have several Generation whistles and I do try to play them now and then. I think they suck. I'm not willing to go through a whole box of whistles to find the one that will do what they all are supposed to.

There are stories of folk musicians who can make a pawn-shop junk guitar sound great, but those same players would probably tell a student to start with the best he can afford. Learning to play an instrument is enough work to begin with. There's no good reason to stack the deck against the student with an instrument that is hard to play well.

-Patrick

Patrick,since Sandy made her original post on this subject she has shown through subsequent posts to be realy nice,a good sport and generous with her knowledge and experience.My post does seem a little harsh in retrospect but was also a reflection of a general forum climate at that time,but thanks for bringing this up.Cheers,Mike

Walden · Post by **Walden** » Tue Oct 01, 2002 3:55 am

I have a blue Sweetone. I can't make it sound great (or any other). Here's a clip, though:

http://www.freewebs.com/praiseclips/Bethou.htm

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Tue Oct 01, 2002 4:20 am

Walden,

I actually thought it sounded pretty good!

Your Old Heathen Friend,

--James

http://www.flutesite.com

serpent · Post by **serpent** » Tue Oct 01, 2002 6:33 pm

On 2002-09-01 05:41, mike.r wrote:
On 2002-09-01 02:25, Sandy Jasper wrote:
Blackhawk

I love your posting. Much good wisdom there. No matter how good your whistle is, you yourself provide the magic and soul of the music!

A few thoughts of mine on the high end, low end debate! I was always a generation whistle fan. I thought they could do no wrong. Then I started building my own and a whole new world of expression opened up for me. Now I still use the odd generation for a fast song, especially when my whistles aren't with me but for slow, beautiful songs, they do them no justice. The difference really came home to me one night when a whistle class I was teaching all decided to order whistles. The next week I.....
Some folks here may think it bad form for a whistle producer to deride another producer in order to promote their own product.Generations do justice to just about anything in my opinion,even slow airs. peace,Mike

... and just how far in the direction of Political Correctness do we have to go, Mike? Sandy gave an opinion, and stated that the whistles she made for herself sounded better - to her and to her students. I didn't see a dissing of the Generation there - just a statement that another whistle sounded better to some. I think you'll even find people who think a Meg sounds better than a Sindt.

Sandy has a right to her opinions, and should have the freedom to state them, even here. Being a whistlesmith makes her no less a human being, and certainly no less a member of the community. I didn't perceive an ad for Elfsong there, did anyone else?

Respectfully,
Bill Whedon

blackhawk · Post by **blackhawk** » Tue Oct 01, 2002 6:44 pm

On 2002-10-01 20:33, serpent wrote:

Sandy has a right to her opinions, and should have the freedom to state them, even here. Being a whistlesmith makes her no less a human being, and certainly no less a member of the community. I didn't perceive an ad for Elfsong there, did anyone else?

Respectfully,
Bill Whedon

No, I didn't, Bill. And from all I've read of her posts, Sandy seems to be a classy person. I thought then, and still do, that Mike shot from the hip, looking to find fault where there was none.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: blackhawk on 2002-10-01 20:57 ]</font>

Sandy Jasper · Post by **Sandy Jasper** » Tue Oct 01, 2002 7:30 pm

It is easy to be misunderstood on the board as it is in life and I appreciate everyone for choosing to see my comments for what they are! Thanks also to Mike for his gentle kick in the butt and for the grace to take a second look, he showed a lot of class.

Now let's get back to the business of whistles, triplets and spit control...

Sandy