By the River of Gems

[djm]

Cynth, there are many dance tunes that also have a sung version, and knowing the dance tune makes it easier for me to follow the sung version, but sean-nós songs don't have a regular rhythm, and the phrasing differs from singer to singer. That's what makes them so difficult (for me) to follow these tunes. I have chosen simply to avoid playing slow airs.

djm

[Cynth]

There are a few humorous songs on my CD set that have what seem to be pretty clear melodies that I can understand. They seem to be sung in a faster, more straightforward way and the phrasing makes sense to me when I look at the translation. I might someday try those just for myself. I can't really imagine trying most of the other ones because I don't feel that I really understand them, even though I've listened to them many times. I wouldn't want to just be trying to mimic someone. But perhaps I will sometime find some sheet music and just see for fun how it compares to a song I've heard.

[Patrick D'Arcy]

I wish I had the time to do it that way believe me...??? :roll:

Ya lazy good for nothin'! Just learn it by ear..... jayney mack!

PD.

[texasbagpiper]

I wish I had the time to do it that way believe me...??? :roll:

Ya lazy good for nothin'! Just learn it by ear..... jayney mack!

PD.

Sorry Pat Just dont have the time.... For me it's always been easier to take the sheet music go over it a few time's and change it up to my liking.... I don't have the time right now to sit around and pull my pud... Go Dodgers.....

[KDMARTINKY]

Davy Spillane....one of the most over-rated musicians of the 21st century. Thats all I got to say about that........

[PJ]

Davy Spillane....one of the most over-rated musicians of the 21st century. Thats all I got to say about that........

I don't want to hijack this thread, so we won't get into it here.

[BigDavy]

Hi DJM/Cynth

Why not try an air sung in scots or english, rather than an out and out sean nos song. There are quite a few to choose from. For example flowers of the forest, while it is based on a GHB pipe tune, and you can get the dots easily, is sung in a style similar to nothern irish sean nos style. (it also sounds better on UPs than on GHB - I'll get hung here for saying that).

David

[djm]

it also sounds better on UPs than on GHB - I'll get hung here for saying that

On the contrary, this is exactly the place to say it. Everything sounds better on UPs.

I can pick song tunes out on the UPs with no problem. I just can't follow most sean-nós tunes well enough to play them correctly, i.e. in the tradition. There is a lot of griping about pipers who screw up sean-nós tunes, so I solve the problem by not playing them.

djm

[Uilliam]

[Writing down music is relatively recent in ITM. Prior to that it was handed down like in the oral tradition....

Depends what ye call relative I suppose "The Complete Tutor for the Pastoral or New Bagpipe"by John Geoghegan was published in 1745 before that there where plenty of manuscripted music. To suggest otherwise seems to imply that the Irish only bothered with an aural tradition which could be said of any culture until the widespread availability and acceptance of written music.The term aural is also a cop out to those who don't want to or can't be bothered to learn to read music.Most of the IT Musicians I have come across can at least recognise the dots and make an effort to comply with whats written .So if ye can't read the music then learn to ..its not that hard and a lot easier than learning a foreign language...Aural,what does that mean anyway?all music is an aural tradition in my book
Slán Agat
Uilliam.

PS Keith, Davy Spillane can play the pipes,overated or not by yourself.

[PJ]

It seems to me, and I'm open to correction, that the practice of writing down music has certainly not been consistent in Irish history. Or at the very least, the practice was largely discontinued after the Famine years.

[KAD]

Sorry Pat Just dont have the time.... For me it's always been easier to take the sheet music go over it a few time's and change it up to my liking.... I don't have the time right now to sit around and pull my pud... Go Dodgers.....

texasbagpiper, What's the hurry? What will happen to you if you don't learn this air RIGHT NOW, AS SOON AS POSSIBLE? Will you lose your job? Is someone holding a gun to your head? Are you performing in front of thousands of people this coming Saturday?

You can learn music by ear the same way you learned Jennie's phone number:

867-

It takes a lot of repetition, but it's a very valuable skill. If learning speed is your main concern, I'd tell you that the ten years I've spent learning how to learn by ear are incredibly useful to me now -- I can pick up just about any new tune in about 20 minutes (half an hour if it's really complicated). So I'd say, try to wean yourself off the sheet music, gradually. It takes time, but it's worth it.

Now, all that being said, even though I am good at learning by ear, it takes me a much longer time to absorb and learn to play a slow air -- let alone play it really well. I just don't think there are any shortcuts there. You might get the bones of the tune quickly via sheet music, but you'll never get the feel of it right away. And slow airs are all about feeling.

KAD

[Cynth]

Why not try an air sung in scots or english

You know I was just thinking about that last night. I could play airs that are more accessible to my understanding and I believe, if I am remembering a long ago discussion with Uilliam correctly, it would not be a travesty to do so as long as I made it clear that I was not playing one of the traditional sean nos airs in the traditional sean nos style. There are also Irish songs, I believe, that don't fall in this particular tradition (on thin ground here, but I think this is true) that I might be able to play the airs to as long as I did not attempt to impose a style on them that was not fitting.

The nice thing about playing airs for a beginner is that they can sound something like music when played slowly yet one is not trying to play "slow airs" which are beyond one's ability and understanding. It is nice have a few to play when one gets a bit discouraged by the slowness of one's dance tunes.

[Pipey]

Walton's (Dublin) publishes an "Ireland's Best" collection for a variety of instruments. One is "Ireland's Best Slow Airs" -- "110 of Ireland's most beautiful and haunting melodies, including laments, airs...O'Carolan compositions. " On the back cover is a tag from "Mel Bay Publications, Inc. Order Number WM1311." There is also a companion CD that tracks each tune. Hope this helps. Best,

[texasbagpiper]

Sorry Pat Just dont have the time.... For me it's always been easier to take the sheet music go over it a few time's and change it up to my liking.... I don't have the time right now to sit around and pull my pud... Go Dodgers.....

texasbagpiper, What's the hurry? What will happen to you if you don't learn this air RIGHT NOW, AS SOON AS POSSIBLE? Will you lose your job? Is someone holding a gun to your head? Are you performing in front of thousands of people this coming Saturday?

You can learn music by ear the same way you learned Jennie's phone number:

867-

It takes a lot of repetition, but it's a very valuable skill. If learning speed is your main concern, I'd tell you that the ten years I've spent learning how to learn by ear are incredibly useful to me now -- I can pick up just about any new tune in about 20 minutes (half an hour if it's really complicated). So I'd say, try to wean yourself off the sheet music, gradually. It takes time, but it's worth it.

Now, all that being said, even though I am good at learning by ear, it takes me a much longer time to absorb and learn to play a slow air -- let alone play it really well. I just don't think there are any shortcuts there. You might get the bones of the tune quickly via sheet music, but you'll never get the feel of it right away. And slow airs are all about feeling.

KAD

No hurry,I'm well aware of learning tunes by ear..., just don't have the time to sit down and do it right now... that's all.. I'm Very, Very Busy......
Cheers, Seth

[KDMARTINKY]

PJ: Do you personnally know Spillane? If not I can send you a autographed picture if you like......(yes I actually have one)....