Posting clips

Akiba · Post by **Akiba** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 3:42 pm

mahanpots wrote:
Akiba wrote:...Short rolls are tough, though. Maybe another year or five and I'll get there...

Thanks for the clips.

Cheers,

Jason
Jason,

I thought your short rolls were fine in Out on the Ocean. And I believe you could easily add one at the end of both sections of Out on the Ocean. You could pause afterward or play a quick note to lead into the next measure, if that makes sense. You could even play a long roll at the end there and keep playing into the next measure. Hope I didn't confuse you.

Michael

Thanks, Michael. I think you might be referring to when I sound a note, usually G, and on a few quarter notes in OotO, I'll add a tap(strike) to break it into two eighth notes; this sounds similar to what I think of as a short roll. I do go by Grey Larson's nomenclature in that a short roll is one that takes a quarter note, say the same G, and breaks it into two eighths by going cut(one eighth)-tap(second eighth). So in my book, what I'm doing is not a "pure" short roll. I'm not saying this definition is the only definition of short rolls, or heaven forbid the "right" definition. I'm just explaining how I've come to understand and use the term.

I took a lesson from Jack Gilder, leadman of Tipsy House (checkout their website and hear some great free tracks, tipsyhouse.com I think), who is a great player of flute and concertina (he plays an 8-key Grinter) in San Francisco, a scholar of ITM who has played and studied the music for 30 odd years (he's jGilder I believe here at C&F on other forums, and Phantom Button on thesession). I asked him about short rolls, and he was not familiar with them at all. He did show and play for me some wicked 3-finger cranns from G on down--an awesome chirpy sound--and how he "breathes in the gaps", a breath taken by slight of hand, misdirection, in between two notes that I could not even discern; and how he uses his breath to huff polyrhythmic counterpoint lines when playing tunes (I still don't have a clue how or what exactly he was doing, but it sounded great of course)...but no short rolls. Anyways, just thought I'd share some tales here. Not too many folks would have any interest in this stuff, but we do.

Cheers,

Jason

mahanpots · Post by **mahanpots** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 4:07 pm

Jason,

Thanks for explaining. In the back of my head I was wondering if that was what you were doing. So, all you have to do is add the cut where you're doing that. Instead of going G{F}G, go {A}G{F}G. Just cut that first G with the A. The result is very similar to what you do. That's a short roll as I understand it. From what I've heard online, Larson uses it in places in a tune which make it really stand out rhythmically, and then it seems to be a very difficult thing.

My first instructor gave me some exercises to do with short rolls and long rolls. I could do the exercises, but it took quite a number of years before I began to think about short rolls. I'll try to post the exercises tomorrow morning on "clips."

Michael

ImNotIrish · Post by **ImNotIrish** » Tue Jun 03, 2008 7:34 pm

Michael,

I just couldn't help it. Here's a version of the morning dew. It was one of those days where I just couldn't get the tune to flow. I finally just settled for this one (one of the earlier takes). I'll probably redo it at some point, but I think you get the idea. Just for contrast.

Arbo

http://www.box.net/shared/piz850s8ws
(the morning dew reel)

LorenzoFlute · Post by **LorenzoFlute** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:54 am

arbo i love your style! and the tune is great, i learnt it recently and love it. am i the only one that plays it in three parts? the third part is really cool i belive...

mahanpots · Post by **mahanpots** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 6:15 am

I get the idea Arbo. Lots of energy in that version. The variation you do with the three repititions of the E roll is one I used to hear at sessions a long time ago. Whenever I tried it, my timing was off for some reason. I'll have to play along with yours and see what happens.

Michael

matahari_1946 · Post by **matahari_1946** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 7:20 am

Othannen wrote:am i the only one that plays it in three parts? the third part is really cool i belive...

I heard three parts played by Bothrops, Michael and Arbo in the clips they posted and I also play the same three parts. You play something in addition to those three?

LorenzoFlute · Post by **LorenzoFlute** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 7:59 am

ugh! you're right! i play it in four parts!

so i guess my sensence becomes: am i the only one that plays it in four parts? the fourth part is really cool i belive...

Bothrops · Post by **Bothrops** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 8:42 am

I've always heard it in three parts, but the third part may have a variation..

http://www.slowplayers.org/BASS/tunes/Morning_Dew32.gif

http://www.wildfiddle.com/upload/morningdew.gif

LorenzoFlute · Post by **LorenzoFlute** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:54 am

ok thanks bothrops, that was illuminating...
i play both the third parts, putting one after the other. i confess i never played that tune in a session...

ImNotIrish · Post by **ImNotIrish** » Wed Jun 04, 2008 7:18 pm

ImNotIrish wrote:
I just couldn't help it. Here's a version of the morning dew. It was one of those days where I just couldn't get the tune to flow. I finally just settled for this one (one of the earlier takes). I'll probably redo it at some point, but I think you get the idea. Just for contrast.

Arbo

http://www.box.net/shared/piz850s8ws
(the morning dew reel)

And so, here is a retake. Much more flowing in my estimation, but then again, I am too close to it to have a usuable perspective.

http://www.box.net/shared/n3symo2kgk
(the morning dew reel #2)

A.

Bothrops · Post by **Bothrops** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 9:58 am

ImNotIrish wrote: And so, here is a retake. Much more flowing in my estimation, but then again, I am too close to it to have a usuable perspective.

http://www.box.net/shared/n3symo2kgk
(the morning dew reel #2)

A.

Woooooooow!! That was excellent, Arbo. Very nice flowing, indeed, and I liked your variations. Well done!

Bothrops · Post by **Bothrops** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 9:59 am

"The Butterfly"

http://audio.xanga.com/Bothrops/7b0b62308130/audio.html

ImNotIrish · Post by **ImNotIrish** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 2:55 pm

Bothrops wrote:
ImNotIrish wrote: And so, here is a retake. Much more flowing in my estimation, but then again, I am too close to it to have a usuable perspective.

http://www.box.net/shared/n3symo2kgk
(the morning dew reel #2)

A.
Woooooooow!! That was excellent, Arbo. Very nice flowing, indeed, and I liked your variations. Well done!

Thanks for your kind comment. Just listened to 'the butterfly'. I thought you did a wonderful job. Nice tone, steady rhythm, and good phrasing for the most part. One suggestion: take some time with the higher notes, try to get it sounding cleanly and not cut off. BTW, you do some interesting rhythmic thing on the second part which I love. Keep up the good work.
Arbo

Bothrops · Post by **Bothrops** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 4:38 pm

Thanks, Arbo!
Yes, I'm just being able to hit the higher notes, but I still find it a bit difficult, mainly those high A and B, hope to keep improving, though.

Cheers,
Martin

mahanpots · Post by **mahanpots** » Thu Jun 05, 2008 5:11 pm

Martin,

I agree with Arbo. Nice tone on that one, and I too like the variation in second part (somebody once told me to call that the B section). Please explain what you're doing. As far as I can tell, you're holding the B a bit longer, but beyond that, I'm not sure.

Michael