To modify an old flute or not?

[libraryman]

Hello.
I recently bought a really beautiful cocuswood 19th century French flute. Paid about $1200. I've been trying to give it a go, but haven't gotten much tone out of it. It has a very small oval emboucure. As an experiment, I put the only headjoint I had on hand that would fit--an old Ralph Sweet rosewood one without a tuning slide. The improvement in playability was tremendous. Suddenly, I had a lovely small holed flute. But that's not a longterm solution. So I'm wondering if I should ask a modern maker to enlarge the embouchure or see if anyone could make me a new headjoint in cocuswood. I'm sure modifying old flutes is not really recmmended, but is it pretty commonly done or is the second option better? Don't know how many makers even stock any cocuswood. Before asking, I thought I'd ask for advice from the group. Thanks.

[plunk111]

I would suggest you talk (PM - they are both members here) to Terry McGee or Jon Cornia. Both are makers/restorers and would give you superb advice - I've worked with both guys (they're probably reading this anyway).

Pat

[Juan Pablo Plata]

Just learn to play the new flute. Be patient.

[peeplj]

I agree with Juan...patience is the key here, and will be rewarded.

Don't try to make the instrument change to fit you; learn to change how you play to fit the instrument.

That said, there may be more factors at play here than just the different cut of embouchure. I would start by checking for leaks; check the head cork and the tuning slide, even a small leak at either place can kill the tone. Carefully examine for small cracks.

Good luck with your flute...remember you have a living piece of history there. Be patient and it will tell you wonderful tales of another time that's gone and not returning.


--James

[Sillydill]

As others have expressed: Learn to play the flute in its original form.

Once you learn to play a small embouchure, it is easy to also play large embouchures. But it is hard to switch from a large embouchure to a small (as you are now aware of).

Give it time, try to focus your air-stream (gently at first).

Best of Luck!

[ImNotIrish]

As mentioned.... first, make sure the instrument is in playable condition. Then, as suggested, spend some time with it, get a solid tone, get the octaves under control, push it to it's limits, back off, re-evaluate, get a sense of inherent tuning issues (if any), and put it away for a while, then pick it up after a bit of an absence. This helps one gain perspective about what the instrument has to offer.
Arbo

[Aanvil]

Yes as just said, check for leaks and cracks.

The pads may be dry and not seating well. This might put a little moisture on the pads. A little paper towel and some water... I actually lick mine

That might give you a better seal for a quick check.

Make sure the joints are well threaded/corked and well greased.

Take all the parts and do a separate suck test to each two.

Even the smallest leak will dramatically reduce the fullness of tone.

Under no circumstance should you try to cut on the emb. hole.

It's you, not the flute.

That being said old French flute are not super big on "big" sound.

Not to say you can't play them loud, you can, but they were designed to play more sweetly as was the fashion at the time.

Have fun!

[Rob Sharer]

If you do end up getting a headjoint made, there's no point having it made in cocus. You might could make a case for it if it was a truly valuable flute with a missing headjoint, but since the original is present and you merely want one to play on, why not get a headjoint made in blackwood?


Rob

[Casey Burns]

The flute will lose any resale value if modified. Better to get a headjoint in blackwood made. Or cocus if you are willing to risk lip blistering.

[jemtheflute]

Pretty much what all the others have said regarding technical checks and, once you've eliminated any physical faults, learning to adapt your playing to what it has to give..... and if you then still find a different embouchure cut would be seriously advantageous, have a new head made to fit it. You'd be lucky to get matching cocus, mind, but as Rob says, any decent wood or Delrin or Ebonite would do from a playing perspective. Having a perfect visual match is probably unattainable anyway.

From a historic/conservatorial viewpoint, the ethics of altering an antique are rather dependent on what the individual object is - if it is a particularly good example, or rare, or one by a particularly sought-after or renowned maker, or would otherwise have special value in its original form, then ethically (and for value's sake) you should not alter it, but if it is a bog-standard example, anonymous, of a common type, then the ethical arguments for preserving it in original state are less weighty - become more on the level of personal aesthetics, emotional, etc. How much you paid for it may (or may not!) reflect its historic worth, and will also rightly affect your own attitude to tinkering beyond basic overhaul/essential restoration. When I am renovating antique flutes I have no qualms about making alterations to generic (and usually originally low-to-medium value) ones of which many examples can be found and that can be improved for current use, but I wouldn't mess with R&Rs, Hudson Prattens etc. (pick a name) beyond sympathetic restoration. That said, I don't think re-cutting the existing embouchure on your flute nor blanking it off and cutting another one are the best way forward here - preserving the original and getting a new head to your specs would meet both the ethical and practical angles better.

[jim stone]

After checking the flute for leaks, etc, if it's still not playing I would certainly try to get it into the hands of a very
good player who can tell you what the flute's potential really is. Or a good player/maker.
It may be the flute.
If so there are makers who will cut a new embouchure hole, if they think it will help,
and that can save you a good deal of money and keep the matching wood.
I leave the ethical questions to you, but, as Jem said, if the flute is defective
and there are plenty of others of its kind, I can't personally see a real difficulty in altering this
particular one.

Learning to play the flute is a good idea, but it's hardly impossible that the
flute is simply not much good as is. Before committing myself to
that, I'd personally have somebody good play it.

I do know that there are good repair people (known to us) who often work on old flutes
who have no problem with altering embouchure holes on flute like THIS one.

[libraryman]

Thanks all for the helpful responses. You've convinced me not to alter the existing headjoint and consider getting a more modern one in blackwood made after rechecking for any leaks, etc. I never saw this as a possible No. 1 flute, but hoped it would be one I'd really enjoy playing for a change as I've heard a few French flutes that were douce, peut-etre, mais magnifique quand meme.

[Jon C.]

Hello.
I recently bought a really beautiful cocuswood 19th century French flute. Paid about $1200. I've been trying to give it a go, but haven't gotten much tone out of it. It has a very small oval emboucure. As an experiment, I put the only headjoint I had on hand that would fit--an old Ralph Sweet rosewood one without a tuning slide. The improvement in playability was tremendous. Suddenly, I had a lovely small holed flute. But that's not a longterm solution. So I'm wondering if I should ask a modern maker to enlarge the embouchure or see if anyone could make me a new headjoint in cocuswood. I'm sure modifying old flutes is not really recmmended, but is it pretty commonly done or is the second option better? Don't know how many makers even stock any cocuswood. Before asking, I thought I'd ask for advice from the group. Thanks.

Why don't you send it with the others, and I can evaluate it for you, I have some cocuswood in stock...

[libraryman]

Thanks Jon C. I would appreciate it and will get 'em off tomorrow.