Overton?

[Leahcim]

I have recently purchased this whistle at my local music store. The tag said Overton and it was priced at 85 US dollars. The fipple end does not resemble those of the Overton line. Also there are no markings other the "D" stamp at the bottom end. The whistle plays well and is responsive, I am very pleased with it, however I would like to know who made it if it is not indeed an Overton.

http://img55.imageshack.us/i/192110.jpg/
http://img53.imageshack.us/i/192130.jpg/
http://img76.imageshack.us/i/192058.jpg/
http://img215.imageshack.us/i/192033.jpg/
http://img54.imageshack.us/i/192015.jpg/
http://img83.imageshack.us/i/192026.jpg/

[ahogrelius]

-Looks like a tuneable Chieftain to me...


Cheers,
Anders

[pancelticpiper]

The Phil Hardy/Chieftan site has a video in which Phil gives tips for indentifying all of the various models of whistles he has made over the years. It's extremely helpful because of the large number of his whistles floating around people come across of unknown provenance.

[Dale]

Sadly, confusion persisted over the years about this. Overtons are stamped "Overton" on the tube. A lot of shops sold Chieftains as Overtons and it sounds like this continues.

[arnie]

The pictures show a Chieftain for sure. I do not understand the confusion, because the head is differently shaped in both whistles. Obvious eg. is that the sides of the head of the Overton are straight as where the Chieftain's head has rounded sides and also round the windway they are differently shaped. Most obvious is off course the stamp at the end of the whistle which marks its brand.

[MTGuru]

I do not understand the confusion

Well, not all whistle buyers have detailed knowlege of the history of whistle morphology.

When your vendor hands you an instrument for purchase and tells you that it is X when it isn't, it's hardly fair to blame the customer. Yes, caveat emptor. But it's the seller's business to know what they are selling, especially when the problem has a history that can be researched.

Of course, in this case, it looks like Leahcim ended up with a good whistle at a good price.

[Feadoggie]

I have recently purchased this whistle at my local music store.

Buck's County Folk Music perchance?

[starstutu]

I've had a few Chieftains and I don't remember the bottom E hole being so large or the tunable joint to protrude out so much. It doesn't look like a Chieftain but it could be one of his earlier models. I would send the pictures to Colin Goldie of Overton/Goldie whistles and ask him. I'm sure he can identify the maker. He's very knowledgable of whistles made by other makers.

[MTGuru]

Sadly, confusion persisted over the years about this. Overtons are stamped "Overton" on the tube. A lot of shops sold Chieftains as Overtons and it sounds like this continues.

Newer Chiffers who are unfamiliar with this problem may want to read the History section of Dale's vintage article on Overtons and Chieftains here:

http://www.chiffandfipple.com/whatamess.html

In addition to the distinctive name stamp and Colin's signature, new Goldie Overtons are also accompanied by a signed Certificate of Authenticity to guard against either honest mistakes or misrepresentations.

[Mitch]

Yes, very much looks like the Chieftain NR .. BUT - the slide looks to be retro-fitted. I've never seen an NR Chieftain with that polished line towards the top of the slide-outer.

For those who don't care to search the history and rich story chronicled in this very tome ..
The abridged version is that Phil Hardy was one of 2 makers who were licensed to produce the Bernard Overton design - Colin Goldie was the other. At a certain point Phil chose to part with the design and go his own way, Colin chose to persist with the original design and ethic. Some agree with Phil's aproach, some agree with Colin's. There are a few whistles out there that were produced by Phil while he was still licensed to use the name.

One thing is for sure - By the time Phil was using the NR head configuration as shown in the pics - it was called a Chieftain.

[arnie]

I do not understand the confusion

Well, not all whistle buyers have detailed knowlege of the history of whistle morphology.

When your vendor hands you an instrument for purchase and tells you that it is X when it isn't, it's hardly fair to blame the customer. Yes, caveat emptor. But it's the seller's business to know what they are selling, especially when the problem has a history that can be researched.

Of course, in this case, it looks like Leahcim ended up with a good whistle at a good price.

You're right MtGuru, I don't blame the customer, but a seller should know better.

[Dale]

I can't tell if it's a Chieftain, because I've only had one or two come through here and that was some years ago. That said, over the years I have seen whistles that looked very vaguely life Overtons or Chieftains that weren't made by Colin, Bernard, of Phil Hardy. These were made by people who made brief entries into the whistle-making biz and then vanished.

[Ballyshannon]

Yes, very much looks like the Chieftain NR .. BUT - the slide looks to be retro-fitted. I've never seen an NR Chieftain with that polished line towards the top of the slide-outer.

That's my thinking as well. Here's a photo of a tunable Chieftain:
http://tradschool.com/components/com_vi ... 5ec9de.jpg

The logical course would be to send either this topic link or the photos to Phil Hardy and see what he says. I recently contacted him to get the name of the tune he plays in the Oz Vambrance review video and he responded straight away.

[Bloomfield]

It's not an Overton. I would return it and tell the store owner to quit their false advertising.

[Goldie]

At a certain point Phil chose to part with the design and go his own way.

This is not quite right and to put the record straight in this case Bernard Overton made that decision for Phil when he took the licence away from him in 1998.

Leahcim I am glad you like the whistle even though it is not what you paid for.

Colin