Slightly OT: Need help for my daughter's music research pro

Redwolf · Post by **Redwolf** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 12:06 pm

I think this may just be the place to ask for input on this:

My co-teacher and I have set our music appreciation kids their first research project. We've asked them to choose a culture or country and do a little research on its traditional music. Nothing too in-depth...for many of them, this will be their first research project of any type, and the main goal is to get them listening to something other than the Britney Spears/'Nsync stuff that makes up their usual musical fare. They are allowed to get extensive adult help (in fact, we suggest interviews with parents, adult friends and other relatives as one possible resource).

One thing we're working on now is getting them to narrow their topics down to a reasonable scope. My daughter started off wanting to do "American Folk Music." After working on narrowing the topic down a bit, she decided to focus on Irish immigrant music. I suggested she narrow it still further, and now she's decided to look at the influence Irish music had on music in the Old West (cowboy tunes, railroad tunes, fiddle tunes and the like). One thing she's thinking of doing is presenting some well-known Western songs side by side with their Irish ancestor (for example Bard of Armagh/Streets of Laredo or Master McGrath/The Old Orange Flute/Sweet Betsy from Pike. Three guesses as to who gets to play the Irish tunes

Also, if anyone knows of any good, child-friendly books or websites that she could read to get the historical background on the Irish migration to the American West, it would be a great help. I have some resources, but most of them are a bit dry to hold a 10-year-old's interest for long.

The other kids in the class have chosen some interesting cultures as well...this should be a fun project, when they all present their findings! Several kids are researching Native American music (specific cultures include Cherokee and Shoshone...I don't know how much information is out there for them, but I'm excited that they're trying). One girl is studying Hawaiian music, and a couple of boys are looking at African American music during slavery and its influence on modern music. We've also got several European, Asian and Middle Eastern cultures represented, including Yugoslavia, Switzerland, Japan, India, and Israel (and, of course, the ever-popular British Isles. About half the class wanted Ireland, but I managed to limit that topic to two kids, and direct the others toward England, Scotland and Wales). Any suggestions re resources for these cultures would be very welcome.

Redwolf

[ This Message was edited by: Redwolf on 2003-01-17 13:09 ]

MarkB · Post by **MarkB** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 12:14 pm

Redwolf what age range is the class?

MarkB

Redwolf · Post by **Redwolf** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 12:18 pm

Sorry...I should have mentioned that. They're fourth, fifth and sixth graders at an accelerated elementary school, so figure chronological age at between nine and 12. Intellectual "age" for some of these kids, however, is quite a bit beyond their chronological age. Makes it a bit difficult to set a project for all of them, but we are taking these differences into account (and it's not a graded assignment).

Anything suitable for Elementary through young High Schoolers would do for this bunch, I think.

Redwolf

Blackbeer · Post by **Blackbeer** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 12:41 pm

Sounds like a great project Redwolf. I think PBS is doing a special on Cowboy music and its origins this weekend and NPR just had an interview with an auther who has just published a book on the subject. I wish I could be more precise here but I hadn`t even gotten my first cup of coffee down yesterday mourning when I herd them announced on the radio. But I`m sure if you check there websites you will be able to fill in the blanks.

Tom

MarkB · Post by **MarkB** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 1:44 pm

Redwolf, I was searching the catalog of the Santa Cruz Public Library, I don't know where you live in the mountains, but there seems to be some resources for various ethnic and geographical areas for your children in the library. Home Page for library is here:

http://63.193.16.236/web2/tramp2.exe/lo ... rver=1home

They have the "New Grove's dictionary of Music and Musicians" and it is a wealth of knowledge about styles, countries etc. Enough to get them started in a certain direciton.

MarkB

Redwolf · Post by **Redwolf** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 2:23 pm

Great! The school is actually in Santa Cruz, so that will be pretty convenient for the kids. I tend to forget that libraries are on-line now too...thanks for checking!

Blackbeer, I'll have a look at the PBS schedule and see if it's showing here. That would be right up the old alley.

We're hoping to do a couple of these projects this semester. The next one will probably deal with either musical "periods" (Rennaissance, Classical, Baroque, Romantic, etc.) or with famous composers, but we thought traditional music from a country that interests them would be a good starting point.

Redwolf

rosenlof · Post by **rosenlof** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 2:29 pm

http://www.tradfrance.com is a very nice resource for traditional French music. There's not really a lot of text - at least not in English. But lots of nice tunes in ABC format.

ErikT · Post by **ErikT** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 2:39 pm

John Denver produced an album called "All Aboard!" with many traditional train songs. You may want to give that a listen.

Erik

post edit: most have a blue-grass or country feel.

[ This Message was edited by: ErikT on 2003-01-17 16:23 ]

Blarney Pilgrim · Post by **Blarney Pilgrim** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 3:20 pm

There is actually a CD named Cowboy Celtic. You can find it on Amazon.com. Even if you don't want the CD, Amazon has a list of the songs. Good Luck! Steve

Roger O'Keeffe · Post by **Roger O'Keeffe** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 3:29 pm

Redwolf,

Your daughter could try Mudcat at http://www.mudcat.org/threads.cfm - that's if banging off a question to a website doesn't defeat the purpose of the research project. She can sign in as a guest, and add a name or nickname to the default GUEST name. Or she could start by searching the existing thread archive, though the search engine is a bit hit-and-miss.

It's a fun site, though it tends to get infected with rather too many political rant threads (especially in the current climate). But Mudcatters love a genuine folk music enquiry and are boundlessly helpful.

One way to make it a more educational approach for her would be to impress on her the importance of framing the research question clearly in the limited number of characters available for a thread title.

I'll keep an eye out there for her thread!

Roger (who's spent much of the last twenty years trying to help his three cutie-pie daughters without spoonfeeding them)

_________________
An Pluiméir Ceolmhar

[ This Message was edited by: Roger O'Keeffe on 2003-01-17 16:30 ]

jbarter · Post by **jbarter** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 3:32 pm

Here's another pairing for you. Johnny I Hardly Knew Ya / When Johnny Comes Marching Home.

If you can find any videos or DVDs of the old 'Bringing It All Back Home' TV series they would probably be a great help.

blackhawk · Post by **blackhawk** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 3:49 pm

Redwolf, there's a song called The Fighting 69th, a Civil War song set to the tune of The Star of the County Down. I don't know if you have time to order it, or what your time frame is, but you can get it from http://www.thefenians.com. If you can't wait that long, I'm just over the hill and can bring it to you if need be. It's also my favorite version of that song. It starts out with the traditional Star of CD and when they finish that, they keep playing and sing the words to the Civil War song.

rosenlof · Post by **rosenlof** » Sat Jan 18, 2003 12:50 am

I've been meaning to do this for quite a while, but I have prepared a small collection of traditional Japanese tunes and transposed them into whistle friendly keys.

Right now, the only format I have available is ABC, you can get the file from http://net.indra.com/~rosenlof/JapaneseSongsAbc.txt

I think they sound really nice on a whistle or wooden flute, but I might be a little biased. I've included lyrics to a couple of the songs as well as my own translations.

Might be of use to some of the other kids at the school.

have fun!

LeeMarsh · Post by **LeeMarsh** » Sat Jan 18, 2003 3:11 am

Redwood, Great topic for the kids!

In addition to song comparisons; you might want to touch on song structures. The AABA form of many Irish airs is reflected in many of the older country and westerns songs. You could also demonstrate some common Irish ornamentation methods, and ask how some are reflected in the melody and singing styles of older songs. You could take a look at some of the common timing and accents found in reels and jigs and relate how these were integrated in to the traditions. You could tie it to historical perspectives to show how irish influences may be been modified by preceeding and following influences, mexican and oriental imigration and integration come to mind.

You might also want to relate the simularities and differences of how theme and tones are manifest. For example seeing how a lament is phrased traditionally and adapted from the tradition. Identifing common emotional values and expressions in the songs can further tie the music together.

Learning to see these connections on all these levels will not only give your students a greater appreciation of a traditional form or root; but will also carry over into to seeing those connections and association in modern genres.

Your students are researching a time when folks entertained themselves with thier music. I hope you find ways not only to expand their intellectual understanding; but, also understand how joy, sorrow, regret, misfortune, humor and all the other aspects of the human condition were expressed and shared in the music.

Perhaps an opportunity to share how you ...

dd · Post by dd » Sun Jan 19, 2003 1:03 am

The Tune to Bold Fenian Men was a song used in Rio Grande, a John Wayne movie does that count?

How about Johnny Has Gone For a Soldier and Shula Aroon, Shule Agra ???? (ARGGGGGH KANT SPELL)hmmmmmm Garyowen......was used by the calvary division under Custer.

Sounds like an INTERESTING project...any chance of posting?

[ This Message was edited by: dd on 2003-01-19 02:08 ]