Tuning Slides

PhilO · Post by **PhilO** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 2:10 pm

Hope this is not a stupid question/topic, but I'm somewhat in the dark as to frequent mention on the Board of PTFE tape and now beeswax with respect to tuning slides. All tuneable whistles I've owned, metal, wood, plastic, have had no reason for any such extraneous substances to properly use and maintain the slides. Every slide has been either plastic (PVC)or metal (sterling silver, brass, aluminum) and the tolerances have been such that the slides work properly and hold just right (not too loose or too tight)when extended. Contrary to what some others have experienced, my Abells have no problems in this regard. One of my Copelands is a bit tight but that is addressed easily and effectively with a small amount of vaseline applied only to the slide (as recommended by maker). Once, 10 years ago I had one wooden whistle with brass slide that was a bit too loose when extended. Since I play mostly alone, I guess I just played it all the way in.

Correction, I just checked 2 wooden whistles by Sweet and the slides do have a red tape around the slide; I guess that's the tape being referred to? The slides work perfectly BTW, but I neither use these whistles much nor use the slide out when I do, as they are in tune when not extended. No slight to the whistles; both are fine (one is an extraordinary KIlhory African blackwood C).

I find generally that my Copelands are in tune with the slides out about 3/16"; Abells closed; O'Riordans closed; Grinters closed; BUsman opened about 1/8", etc.

Regards,

Philo

Wandering_Whistler · Post by **Wandering_Whistler** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 2:32 pm

My Copeland is also a bit tight...it's a lot easier to move about if I use a bit of cork grease. Likewise, like you, my sweet has something red on the tuning slide, but it looks to me a lot like some kind of felt or thread..in any case, it's pretty lose, and I've addded a layer of teflon tape to snug it up.

The only instruments I own right now that I really like the tuning slides on are my burkes (even though they have the weird "o-ring on the internal part" thing going) and my Susato A. Both of these use O-Ring slides. I use cork grease on both to make it easier to move about, but once the whistle's set where I want it, the o-rings 'grab' a little, and they don't move easily.

tuaz · Post by **tuaz** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 10:40 pm

My tunable Overton low D and F have teflon tape at the joint. I've only needed to tune the low D slightly and it was a lot of work because the joint was very tight and the barrel was so smooth. Now that it's in tune, I'm not touching it again.

The other whistles I have (low end, or whistles with brass slides), I just use (if I have to, which is very seldom) Selmer 'cork grease', which is actually a gooey pink fluid in a small plastic bottle. I never thought about whether it was petroleum-based, but now after all the posts, I'm a bit concerned about applying it on my soft plastic Dixons which so far haven't needed lubrication.

serpent · Post by **serpent** » Sun Jan 12, 2003 10:57 pm

I think it all has to do with how the slides are made. Some of the makers use commercial slip-fit brass tubing, which is inherently high-dimensional-accuracy material. Some use coatings, some use cork or thread, some use grease, and some don't. I machine my own slides in the brass, and since I want one head to fit multiple whistles, allow for a little extra "breathing room", i.e. versus commercial tubing with 0.0005 tolerances, mine are more like 0.002 +/- 0.0005 (inches). That means either swaging the head, which could mean it not fitting all bodies, or using something with a bit of "give" - the PTFE.

Well, I didn't like the PTFE, and neither did one of my reviewers, so I decided that, rather than continue to subject my users to it, I'd find a better alternative. That alternative is beeswax. It can be built up to eliminate the minute differences in clearances, and it gives an absolutely perfect air seal - something no non-lubricated metal-to-metal joint can do and still be movable.

I don't know that it's grist for any sort of big controversy - we all find methods of making the slipjoints on our instruments work for us, and try to engineer something easy for the user, maintainable, and not too onerous to use - mobile while having enough "hold" that the thing doesn't slide loose and drop your barrel in your lap during a session!

But if I made wooden whistles, I'd use cork-in-wood joints!

Cheers,
~*~

Serpie-Pie

Cyfiawnder · Post by **Cyfiawnder** » Mon Jan 13, 2003 1:01 am

I've notice that a lot depends on the length of the slide itself. When I first made a tunable whistle The collar was only 1.5" and since I wanted it firmly attached to the barrel of the whistle that only left me with 3/4" to use as the actual slide. Once the slide was properly adjusted to get the whsitle in tune, the joint was a bit wobbly. It did not affect the sound that I noticed but it looked funny. Now I uses a Full 2 Inch Collar with 1" around the Barrel and another inch to use as the tuning sleave, and that made the whistle feel a lot more stable. Except for my Bass Bb I think that since that damn thing is So long, It needs a bit more grip to keep things in the strait and narrow. I too use PTFE or Teflon Tape. Personally I think it WORKS great but It looks a bit ..."chincy." I've been making some inqueries about instrument cork. I may have found a place where I can purchase it in sheets. I still have to go look to see how thick it is...

brewerpaul · Post by **brewerpaul** » Mon Jan 13, 2003 6:07 am

I use commercially available telescoping brass tubing which is usually a pretty loose fit. In order to fix this, I have to expand the inner tube to snug things up. Still needs to be adjusted sometimes.
Bill, a cork joint would be terrific, and works terrifically on thicker walled recorders. However, the walls of most wooden whistles are too thin to accomodate the cork.

Zubivka · Post by **Zubivka** » Mon Jan 13, 2003 6:35 am

Ah...
A Neo-Baroque Cloisonné Serpent, huh, reckhissle, er, whistlorder?

PhilO · Post by **PhilO** » Mon Jan 13, 2003 10:54 am

Ok, Zub, yet another incentive to stay on this Board forever - I figure some day I may actually understand all that you say (heh, heh...):lol: I thought I had it finally last week, but...

Philo