Mary Bergin

[pipersgrip]

Listen Guru, I know you don't want to take this to proctology do you??!! Only kidding, I know this argument is all in good fun. I understand fully what you are asking, and it is a great question. I am just not the one to explain, I have difficulty explaining stuff on a forums.

[MTGuru]

Listen Guru, I know you don't want to take this to proctology do you??!!

Lord, no. I'd end up attacking myself.

Seriously ... I understand what you're saying, and was kind of where you're at, when I first got re-interested in Irish trad; my first two CD buys were Solas and Lúnasa.

[hoopy mike]

Mary Bergin is a great old school player.

Please define "old school".

I've heard she does gigs at many old schools (Eton, Harrow, etc) and she's great.

[FJohnSharp]

I kind of think, based on the Feadoga Stain albums, that Mary does more tongueing than Kevin does in general.

[Guinness]

... Bergin's playing is as subtle and complex as anyone's. The magic of anyone's playing is always in the details.

This is it. It's not really feasible to characterize stylistic differences with just a few broad generalizations. There's a lot going on.

Try playing one of Mary's tunes (or any one of your favorite players) note for note and record it when you think you're close to achieving the same sound. Then play it back, compare, and you'll know how much you missed.

[NicoMoreno]

Agreed, Guinness, and that's basically what I meant. Hopefully with two people saying it, the point and gist of it will get across better!

You may listen and think you *did* get it all. But chances are, after some time, you'll realize how far off you were.

To address breqwas: I don't agree that you can get all her "ornaments" perfect either, because I don't believe that they can be described as just a cut or a tap here or there. There's tonguing with the cut, breathing just the right way, maybe a pause right before or something different. So to me the so called ornaments are better described as articulation (which was mentioned) and are integral to the music and the tune.

To address TWC: As far as the Bothy Band being old school and your comments about Mary.... I have to echo the . As MTGuru put it, it's an example, but what he didn't say was that it's also wrong! I'd suggest you go back and listen a little better and a little more and try to understand what's going on in Mary's and Kevin's playing. Don't assume you understand it already, but rather listen to them, slow them down if you have to, but try to match the sound, without reading music, without trying to apply the "cut goes here, roll goes here, always" ideas. Trying to match their playing will be the fastest but more importantly the most accurate way of learning what they're doing. As Guinness says, record, listen, improve.

[Infernaltootler]

Mary is fab, but for a newbie like me, scary.

When I'd been playing a while I got her Feadoga Stain 1 and nearly cried when I heard it. I can appreciate that no matter how much I practise there is no way I can achieve that level.

Listening to it now after 6 months more practise and I don't cry any more. I'm still in awe though and I really wish I could meet her. I understand she takes great pleasure in teaching.

[hoopy mike]

...I understand she takes great pleasure in teaching.

Yes, she does, especially at old schools...

[riverman]

( just a small IMHO, to dilute the numerous whistle threads with a whistling one )

THANKS for that!

[kenny]

"Bothy Band" first album - 1975.
Mary's 1st - 1979 ?
That's "old" ?

[Denny]

we're all old....dang kids

[pipersgrip]

"Bothy Band" first album - 1975.
Mary's 1st - 1979 ?
That's "old" ?

Older than most Irish bands out there.

[MTGuru]

I think Kenny's suggesting that the whole concept of an "Irish band" or Celtic band of the kind you mean is a very recent phenomenon, going back at most to Ó Ríada (1950s) and the folk-rock groups of the 1960s-70s. There's an awful lot of trad history under the bridge before that.

Ask Kenny about Silly Wizard. He ought to know.

[kenny]

Not really, MTguru - just being reminded about my age

[breqwas]

Speaking of Silly Wizard... Oh, let's speak about Silly Wizard! Never tired of speaking about Sully WIzard. Did I ever mention that I love Silly Wizard more than any other irish or scottish band? OK, speaking of Silly Wizard...

Hmm. That's a Mary Bergin thread, not Silly Wizard. And I cant make a revolt, as it was me who made it. Hmm.

I know! I should make a new one!!!


*whistling*
G|A2e efg|e2B dBG