So why the Boehm system at all?

[bowjest]

Perhaps a newbie question, but realizing that multi-keyed wood flutes are fully chromatic, why did the Boehm system come about at all (and overtake the traditional wood flute)?

Was it a cost thing? Or was it just better intonated? Or did practicality win the day? I'm just assuming that it's easier to mass produce cylindrical bore, metal flutes than it is conical bore, wooden flutes?

I've done a bit of reading on this, but seem to find more stuff about the Boehm system than about why it really came about.

[Cork]

I can appreciate your sense of inquiry. Yet, perhaps some things could be better understood by experience, than by any theory. That is, compare both the "simple" and the Boehm systems for yourself, please. By doing so, moreover, perhaps one could come to a finer understanding as to how and why the simple system flute could have become favored by those who could establish ITM flute playing.

;-)

[Jumbuk]

I suggest reading Terry McGee's extensive and fascinating historical work at http://www.mcgee-flutes.com/. Go to the contents page, scroll right down, and be prepared for several hours at your computer!

From my own limited knowledge, I can say:

- Boehm flutes were actually more expensive when they first came out, due to the silver content and the complex key system. They won out in the long run, so there must have been design features that spelled out significant advantages. I think the larger holes meant that they were louder - this was one feature.

- I have picked up a Boehm flute occasionally - I never studied flute, so I can't play one, but I can appreciate straight away the ease of getting a nice tone and the gentle touch needed to finger various key combinations. My guess is that it would be much easier to learn to play across all keys (scales that is).

- From listening to classical players, I think the Boehm has a wider range, particularly above the staff. However, the classical wooden flutists went pretty high as well!

As others have said, the main reason why the simple system flute was adopted by ITM players was that the exodus of classical players to the Boehm system created a supply of cheap wooden flutes that no one else wanted. Kind of like in the 1980's when the first digital synthesisers and drum machines became available, the pro musicians unloaded their old analogue gear. It was snapped up second hand by poorer amateurs who then went on to invent hip-hop, electro etc. The prices went back up again!

[jemtheflute]

Pretty good answers above.

Reading Boehm's own Treatise is a rather good way of getting to understand what he was about(!) - the (perceived)problem, the task he set himself, the way he tackled it and the reasoning behind the upshot. You'll also learn quite a bit about flute acoustics and mechanisms in the process. Quite readable and not lengthy either. Rockstro is also informative (especially on the development of mechanisms) despite the well known edge to his account! Any of the standard histories of the flute - Bate, Powell et al. at least skate over the relevant stuff, though not necessarily with the technical depth one might wish. Robin Jakeways Hootz, Hertz & Harmonics articles (available on the website of Pan magazine, the Journal of The British Flute Society), whilst not about the mechanics of Boehm and derived systems, also give one a good grasp of how flutes work - and therefore why they may be configured and constructed in certain ways, with what results from what variables. Worth reading for any player of any kind of flute.

[Cork]

...As others have said, the main reason why the simple system flute was adopted by ITM players was that the exodus of classical players to the Boehm system created a supply of cheap wooden flutes that no one else wanted...

True, apparently the then new Boehm flute could cause a surplus of older, simple system wood flutes, but then, perhaps the Irish were not there to snap up a bargain, but rather perhaps the simple system flute could have been well suited to the traditional music of Ireland, eh? And, just look at what the Irish then did with such a flute! Well, history was, is, and could yet be made, on no less than a bargain of a flute, eh?

;-)

[Jumbuk]

...As others have said, the main reason why the simple system flute was adopted by ITM players was that the exodus of classical players to the Boehm system created a supply of cheap wooden flutes that no one else wanted...

True, apparently the then new Boehm flute could cause a surplus of older, simple system wood flutes, but then, perhaps the Irish were not there to snap up a bargain, but rather perhaps the simple system flute could have been well suited to the traditional music of Ireland, eh? And, just look at what the Irish then did with such a flute! Well, history was, is, and could yet be made, on no less than a bargain of a flute, eh?

I should have added: the simple system would represent little new fingering to learn for those already familiar with whistles and pipes.

[Cork]

...As others have said, the main reason why the simple system flute was adopted by ITM players was that the exodus of classical players to the Boehm system created a supply of cheap wooden flutes that no one else wanted...

True, apparently the then new Boehm flute could cause a surplus of older, simple system wood flutes, but then, perhaps the Irish were not there to snap up a bargain, but rather perhaps the simple system flute could have been well suited to the traditional music of Ireland, eh? And, just look at what the Irish then did with such a flute! Well, history was, is, and could yet be made, on no less than a bargain of a flute, eh?

;-)

I should have added: the simple system would represent little new fingering to learn for those already familiar with whistles and pipes.

I'll go with that, but I honestly doubt that it was the small money which attracted the Irish to simple system flutes, while perhaps those same flutes could just happen to fit well with their ongoing music, for instance.

[bowjest]

Thanks for the very informative replies.

I guess my question now would be: But surely ITM existed before the wooden flute as we currently know it (with keys)?

When does the timeline begin for what we now all know as ITM?

[Cork]

Thanks for the very informative replies.

I guess my question now would be: But surely ITM existed before the wooden flute as we currently know it (with keys)?

When does the timeline begin for what we now all know as ITM?

To be honest, you've just asked one great question.

As far as I am aware, recorded as written Irish music goes only to about early in the eighteenth century, to perhaps 1725 or thereabouts.

Yet, apparently music existed in Ireland then, and likely before that time!

And, could you or anybody else provide even a faint clue as to what Irish music could have been like before that time, then perhaps I could assure you that many others could also care to know, please!

[peeplj]

Boehm was inspired to begin developing his new flute design after he heard Charles Nicholson play, and was impressed with his strength of tone and projection.

The goal of the design of the Boehm flute was to give each chromatic note of the scale its own tone hole, spaced and sized on the bore according to what is acoustically correct rather than merely what the fingers could reach or cover.

This would have the effect of improving the intonation of the flute with itself across different key signatures. The voicing, or the sound quality of each note would be as nearly as possible the same as that of the other notes of the scale; this is actually one of the Big Differences between the two kinds of flutes and deserves a closer look...

In trad tunes, you see the same "building blocks" used again and again in different tunes. One of my favorites is the "rocking pedal," where a series of notes is alternates around a drone note. And there is one of these that is instantly recognizable on just about any wooden flute: the figure g2dg egdg is instantly recognizable on almost any Irish flute because of the very different sounds of the d and e notes.

On the Boehm system flute, you can certainly play that figure with agility, but the difference in the d and e are lost, and with it much of the "flavor" of that nice little rocking pedal is lost as well, at least to my admittedly prejudiced ears.

Boehm didn't quite achieve his goals...any flute is a series of compromises, and his is no exception, but there are only a few notes in the over three octave range of the Boehm flute that need special treatment, so he did get awfully close to his goal.

Middle C-sharp tends to be very sharp on the Boehm flute, and also has a slightly different timbre, because its hole also has to double as the octave vent for D. Third-octave E-natural is a problem, as is third-octave F-sharp, both because of peculiarities in the mechanism not allowing quite everything to be vented that needs to be.

The Boehm flute is a very projective instrument--at least, given both a quality flute and an experienced player, so much so that Wagner (the "Ride of the Valkyries" guy) didn't care for the Boehm flute, and called it a "sound cannon." It tends to cut through the woodwinds of the orchestra and be heard, which contrasts with the wooden flute, which tended to blend nicely with the other woodwinds of the orchestra.

Now the range of the two kinds of flutes are roughly equivalent. Charanga players routinely take the wooden simple-system flute into the fourth octave, for instance. And pretty much any music that can be played on the one kind of flute can also be played on the other....well, except for some modern "special effect" pieces that depend upon peculiarities of the Boehm flute for special sounds, like key slaps.

I enjoy playing both kinds of flutes. They are different instruments to me, and I take a different approach with each.

--James

[flutey1]

As far as I am aware, recorded as written Irish music goes only to about early in the eighteenth century, to perhaps 1725 or thereabouts.

Yet, apparently music existed in Ireland then, and likely before that time!

And, could you or anybody else provide even a faint clue as to what Irish music could have been like before that time, then perhaps I could assure you that many others could also care to know, please!

Not quite what it sounded like, but apparently it was just as good :

In 1183 the Welsh historian, Giraldus Cambrensis, visited Ireland for two years and wrote his book Topographica Hibernaie. He scathingly described the 'barbarians' he encountered there, criticizing their apparent lack of industry, disinterest in urban life, and love of liberty and leisure. Despite this he provided a very detailed account of the musicians, including the first record of a musical performance in Ireland. He noted that: "I find among these people commendable diligence only on musical instruments, on which they are incomparably more skilled than any other nation I have seen. Their style is quick and lively. It is remarkable that, with such rapid fingerwork, the musical rhythm is maintained and that, by unfailingly disciplined art, the integrity of the tune is fully preserved throughout the ornate rhythms and the profusely intricate polyphony."

(quote from Ó hAllmhuráin, Pocket History of Irish Traditional Music)

[s1m0n]

I have a theory which observes that in cultures which use simple-system flutes (Ireland, India, China, for example) to the extent that flute-playing is or was a gendered activity, it was male. In co. Clare ('source' musicians interviewed during the mid century folk revival often described a social order during their parents' generation in which men played flute or fiddle and women played concertina) and China (at least some of the chinese flute styles were 'male' instruments) I've noticed this tendency, although there is ample contrary examples.

Since Boehm, however, the reverse has tended to be true, at least here in the great nation-state of Generica. In nearly every school band I've ever seen, girls dominate the flute section, and I'm sure we've all experienced the subtle insinuation that flute players are of suspect machismo.

I suspect that the reason for this shift is that, before boehm, it was a lot harder to get good tone out of a flute: Nicholson's career provides proof that flute playing rewarded those with big hands and powerful lungs.

After Boehm, that was no longer the truth: anyone can play a flute. Neither size nor strength matter to any appreciable extent.

[peeplj]

After Boehm, that was no longer the truth: anyone can play a flute. Neither size nor strength matter to any appreciable extent.

Perhaps not size, but strength, certainly.

Irish flutists play flute with maybe at most fifteen to twenty musicians in the biggest sessions.

Orchestral flutists have to be able to push their sound out over from one hundred to two hundred other orchestral instruments including brasswinds.

That takes serious strength, not to mention lips that could stop a buzzsaw!

Seriously, session musicians simply never have to think in terms of that kind of volume and power. Only orchestral flutists face that particular challenge.

--James

[flutey1]

although flute sections in concert bands tend to be dominated by females these days, the pros are much more split. it used to be that those were dominated by men, but maybe now it's more 50-50. I don't really think it has much to do with the size or strength required for the instrument. it's probably something more to do with social construction and gender roles... any sociologists want to comment?

[Gabriel]

Just a side note:

http://comhaltas.ie/music/detail/comhal ... lly_mccom/

Joannie Madden is playing a Böhm flute there.