Missed my big chance!

irish69 · Post by **irish69** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 4:38 am

West Coast?!

Ahhhhhhhhhh!

jemtheflute · Post by **jemtheflute** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:57 am

Denny wrote:yeah Jem....you're up for impersonating a Californian

Equally incredible! And then there's the gender thing - I may have had a somewhat androgynous appearance in my late teens and 20s (late 1970s into 80s, though I am too young to have been a "hippy" - wasn't a teenager in the 60s!), but I doubt anyone would mistake me for a wench these days. Or was the "impersonation" by dint of all that sweet reasonableness and caring encouragement on the "Table Legs" Thread?

Incidentally, we have a chain of "sports" wear shops in Britain called "JB Sports", FWIW.

hmmm, ya are west coastish

Mmmmm. Distinct lack of sunny weather/disposition round these parts, though. And the actual West Coast is a good hour-and-a-half's drive from me. (Barmouth, if anyone wants to Google-Map N. Wales. I'm just outside Wrexham - aim the bombs for the town and you'll miss me nicely but no-one will miss it

)

Denny · Post by **Denny** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 8:49 am

jemtheflute wrote:
Denny wrote:yeah Jem....you're up for impersonating a Californian
Equally incredible!

I agree....found it rather odd. Sorry about the missing the hippy thing.

Denny wrote:hmmm, ya are west coastish

jemtheflute wrote:Mmmmm. Distinct lack of sunny weather/disposition round these parts, though.

Many of us suffer from that misunderstanding.
2°C raining, here, about 125 km from the coast, over four hours.

Mutepointe is in West Virginia.....go figure

Cathy Wilde · Post by **Cathy Wilde** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 9:16 am

So this Lab walks into a Pakistani flute shop ...

Thanks, Doc. That's the funniest thing I've heard in ages!

Denny · Post by **Denny** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:30 am

Cat's Location wrote:Somewhere Off-Topic, probably

srt19170 · Post by **srt19170** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:58 am

Okay, I get all the snarking, but to me this seems like a lost opportunity.

Why not meet with the fellow and spend a little time showing him a decent flute and discussing with him the possibilities for improving his product? He's a businessman and might be quite open to collaborating to improve his product. Of course he's churning out shlock $75 flutes because that's where the market is right now. But if you could convince him that there's a potential market for a decent $200 flute, who knows what could develop? Or is everyone here certain in their hearts that Pakistani craftsmen could never build a decent instrument?

jemtheflute · Post by **jemtheflute** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 12:07 pm

srt19170 wrote:Okay, I get all the snarking, but to me this seems like a lost opportunity.

Why not meet with the fellow and spend a little time showing him a decent flute and discussing with him the possibilities for improving his product? He's a businessman and might be quite open to collaborating to improve his product. Of course he's churning out shlock $75 flutes because that's where the market is right now. But if you could convince him that there's a potential market for a decent $200 flute, who knows what could develop? Or is everyone here certain in their hearts that Pakistani craftsmen could never build a decent instrument?

"Snarking" aside, (Denny and I weren't really, you know - just having an off-topic badinage - pace Rob!) have you read through the more recent bits on the Sticky? Alright, I was talking to an Indian producer, but I think pretty much the same issues pertain. You are right, I'm sure, that with suitable input these guys could produce something very decent - but (and it really is weird) they don't seem to want to! I reckon they could produce very usable instruments for pretty much the same cost as the duff ones - it wouldn't involve significantly better materials or tooling or skills, just the direction to do the job right!

Denny · Post by **Denny** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 12:23 pm

Might have better luck with the Chinese.

no....I wasn't kidding

Cathy Wilde · Post by **Cathy Wilde** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 12:29 pm

Denny wrote:
Cat's Location wrote:Somewhere Off-Topic, probably

Mr. Pot,

Moi? MOI?

XO,
Ms. Kettle.

Denny · Post by **Denny** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 12:57 pm

aw...thanks

bud · Post by **bud** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:52 am

Jem wrote:
I was talking to an Indian producer, but I think pretty much the same issues pertain. You are right, I'm sure, that with suitable input these guys could produce something very decent - but (and it really is weird) they don't seem to want to! I reckon they could produce very usable instruments for pretty much the same cost as the duff ones - it wouldn't involve significantly better materials or tooling or skills, just the direction to do the job right!
_________________

Not all that weird, really. They don't because they have no motivation. They continue to produce crap for the same reaons that Hollywood continues to turn out crummy films--they sell very well to the undiscerning. The late author Alexander King was speaking with a TV producer and complainng about the abysmal quality of programs. The producer admitted the charge, but compelled King to admit that once in a very great while, TV producers actually presented something of quality worth watching. The producer ended by saying, "Well, just remember this: we don't have to!"

springrobin · Post by **springrobin** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:31 am

In many parts of the world, production of large quantities of poor quality goods is a good business practice- sort of like counterfeiting. What might be criminal, unethical or at least questionable over here is tolerated and even encouraged in developing nations because it puts money in pockets- if only government ones. Mr. Pakistani Pimp will continue to have a market for substandard goods as long as stores like Lark in the Morning continue to sell them.

Doc- I have 3 labs- do you make housecalls?

jemtheflute · Post by **jemtheflute** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:18 am

springrobin wrote:I have 3 labs

What do you test in 'em?

Being more serious, we all (I think) understand the point you and others make about the 3rd World business perspective - but what puzzles me and others is the unwillingness to even contemplate trying to make a cheap, low quality product that actually works tolerably as opposed to going on insisting on making one that doesn't work at all. The fact that they can successfully make a profit on the latter should not preclude them understanding that they could easily make a better profit on the former!

Doc Jones · Post by **Doc Jones** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 10:38 am

srt19170 wrote:Okay, I get all the snarking, but to me this seems like a lost opportunity.

Why not meet with the fellow and spend a little time showing him a decent flute and discussing with him the possibilities for improving his product? He's a businessman and might be quite open to collaborating to improve his product.

No doubt he would.

Were I a flute maker myself I suppose I could cut my own throat by giving him my plans, but cutting the throats of the fine fellows already whittling tooters for me seems like a fairly bad idea.

Besides I had a cold sore and couldn't have played his crummy flute anyway. And then, of course, there was the lure of those anal glands...hard to pass up an opportunity like that! Sometimes I even get some of the stuff in my eye!

All in all, I think I chose the most appealing of the two options.

Doc

Casey Burns · Post by **Casey Burns** » Thu Jan 31, 2008 5:13 pm

Well I just got a phone call from this same Pakistani traveling Pratten flute salesman, who wanted to come visit me and discuss business with me - that is, me selling his flutes. I explained to him that I was not at all interested in reselling his flutes and that I was in the business of making and selling my own, not someone else's, and why would I want to sell someone else's flutes? He seemed to either not understand this concept (perhaps its the idea that an American actually produces something tangible instead of just moving electrons from one place to another that he's having a hard time getting his head around) and persisted until I simply had to say in simpler terms that I was not interested, period, goodbye. He was pretty insistent and kept trying. He then asked about some music store that he had a name for, but a disconnected number and if I had their number. Wish I could help you, etc. but you might try directory assistance.

Might have been interesting to meet this person and a flutemaker from a different part of the world but I didn't really want to encourage him or lead him on, or take the time and energy. Be interesting to see if he makes contact with anyone else out here on the west coast, not that there are that many of us making flutes out here. My guess is that he's going from music store to music store and trying to find a market.

Casey