What do you say?

straycat82 · Post by **straycat82** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:36 pm

A very prominent family in our local community has recently made the decision to leave us. Though I have been very close with this family, it still hit me much harder than I would ever have expected when I got the message.

They are not physically going away, just not coming around anymore... I think that's what hurts the most.

I've heard bits and pieces from others about what the reasons are for this family making the choice to no longer be an active part of our community but rather than speculate and try to discern the gossip from truth I've decided that I would rather just talk with them. I don't doubt their reasons for leaving and I know it's not a decision they would have made lightly but have a difficult time with the fact that they are just throwing in the towel. I do have some insight as to their position and from my (limited) understanding my heart tells me that if they wanted to, they could work things out. I feel that if I were to address these issues specifically I'd be overstepping boundaries.

Now, the mother and father are about 15 years my senior and their two boys are 10-15 years younger than me. I've served along side the mother for many years in different capacities and feel the closest to her; she has been a mentor and a friend. The youngest son is the sweetest kid I've ever known, he genuinely loves everything and everyone around him.

I love this family but due to the differences in age and having viewed them as elders and authority figures in my younger days I can't help but feeling like I'm over-stepping my bounds by sticking my nose in.

When someone has already made the decision to leave, do you think it is a good thing to tell them how badly you wish them to stay, how much they have meant and will be missed? Or is this just a selfish thing that will make what they feel has to be done, harder to do?

I've been sick about this all day. I still can't believe it's hit me so hard.

evenstr · Post by **evenstr** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:51 pm

If I were you, I wouldn't beg them to stay, but I would tell them how much you'll miss them. Maybe you could send them a card or something. Just make it known that you respect their choice (which I think you do, based on the post). You don't want them to feel guilty. You also might want to say something like "Feel free to come visit any time." It might make you feel better if you know you can stay in touch. Hope that helps.

mutepointe · Post by **mutepointe** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:03 pm

i agree. i hope things turn out the best for everyone.

i don't know the details (you were a bit vague and that's probably for the good.) over the years, my wife and i have moved lots of times or had to cut back on activities for one reason for another.

don't give full credit to the gossip. everyone in our neighborhood thought we had gotten a divorce when my wife walked the dog by herself while i had heart surgery and recovered. they also barged into our house one day thinking that we were moving. the u-haul truck in our driveway was filled with furniture from grandma's house.

i hope you still get to see this family. the special people in our lives matter greatly, especially as we get older.

Innocent Bystander · Post by **Innocent Bystander** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:09 pm

Not to pry, but:

What do you mean by "Us"? What exactly do you mean by "your community"? Is this a Church, a School, or what? It surely can't just be a neighbourhood - or they would be there, by being there in a geographical sense.

My own "community" was riven by a disagreement (and bad behaviour) between two members about three years ago. Some people wanted nothing to do with it and made themselves scarce. Others tended to fall into two camps. A few, like me, did our best to keep things going. Three years and it still hasn't come near to recovery. That's human beings for you.

Edited to say:

But as My old Mother used to say: Speak the truth and shame the devil.
Tell them you'll miss them. Ask them why they've chosen to go.
What they tell you may change your view of your own community.

anniemcu · Post by **anniemcu** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:13 pm

When someone has already made the decision to leave, do you think it is a good thing to tell them how badly you wish them to stay, how much they have meant and will be missed? Or is this just a selfish thing that will make what they feel has to be done, harder to do?

Yes, it is indeed a good thing to tell them how much you wish they felt comfortable enough to stay, and certainly let them know how much they have meant to you, and how much you will miss them. Just be honest. Don't put any requirement on response from them, and don't try to coerce them in to changing their minds, just let them know how much they have meant in your life and that you appreciate that very much. You might ask if you can keep in touch with them, but don't beg, wheedle, cojole, manipulate or prevaricate.

djm · Post by **djm** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:49 pm

Now, before they go, would be a good time to remind them of the money they still owe you, unless you owe them, in which case, now would be a good time for you to make yourself scarce.

djm

emmline · Post by **emmline** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 3:49 pm

It's hard to know how to address the question because I have to guess at definitions.
What does community mean here? What are the activities of the community from which these people have chosen to withdraw? Is it an ideological/theological or personal morality/ethics issue?

But, as Mute suggested, your instinct for remaining vague probably has legitimate cause, so I'm not prying--just allowing as how advice is going to have to be similarly vague.

For whatever reason, the question makes me think of a situation with a particular brother of my husband who has chosen, for the past several years, to be estranged from his elderly mother and his 4 siblings and their families (all of whom have remained very close with each other.)
This brother, whom I will call C, has a wife and son--roughly the age of my son--all of whom have been valued family members, but because C's wife reasonably chooses to support C, we don't see them either.

The cause, if I attempt to state it from what I understand to be C's point of view, is that C feels unfairly excluded from a family business. The other 4 sibs' pov, across the board, is that C's proposal that he serve as a consultant at limited hours and full pay did not constitute a fair work/compensation ratio. 2 of the sibs had independently elected to pursue other careers and not take part in the business, but they share the pov of the 2 sibs who did take over the business.

Those of us who no longer get to see C and his family must accept this. We cannot grant his demands, because we view them as unreasonable, but we still very much miss having him as an active part of the family, and particularly regret that our sons have missed their teen years together.

So, what's my long-winded point? I guess that whatever has driven this family to withdraw from your community must be something very real and important to them. And even if the collective rest of you can't understand it, it may be completely beyond your power to change their point of view.
What we do, is continue to send our Christmas updates and whatnot to C and family, so they'll realize that we have not excluded them--the alienation is their choice.
So, you make it known that you're there if they need you, and you value them...but beyond that, they have their own problems to work out, and their own path to tread, and it may or may not include you.

straycat82 · Post by **straycat82** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:17 pm

Sorry to be so vague but I'm not looking for opinions on rights and wrongs or conflict resolution. Perhaps I should have just posed the question without the background info.

When someone has already made the decision to leave, do you think it is a good thing to tell them how badly you wish them to stay, how much they have meant and will be missed? Or is this just a selfish thing that will make what they feel has to be done, harder to do?

The family is not leaving on bad terms with anyone, has not done anything wrong, nor have they been wronged. There was some drama and the situation was a little ugly for a while but is more or less resolved though healing may take some time. Due to the circumstances that will remain vague, they feel that it is best for them and the community if they plug in elsewhere. I am sad that they feel there is no other way but I do know their character well enough to appreciate their decision.

I'm concerned about finding the balance between being a supportive friend in this tough time and not coming off as pushing to change minds or attitudes.

Thanks for the serious comments and insights, I appreciate the words shared.

As for the jokes, I'm sorry but I don't find it funny today.

fearfaoin · Post by **fearfaoin** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:18 pm

Innocent Bystander wrote:What do you mean by "Us"? What exactly do you mean by "your community"? Is this a Church, a School, or what?

I think straycat82 was wise to keep that vague, despite lack of
clarity, because it could color the discussion. Also, he may not
wish the Internet public at large to know what circles he runs in...

Johnny, I think this family would be quite touched if you
communicate to them how much they will be missed. They might
not realize their impact on the community in question. Perhaps,
at the very least, you can retain a relationship with the family
outside of the community.

BillChin · Post by **BillChin** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 4:50 pm

These days, this is an average event. The average American family physically moves every seven years. Young folks even more often. That helps keep it in perspective.

Tell them or don't tell them, it matters not. Email, Internet forums, FaceBook and other websites can keep people in touch. If they are choosing to cut all ties and avoid any future communication, that seems harsh, but it does happen, and if a person chooses that, the other persons involved usually can't change that.

If it were me, I would bless them, wish them well, and keep moving. Life is too short to live in the past, or with regrets. The decisions involved going forward are trivialities. There is no right or wrong as far as what to say or not say, do or not do.

sbfluter · Post by **sbfluter** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 5:58 pm

It sounds like the church/family/neighborhood thing I got caught up in when I was about 20. It was awful. People suspected me of things I didn't do. I lost my friends. I lost the trust of people I had grown up with and basically found myself embroiled in something that had nothing to do with me. The only thing I could do was move away, so I did that.

But I had to work at my job with some members of the other family. That was very uncomfortable. One day I brought up The Issue when business was slow and it was that time of day where we just wipe down tables, sweep and restock things. It was like floodgates opened. We talked and laughed and got it all out. All us "kids" caught up in a family drama that we should have seen all those 15 years but didn't and shouldn't even be part of but now were. Anyway, we realized after talking that it wasn't about us "kids", so if the "adults" wanted to do whatever they wanted to do, let them. As a result, I got a few of my friends back, but the rift had already been made.

Eventually, years later, much of this did not matter anymore. We enjoy Christmases, weddings, funerals and everything all together. To this day I still feel separate from almost everyone, except for my mom, who was the main instigator of all this, which is strange, but nobody knows how anything will turn out in the end.

What was really important in the end was not who did what to whom but that now people were happy.

CHasR · Post by **CHasR** » Thu Sep 13, 2007 7:14 pm

Living in the big city has completely de-sensitized me to your particular discontent, topic starter. I havent spoken to my next-door neighbor in about 3 1/2 years, and I dont feel like its any great loss. People come and go on a regular basis here, they keep to themselves and/or socialize with neighbors as they see fit. Ive waved to people on my block for years without knowing their name. Yet, we all seem happy and fullfilled. If a neighbor I knew suddenly stopped waving / talking/ being visible, I would think: Well that's their business, Im sure they have a good reason for their behavior. End of story.

I would be absolutely 110% terrified to live in your community. I simply cant conceive of a society where such action would carry such grave consequences.

Please, accept my apologies if Ive offended you in any way.
I really, honestly, sincerely hope that all turns out in the best possible way for you, and all parties concerned.

CountryKitty · Post by **CountryKitty** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 5:41 am

John, the particulars of the situation don't matter. All that matters is that people you care about are hurt.

Go to them, let them know that you're not fishing for information and not trying to barge in or change their minds, but simply wanted them to know how much they mean to you on a personal level and that you don't want to lose touch. And that the ONLY reason you hadn't already said so was that you were worried about possibly offending them giving the impression that you were barging in, and possibly losing their respect and friendship, which means a great deal to you.

They will be glad to know you care.