Hall Crystal Flute vs. Olwell Bamboo

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 6:53 am

Anyone ever compare the Hall Crystal Flute in D with an Olwell Bamboo? I have the Hall, rather like it, but just seem to keep dreaming about the Olwell...

However, I hate to spend the $80 or so if it is not a significant jump up in sound/quality.

Any advice?

ChrisLaughlin · Post by **ChrisLaughlin** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 9:03 am

There is really no contest here. If you want a flute that sounds and plays like an Irish flute but doesn't cost as much the Olwell is the way to go.
Best,
Chris

JessieK · Post by **JessieK** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 10:16 am

This is funny.

I agree with Chris. The Olwell Bamboo is at least 76-81 times better than the Hall crystal flutes.

Jessie

Ron Rowe · Post by **Ron Rowe** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 10:42 am

Okay, I need to make a decision this week, how does the Owell Bamboo compare to the dixon 3 piece?

tin tin · Post by **tin tin** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 12:22 pm

Well, having at one point owned both, I'll give this a stab: the Dixon is a turned conical bore instrument and thus behaves and sounds much like a wood Irish flute, while the Olwell is more of a cylindrical instrument (although not perfectly so). Both are very well intonated and are fairly easy blowing instruments. The Olwell has large tone holes and a pretty serious stretch between some of them, whereas the Dixon has small toneholes with an easy reach. The Dixon is nigh well indestructible, which makes it a great travel/play anytime instrument. The Olwell has a quicker response to tonguing than the Dixon, since the bamboo is thinner than the polymer (Brian Finnegan makes amazing use of this responsiveness when he plays with Flook.) The Dixon's balance leans towards the head end of the flute, since it has a short D foot and the headjoint is the heaviest part; the Olwell's balance is more centered. The Olwell does not break down like the Dixon, and therefore is not as portable.
I really can't say which is absolutely better; I like both...they both play well and sound good, but you'll probably eventually want to upgrade to real wood flute from either of them. Perhaps others have some more insights... Do keep in mind the stretch involved in fingering the Olwell when you make your decision. If you have small hands, the Olwell bamboo D will not make your life easy (I have long fingers, an I wound up getting an Olwell F, rather than a D). The Dixon of course costs double what the Olwell does, but I think they both give serious bang for the buck.
Regarding the Hall vs. Olwell question, Hall's are nice but are more of a novelty instrument. In my experience, it's easier to get a good solid tone from an Olwell.

[ This Message was edited by: Micah on 2002-10-30 13:27 ]

BmacD · Post by **BmacD** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 12:48 pm

I too decided to get serious enough and order an Olwell Bamboo, but when I spoke to Patrick on the phone about 2 weeks ago he suggested I call back early next year because he had lost his assistant and needed to devote more time to wooden flute production.So,as a back-up I called Erik the Flutemaker and in less than a week was able to start what for me will be at least a month of developing enough embouchure to get solid low notes.Every time I change to a new flute the new embouchure takes a while to develope.This reminds me of one of Loren's observations about whether to spend time looking for flutes or practicing.I'm sure he is right as I'm proof it. However, I enjoy the differances in instruments the way some people enjoy their technical accomplishments.
I can't compare the Hall to an Olwell but if Eriks bamboo flutes are even vaguely similar to Patricks the differance will be pleasant.
One more observation from a newbie wannabe.The bamboo flutes I have seen pictures of generally are are shown with all the holes in line.Having short but wide fingers I've developed a preferance for rotating the head joint on the 3 piece Dixon toward me.For me the Dixon is the easiest to play, but as much as I enjoy the tone, the bamboo tone is too good not work for.
I hope someone has newer info on the availabilty of Olwell bamboo flutes,but I have enough toys to keep me occupied until next year.I think I'll take Lorens advice and go practice.
Bruce

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 1:01 pm

What Bruce has said is true: Pat is shorthanded at the moment - Aran (who often helps in the shop as I understand it) is in Ireland, and Pat's assistant left on short notice. I offered to move up there and work as an apprentice (seriously) but Patrick declined.

Although we didn't speak about it, I was concerned that Pat might have to put aside the Bamboo flute making for awhile due to the situation, and so it seems confirmed now. (This is why I snapped up that Olwell Bamboo D that popped up last week, eventhough I couldn't really afford it)

I guess the only good news is for those awaiting keyed flutes - Patrick also told me that he was going to focus on those for awhile, so there are surely going to be some happy folks out there somewhere, finally getting their long awaited Keyed Olwells.

Loren

tin tin · Post by **tin tin** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 1:38 pm

I believe Patrick's other assistant is studying tabla in India at the moment. By the way, speaking of Aran, has anyone tried one of the bamboo whistles he was supposedly making?
I had one Erik the Flutemaker's Vivaldi minor flutes, and it was well made and sounded great. Erik's a really nice guy to deal with, and he got my order, at least, out really speadily. I wonder how one of the bamboo clarinets or saxes would sound for Breton music...
http://www.eriktheflutemaker.com

[ This Message was edited by: Micah on 2002-10-30 14:43 ]

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 2:12 pm

Is the Olwell bamboo really comparible to one of Erik the Flutemaker's bamboo flutes? I picked-up one of his at a Ren. Fest. last year (low D), and it is terribly out of tune (it's not even in tune with itself - it's close, but not quite) and has the longest finger stretch on the last hole I've ever seen. The Hall sounds about 100% better than the bamboo I have.

Jessie & Micah - have either of you actually owned the Hall D flute and really given it a chance? I took 6 months to exclusively work with Erik's bamboo flute thinking it was just my playing, but I eventually went back to the Hall crystal flute because it simply sounded better and was in tune.

I was planning on getting an Olwell because I thought it would be a step up from the Hall (and a serious step up from my other bamboo flute), but now I'm not so sure...

ChrisLaughlin · Post by **ChrisLaughlin** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 2:27 pm

Jayhawk,
We're talking about PATRICK OLWELL here.... his flutes are in tune.
Best,
Chris

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 2:37 pm

Chris is right: You can't compare Erik's flute with Patrick's.

I tried a Hall crystal flute and thought it was pretty lame compared with the half a dozen or so Olwell bamboo flutes I've owned - each of which was quite well in tune.

Loren

Jim_B1 · Post by **Jim_B1** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 2:46 pm

This is not good, I ordered a Bamboo F from Patrick Olwell at the beginning of the month. I emailed him last wekk to make sure he got the check OK and he emailed me back to let me know he received the check OK and it would be shipping soon so I hope that means it was being worked on before he lost his help. Oh well not like I'm really in a rush or anything.

I have a Erik the Flutemaker concert pitch in D and I can vouch for the spacing between the holes being a stretch. Almost to the point of my giving up on it until the Olwell bamboo shows up though I still do play with it for a couple of minutes a day. It's tough to fill too but that may just be the nature of the beast and not a particular issue with Erik's work. It does seem to be in tune with itself from what I can tell though (not a good player and my ear's not that great) but I'm not sure about how in tune it is in reality. I don't have any way to check it. I also have one of his bamboo whistles in Bb. It's nice and takes less air than my clarke original but is a little on the squeaky side but not as bad as my Feadog D. I think it's a sausoto (sp?) head on a bamboo body. Works pretty well though. Just in case anyone was thinking about his bamboo whistles. Don't know if it helps anyone but I figured I'd post it anyway.
Take care.

Jayhawk · Post by **Jayhawk** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 3:57 pm

Chris & Loren,

thanks for the replies. I think I'll put an order in for an Olwell as long as he is still accepting them (I'm in no hurry so I don't mind the wait).

I'd like something I can play that looks more traditional, sounds more traditional (just received the Wooden Flute Obsession CD the other day...), and the Olwell, now that I've had everyone's reassurances, sounds like it will fit the bill!

tin tin · Post by **tin tin** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 7:32 pm

Yeah, Olwell's bamboo (and other) flutes have good intonation. I've never played on of Erik's major flutes, so I don't know specifically about the intonation on those. Hall flutes are well in tune because they employ a (so-called) parabolic taper in the headjoint, like a Boehm flute. Basically, cylinder (Renaissance style, or most bamboo) flutes have rough intonation between the octaves, so the tapered bore/cylindrical head was developed (used in Irish and other simple system flutes), and then Boehm redesigned the flute to have a tapered head and cylindrical bore to bring the octaves in tune with one another. The reason Olwell's bamboo flutes have good intonation (as far as know) is that there is some tapering taking place in the bore, despite it looking cylindrical.

sturob · Post by **sturob** » Wed Oct 30, 2002 9:33 pm

As long as you enter into any relationship with a bamboo (=cylindrical) flute understanding that it WILL be somewhat out-of-tune with itself, I think you'd like Olwell bamboo instruments. And don't forget Steve Cox of Tallgrass Winds who also does an excellent flute.

Erik's stuff is nice, but I do think the tuning is more variable. No matter which you do, you'll have to do a little more embouchuring to get any cylindrical flute in tune.

(Don't forget that a Boehm isn't completely cylindrical: its taper is in the headjoint, whereas our beloved simple-system flute has a cylindrical head.)

Stuart

[ This Message was edited by: sturob on 2002-10-31 06:36 ]