Raw flutes
- Terry McGee
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Raw flutes
Came across this image of african blackwood on the way to the mill. I thought you might be interested in seeing what a truckload of raw flutes looks like.
Note that, like many similar very dense timbers, the tree is relatively small, and not particularly well formed as far as producing regular shaped billets of fault free wood for instrument making. For this reason, the company has two lesser grades, aimed at the turning market and the carving market, both activities capable of making assets out of liabilities that would make a flutemaker weep.
Note the sometimes deeply-fissured sides, the less than straight, round trunks, the substantial heart checking. Scary huh? Seems amazing that the company can supply perfect square billets for our use, but they can and do, routinely. Thank goodness for the turners and carvers, I say!
Terry
Note that, like many similar very dense timbers, the tree is relatively small, and not particularly well formed as far as producing regular shaped billets of fault free wood for instrument making. For this reason, the company has two lesser grades, aimed at the turning market and the carving market, both activities capable of making assets out of liabilities that would make a flutemaker weep.
Note the sometimes deeply-fissured sides, the less than straight, round trunks, the substantial heart checking. Scary huh? Seems amazing that the company can supply perfect square billets for our use, but they can and do, routinely. Thank goodness for the turners and carvers, I say!
Terry
- chas
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Re: Raw flutes
I suspect that a lot of the expense of billets comes from the low yield. I got some boxwood logs awhile back, and I've had a dickens of a time getting decent-sized squares from them, and understand why companies are hesitant to sell turning squares of box. By the time I learn to maximize the amount of good wood I get from a boxwood log, I'm sure the stuff will be extinct.Terry McGee wrote:Note the sometimes deeply-fissured sides, the less than straight, round trunks, the substantial heart checking. Scary huh? Seems amazing that the company can supply perfect square billets for our use, but they can and do, routinely. Thank goodness for the turners and carvers, I say!
Charlie
Whorfin Woods
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- sturob
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I don't know if you've ever been there, Terry, but you'd probably weep if you saw how blackwood is used in Tanzania.
Huge, beautiful unsplit logs become . . . well, even fenceposts and handrails.
There was a shop in an open-air market in Dar es Salaam that even had some steps made out of blackwood.
A friend of mine tried to bring about a one-foot-cube chunk of pristine blackwood back into the US. Who knew that they'd confiscate it because of the bark?
Oi vey!
Stuart
Huge, beautiful unsplit logs become . . . well, even fenceposts and handrails.
There was a shop in an open-air market in Dar es Salaam that even had some steps made out of blackwood.
A friend of mine tried to bring about a one-foot-cube chunk of pristine blackwood back into the US. Who knew that they'd confiscate it because of the bark?
Oi vey!
Stuart
- sbhikes
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Why don't they make flutes from less rare wood, like oak? Is it because those rare woods are beautiful or because they have properties that other woods don't have (besides beauty)?
I live in a biological zone called chaparral. One of the low-growing shrubs in this zone is called chamise. I have seen beautiful bowls made from its burl, which can survive forest fires. The wood is a cream and blood red color. If you cut a branch from the tree the inside is so red it almost looks like the tree is bleeding. I think it is the most beautiful wood. I have wondered if flutes could be made from it. Maybe not on a mass scale but on an artisan scale.
I live in a biological zone called chaparral. One of the low-growing shrubs in this zone is called chamise. I have seen beautiful bowls made from its burl, which can survive forest fires. The wood is a cream and blood red color. If you cut a branch from the tree the inside is so red it almost looks like the tree is bleeding. I think it is the most beautiful wood. I have wondered if flutes could be made from it. Maybe not on a mass scale but on an artisan scale.
- Coffee
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I could be mistaken, but my understanding is that blackwood isn't exactly endangered, but "near threatened." The use of modern forestry practice focusing on sustainablilty and conservation should help ensure flute makers of the future can still find blackwood when they need it.
The main problem with it is exemplified in the picture above. I've thought about crossbreeding blackwood with other, straighter growing trees, but I'm not sure how feasible that would be. Perhaps commercial growers could set up blackwood farms and somehow ensure that trees exhibiting the most desirable traits were the ones that reproduced. Can blackwoods grow from cuttings and graftings?
The main problem with it is exemplified in the picture above. I've thought about crossbreeding blackwood with other, straighter growing trees, but I'm not sure how feasible that would be. Perhaps commercial growers could set up blackwood farms and somehow ensure that trees exhibiting the most desirable traits were the ones that reproduced. Can blackwoods grow from cuttings and graftings?
"Yes... yes. This is a fertile land, and we will thrive. We will rule over all this land, and we will call it... This Land."
- Casey Burns
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People interested in blackwood issues may be interested in this site:
http://www.blackwoodconservation.org/
Currently blackwood is much easier than mopane to get, due to a long standing commerce in it for woodwinds primarily, several mills cutting it, etc.. Some of the stuff available to me has been air drying for 40-50 years - in this case, reject wood that was stored but not discarded by some of the French clarinet makers. They used to use it for firing their boilers. Other stuff is fairly fresh from the log.
I think that an indigenous use for blackwood or Mopane such as fenceposts, etc. is perfectly fine and legitimate and appropriate. It is arrogant to think it should be saved for our flutes or some other non-African purpose. Mopane is sort of the African equivalent of Black Locust, a useful wood used similarly here (or at least it used to be). These woods have served these purposes for centuries if not millenia. Mopane is the best African firewood and it burns like coal. I save reject pieces for my woodstove and can attest to this! Same with blackwood.
It would be great if our local woods could supply our needs and perhaps they will when the African woods become unavailable and customers stop expecting just blackwood. Usually such woods are greeted with hesitation. I experienced this and still experience this with Mopane. I've worked hard to promote it as a good alternative. Terry and the other Australian makers have done a fine job at promoting their woods such as Cooktown Ironwood. The Spanish use local boxwood for their pipes.
Alas Mopane! According to one informant, China also discovered it and has been buying it up to the point that a few countries have imposed severe export quotas. Apparently they ran out of jade and needed something to keep factories full of jade carvers at work. This explains why my primary wood supplier in Portland who sells to many of the American makers has been unable to get any. On the other hand he is swimming in blackwood, has cocus, a big pile of Turkish boxwood, and several other flute-appropriate species. But no Mopane to speak of hough at least 3 mills have repeatedly made promises to send him some for the last 4-5 years, but never coming through.
Here in the wet side of the Pacific NW we aren't as blessed with such woods. Everything is too lightweight, punky, porous and in some cases rare to use in woodwinds. However, there are some woods in the vicinity. Olive and Pistacio from northern California orchards, Mountain Mahogany, a boxwood like wood from the SE Oregon high country, and Desert Ironwood from the Sonoran Desert. I have worked with all and all make fine flutes. Black Locust from SE Washington even has possibilities. Eventually I hope to make flutes in these woods again but currently its a matter of finding some available, in lieu of going out with my own chainsaw.
Casey
http://www.blackwoodconservation.org/
Currently blackwood is much easier than mopane to get, due to a long standing commerce in it for woodwinds primarily, several mills cutting it, etc.. Some of the stuff available to me has been air drying for 40-50 years - in this case, reject wood that was stored but not discarded by some of the French clarinet makers. They used to use it for firing their boilers. Other stuff is fairly fresh from the log.
I think that an indigenous use for blackwood or Mopane such as fenceposts, etc. is perfectly fine and legitimate and appropriate. It is arrogant to think it should be saved for our flutes or some other non-African purpose. Mopane is sort of the African equivalent of Black Locust, a useful wood used similarly here (or at least it used to be). These woods have served these purposes for centuries if not millenia. Mopane is the best African firewood and it burns like coal. I save reject pieces for my woodstove and can attest to this! Same with blackwood.
It would be great if our local woods could supply our needs and perhaps they will when the African woods become unavailable and customers stop expecting just blackwood. Usually such woods are greeted with hesitation. I experienced this and still experience this with Mopane. I've worked hard to promote it as a good alternative. Terry and the other Australian makers have done a fine job at promoting their woods such as Cooktown Ironwood. The Spanish use local boxwood for their pipes.
Alas Mopane! According to one informant, China also discovered it and has been buying it up to the point that a few countries have imposed severe export quotas. Apparently they ran out of jade and needed something to keep factories full of jade carvers at work. This explains why my primary wood supplier in Portland who sells to many of the American makers has been unable to get any. On the other hand he is swimming in blackwood, has cocus, a big pile of Turkish boxwood, and several other flute-appropriate species. But no Mopane to speak of hough at least 3 mills have repeatedly made promises to send him some for the last 4-5 years, but never coming through.
Here in the wet side of the Pacific NW we aren't as blessed with such woods. Everything is too lightweight, punky, porous and in some cases rare to use in woodwinds. However, there are some woods in the vicinity. Olive and Pistacio from northern California orchards, Mountain Mahogany, a boxwood like wood from the SE Oregon high country, and Desert Ironwood from the Sonoran Desert. I have worked with all and all make fine flutes. Black Locust from SE Washington even has possibilities. Eventually I hope to make flutes in these woods again but currently its a matter of finding some available, in lieu of going out with my own chainsaw.
Casey
- chas
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The Chinese are driving up the prices of many things. I've had problems getting vacuum hardware because they've been buying up stainless steel at an amazing rate. I was talking to an electrician who said the price of wire went up by a factor of ten in one year.Casey Burns wrote: Alas Mopane! According to one informant, China also discovered it and has been buying it up to the point that a few countries have imposed severe export quotas.
Here in the wet side of the Pacific NW we aren't as blessed with such woods. Everything is too lightweight, punky, porous and in some cases rare to use in woodwinds.
Casey, have you tried Pacific dogwood? I got a few tens of pounds of it recently and am waiting for it to dry out. It seems a lot like Eastern dogwood, which works a lot like boxwood.
If it's anything like other oaks it's very sinewy and the grain would probably raise in the bore.Jayhawk wrote:Anyone every try using Live Oak as flutewood? It's dried SG is .98 which seems pretty good. I know it's what made the early US warships so tough for the British to fight since cannon balls tended to bounce off the planks.
Charlie
Whorfin Woods
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- Casey Burns
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I haven't seen any that I like - it all would require staining which I avoid.
The woods I have tried that grow here and south of here include:
Plum from the San Juan Islands - fine for bagpipe drones but too porous for flutes.
Oregon Crabapple - actually this wood is very lovely but the trees never get very big and they are seldom encountered. Similar to English boxwood in its working properties.
Other fruitwoods that grow here including hawthornes, European crabapples, Madrone, Pear, Apple, maples - these are all too soft and too lightweight. Apricot and Peach has similar qualities to plum.
Almond - similar to Plum. Just below my criteria for flutes.
Olive - I prefer the Californian to the European as it seems slightly harder and heavier. I had some from a large tree cut down in Chico that was all highly figured. After it was cut the University there realized they had just cut down the oldest one in California, planted by the first missionaries! I have some wood also that came from San Juan Baptista - stuff that was pruned off the trees in the mission where they filmed Vertigo with Jimmy Stewart. I am saving what I have left of this wood for a set of Spanish pipes for myself.
Pistacio - I have made a few flutes out of this wood and its superb! Looks lovely too and once dry, very stable. One of these days I need to go down to Chico and talk to some of the farmers and get some. Soon as it takes a number of years to cure.
Lilac - related to the 2 above and very nice smelling. However, very unstable.
Rocky Mountain Mountain Mahogany - related to the apple. Several flutes are out there in this wood made by me in the 80s, until the person harvesting it stopped. Alex Eppler in Seattle first made this wood flute famous - making some modern flutes out of it. Harder and heavier than boxwood, but with a similar fine grain. The "normal" cuts are sort of a dull tan that takes a high polish but it fades with time. I have used sapwood that is near white as well as slightly spalted heartwood that is a dark brown.
Siskiyou Mountain Mahogany - western cousin to the above. Slightly whiter and less red in its color, and slightly softer. Its actually quite common but doesn't grow as large. The area where it grows best, the Emerald Triangle, is riddled with poison oak and occasional boobie-trapped pot plantations!
Osage Orange - it grows here east of the Cascades. I have some squares that I plan to test someday. Very similar to black locust.
Black and Honey Locust - I made a few flutes out of this years ago, from a log that had been a fencepost in eastern Oregon for over a century, according to the attached barb wire. This may well be my flutewood of the future as I can get all I need for nothing. Stains well. One wood supplier once suggested it be called "Oregon Rosewood". I have some grown just up the hill from me but teh stuff from the eastern part of Washington and Oregon is harder and heavier.
Manzanita - lovely chocolate brown color but warpy. Trees are never very big!
I've tried some local boxwood as well, and its pretty lousy. Pat Olwell once showed me some boxwood he finds in defunct southern plantations - ancient topiary run amok and trunks exceeding a foot around! Other woods that interest me that look like they would do very well for flutes include Kentucky Coffee and its close cousin the Carob. John Skelton has promised me some Kentucky Coffee from his farm.
Casey
The woods I have tried that grow here and south of here include:
Plum from the San Juan Islands - fine for bagpipe drones but too porous for flutes.
Oregon Crabapple - actually this wood is very lovely but the trees never get very big and they are seldom encountered. Similar to English boxwood in its working properties.
Other fruitwoods that grow here including hawthornes, European crabapples, Madrone, Pear, Apple, maples - these are all too soft and too lightweight. Apricot and Peach has similar qualities to plum.
Almond - similar to Plum. Just below my criteria for flutes.
Olive - I prefer the Californian to the European as it seems slightly harder and heavier. I had some from a large tree cut down in Chico that was all highly figured. After it was cut the University there realized they had just cut down the oldest one in California, planted by the first missionaries! I have some wood also that came from San Juan Baptista - stuff that was pruned off the trees in the mission where they filmed Vertigo with Jimmy Stewart. I am saving what I have left of this wood for a set of Spanish pipes for myself.
Pistacio - I have made a few flutes out of this wood and its superb! Looks lovely too and once dry, very stable. One of these days I need to go down to Chico and talk to some of the farmers and get some. Soon as it takes a number of years to cure.
Lilac - related to the 2 above and very nice smelling. However, very unstable.
Rocky Mountain Mountain Mahogany - related to the apple. Several flutes are out there in this wood made by me in the 80s, until the person harvesting it stopped. Alex Eppler in Seattle first made this wood flute famous - making some modern flutes out of it. Harder and heavier than boxwood, but with a similar fine grain. The "normal" cuts are sort of a dull tan that takes a high polish but it fades with time. I have used sapwood that is near white as well as slightly spalted heartwood that is a dark brown.
Siskiyou Mountain Mahogany - western cousin to the above. Slightly whiter and less red in its color, and slightly softer. Its actually quite common but doesn't grow as large. The area where it grows best, the Emerald Triangle, is riddled with poison oak and occasional boobie-trapped pot plantations!
Osage Orange - it grows here east of the Cascades. I have some squares that I plan to test someday. Very similar to black locust.
Black and Honey Locust - I made a few flutes out of this years ago, from a log that had been a fencepost in eastern Oregon for over a century, according to the attached barb wire. This may well be my flutewood of the future as I can get all I need for nothing. Stains well. One wood supplier once suggested it be called "Oregon Rosewood". I have some grown just up the hill from me but teh stuff from the eastern part of Washington and Oregon is harder and heavier.
Manzanita - lovely chocolate brown color but warpy. Trees are never very big!
I've tried some local boxwood as well, and its pretty lousy. Pat Olwell once showed me some boxwood he finds in defunct southern plantations - ancient topiary run amok and trunks exceeding a foot around! Other woods that interest me that look like they would do very well for flutes include Kentucky Coffee and its close cousin the Carob. John Skelton has promised me some Kentucky Coffee from his farm.
Casey
- Coffee
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Mr. Burns sir, as I happen to carry the moniker "Coffee," my actual name being far too common, I would be nearly obligated to purchase a flute made from coffee wood if you found it suitable for such.
"Yes... yes. This is a fertile land, and we will thrive. We will rule over all this land, and we will call it... This Land."
- AaronMalcomb
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- michael_coleman
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- Tell us something.: I play the first flute Jon Cochran ever made but haven't been very active on the board the last 9-10 years. Life happens I guess...I owned a keyed M&E flute for a while and I kind of miss it.
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I gave Jon C. a very large log of Manzanita from Northern California (about 5 feet long 9"-1' in diameter) unfortunately it had been out in the rain after it was cut and after it dried there were too many splits to get a flute. He thought he might be able to get a whistle out of it, but no such luck. Its a nice oily and hard wood...great red color, too.Casey Burns wrote: Manzanita - lovely chocolate brown color but warpy. Trees are never very big!