Saxophone in ITM

TheSpoonMan · Post by **TheSpoonMan** » Thu Dec 21, 2006 10:38 pm

I know it was used in some ceili bands, wasn't it not too uncommon? My question is, tho (and this relates to clarinet or... umm... trumpet... O.O too), how do they deal with the keys? Concert D on an alto = B. Did they just muscle it, or did the whole band play in Eb or F, or what?

Dr Funkenstein · Post by **Dr Funkenstein** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 1:54 am

Since I started music as a sax player, I've wondered this myself. I eventually would like to get a C-melody sax, since they play in concert pitch (an octave below flute and fiddle). Since the ceili bands hit in what, the 1930s-1950s, were those guys using C-melodies? Are there any resources about sax in Irish trad?

One nice thing I've noticed about the standard saxes: Altos will match up with an F flute/whistle ("D" on alto = F concert) and a Tenor/Soprano will match up with a C flute/whistle ("D" on tenor = C concert). So tenors/sopranos could play with fiddlers who tune down a whole step.

--Jeff

Father Emmet · Post by **Father Emmet** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:59 am

What kind of sax did Josie McDermott play?

Cayden · Post by **Cayden** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:06 am

I have some old tapes of the Kilfenora when they used the sax during the early 60s, mostly on tunes like the Bluebell polka etc though, not necessarily traditional stuff.

Bands like At the Racket use the sax nicely :

Samples can be heard on their website

oleorezinator · Post by **oleorezinator** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:23 am

Father Emmet wrote:What kind of sax did Josie McDermott play?

alto. martin wynne once told me that he was a saxophonist as well.

doogieman · Post by **doogieman** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:25 am

SpoonMan - You would have to transpose the music. One can learn to sight transpose, which is especially easy for a Bb instrument - just read each note up one step. This was a required skill before the Real Books came out in horn keys. Sight transposing for an Eb instrument is devilishly difficult.

Congratulations · Post by **Congratulations** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:21 am

My guess (and it is just a guess) is that Mr. McDermott used a C Melody saxophone, which is a non-transposing instrument. That would make the fingerings rather close to that of flute/whistle.

edit - Oops, Dr. Funk got there first.

Congratulations · Post by **Congratulations** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:27 am

BTW, I don't know anything about this website, but they seem to sell restored C-melody saxes for $1735, which sounds like a good price to me.

TheSpoonMan · Post by **TheSpoonMan** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:34 pm

doogieman wrote:SpoonMan - You would have to transpose the music. One can learn to sight transpose, which is especially easy for a Bb instrument - just read each note up one step. This was a required skill before the Real Books came out in horn keys. Sight transposing for an Eb instrument is devilishly difficult.

So it was the sax players that transposed, not the rest of the band? Okay. Musta been difficult though- to play almost everything in 3-5 sharps, at that speed.

Denny · Post by **Denny** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 4:52 pm

It's not that bad.

Congratulations · Post by **Congratulations** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 6:06 pm

Denny wrote:It's not that bad.

/agree

It's the flat signatures that aren't as fun. I've had a few times where I had to sit in with an orchestra, and there were pieces in four and five flats. Not too fun, at first, but really any key isn't so bad once you play it for a while.

TheSpoonMan · Post by **TheSpoonMan** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:45 pm

Really? Huh. That's pretty cool. Maybe I'm just bad at flute

Once my pads get replaced* I'll see how that is.

*GRRR. It was my first actual band concert and I was all excited, and I spent like two hours praciticing that day. But then I get to the concert, and it turns out my F# pad leaks and the bottom half of each octave is unplayable. I borrowed my friend's so it was all good but still... grr.

Congratulations · Post by **Congratulations** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:02 pm

TheSpoonMan wrote:*GRRR. It was my first actual band concert and I was all excited, and I spent like two hours praciticing that day. But then I get to the concert, and it turns out my F# pad leaks and the bottom half of each octave is unplayable. I borrowed my friend's so it was all good but still... grr.

I've been there! Once, in like 7th grade, I dropped my instrument right before a chair test. I was a stupid kid, so I figured it was all cool, and when it got around to me to play, it just sort of went *squeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee* and nothing I did could fix it. Turns out the whole bottom half of my saxophone's keywork was mangled beyond recognition. Took our repair guy like a week to fix. Ahh... good times.

Kevin L. Rietmann · Post by **Kevin L. Rietmann** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:40 pm

My uncle had a C melody which I took apart = ruined. Was keen on getting his old tenor working a couple years ago but didn't finish the job.
You hear sax on lots of 78's, and I was told or read that this was usually a C melody. The fingering for a C melody in D looks like a no-brainer - much like the Boehm flute, nothing too alien. What's your weapon of choice, oleorezinator?

doogieman · Post by **doogieman** » Sat Dec 23, 2006 9:04 pm

If you are going to play sax in bands you will need to learn to play in ALL the keys. Many Blues/rock type bands play in the "Guitar" keys - A & E, primarily. Those keys transpose to B and F# for Bb instruments and F# and C# for Eb instruments. It's actually largely a mental adjustment to think thank C# is no more difficult than C. That, and some time in the woodshed.