Blu-tac tweak doesna do anything for me.

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 7:43 am

I have tried the blu-tac thing myself, it did change the sound just a bit but I can't say I liked it any better.

Now I did a blade replacement to a Walton's Guinness whistle one time, and produced a very lovely whistle. I didn't laminate anything on top of the blade that was already there; I built a new blade out of superglue after cutting the old one away. It took a lot of time and had some tricky moments, but the results were startlingly good.

I've still got that whistle, and it still plays wonderfully.

--James

Cayden · Post by **Cayden** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:10 am

Tweeto wrote:My Generation Bb whistles have a major "hiss" noise, emerging at the C of the second octave. A tweak to appropriately solve that would be nice.

Well, how do you play second octave c? Finding a good way to play it is probably more effective than starting to hack away at the whistle. (I hope were talking about the same note though: I assume the convention is to refer to notes as if they are on the d scale)

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:11 am

What, blu-tac debunked?!?! I'm shocked.

By far, the biggest problem with Gens and the other cheapies is that the blade (labium) is waaaaaaay to high above the floor of the windway. I mean, it's not even in the ballpark really. This is why laminating a new blade (above or below) the current blade, or raising the floor of the windway, to correct the problem, yields the most improvement, by far.

Loren

crookedtune · Post by **crookedtune** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:53 am

Loren wrote:What, blu-tac debunked?!?! I'm shocked.

By far, the biggest problem with Gens and the other cheapies is that the blade (labium) is waaaaaaay to high above the floor of the windway. I mean, it's not even in the ballpark really. This is why laminating a new blade (above or below) the current blade, or raising the floor of the windway, to correct the problem, yields the most improvement, by far.

Loren

Then wouldn't a spread of blu-tac along the windway floor yield better results than blu-tak in the cavity?

straycat82 · Post by **straycat82** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:57 am

I've found when tweaking the cheaper whistles that the most effective simple tweak is to dull the edge of the blade a bit. Most of the molded plastic headjoints (especially Gens) will have a very thin, almost transparent, piece of plastic extending from the edge of the blade and once I take that down a bit I get a more consistent and focused sound from the instrument and it isn't as shrill in the upper register. Rarely will I have to do anything to the chamfers but sometimes they extend too far out into the path of the air exiting windway and you get some air noises from the whistle. In those cases I file those down a bit too. I bought a very small metal file set from a hardware store and use that for all of the modifications I mentioned. All of the files I have are small enough to fit inside the window and that has made it very easy on me. Just go slow and try it out bit by bit as you go along... once you take it off you can't put it back on unless you're willing to completely replace the labium with other material(s). Also, don't rule out the possibility that you may need to spend some more time with that particular whistle. Also, check the tuning of it. I've bought so many cheap whistles that were 50 to 60 cents sharp in their glued position and that can effect the playability and response slightly with some designs (especially Oaks in my experience).

peeplj · Post by **peeplj** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 8:58 am

crookedtune wrote:
Loren wrote:What, blu-tac debunked?!?! I'm shocked.

By far, the biggest problem with Gens and the other cheapies is that the blade (labium) is waaaaaaay to high above the floor of the windway. I mean, it's not even in the ballpark really. This is why laminating a new blade (above or below) the current blade, or raising the floor of the windway, to correct the problem, yields the most improvement, by far.

Loren
Then wouldn't a spread of blu-tac along the windway floor yield better results than blu-tak in the cavity?

I think you'd find that getting a thin, even coat of blu-tak on the floor of the windway is pretty close to impossible.

Now you might could do something if you had some really thin, stiff plastic, and cut it just to size, and glued it to the floor of the windway...

--James

Loren · Post by **Loren** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 9:05 am

crookedtune wrote:
Loren wrote:What, blu-tac debunked?!?! I'm shocked.

By far, the biggest problem with Gens and the other cheapies is that the blade (labium) is waaaaaaay to high above the floor of the windway. I mean, it's not even in the ballpark really. This is why laminating a new blade (above or below) the current blade, or raising the floor of the windway, to correct the problem, yields the most improvement, by far.

Loren
Then wouldn't a spread of blu-tac along the windway floor yield better results than blu-tak in the cavity?

Quite possibly, it could, assuming you could work it in there (there being the windway) smoothly and evenly. Not sure how it would hold up to the constant moisture, and it wouldn't be ideal, as the surface friction might be a bit higher than ideal, but what the heck.

Still, it's easier to just make and laminate a new blade above/belove the existing one though, rather than try to spread some blu-tac in the windway.

Or just buy a better whistle for a little more money and be done with it. Or just live with the cheapies the way they are, and be done with it. Or just learn to play the flute and...... oh, never mind.

Loren

RonKiley · Post by **RonKiley** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 10:24 am

I have made the blue tack tweak on many whistles and see little if any difference. I have removed the blue tack from many of them. The distance of the blade above the windway is an important factor. When I select whistles I look to see how high the blade is above the windway floor. The most important tweak is a little breath control. Many people blow way to hard on the inexpensive whistles. I think that is why they like back pressure.

Ron

arnie · Post by **arnie** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 10:25 am

This is the site where you learn how to tweak: http://www.chiffandfipple.com/tweak.html

preacher · Post by **preacher** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 11:57 am

I used bluetack on a Feadog d and it made it a much more playable whistle. I have since given it away. I have never tried one of the "professionally tweaked" whistles but I hope to someday. Another alternative is swapping one of Mack Hoovers mouthpieces onto a cheapie. I have one of his whitecaps on a Waltons brass and it is a very nice player.

Cayden · Post by **Cayden** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 12:10 pm

I think everybody who feels inclined to should hack and poke away at their whistles to their hearts content but no 'tweaked' whistle I have ever seen has convinced me there is an actual need to do so. Peter Hunter's re-working of Sean Potts' whistle and some of the Cillian OBriain's I have seen are certainly nice. In the hands of the average C&F member I don't think these will stand out though.

FWIW I have bluetacked Feadogs a few times and like all other filling of whistleheads I have removed the stuff after a while and found no significant difference. The eye of the beholder and all that.

monkey587 · Post by **monkey587** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 12:34 pm

I noticed a distance when doing this (actually, I used candle wax) but I don't think it was more significant than the difference made by a few hours of attentive practice.

dubhlinn · Post by **dubhlinn** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 2:00 pm

I have a Jerry tweaked Gen D and the tweak does add something to the overall sound.
With all due respect to Jerry, the tweak also seems to take something away from the tone I expect to get out of a Gen.

Whichever one I play at any given time depends purely on my mood at that time. Both tweaked and non-tweaked work fine for me.

As Peter suggested, the eye of the beholder is everything really.

Slan,
D.

Whitmores75087 · Post by **Whitmores75087** » Fri Nov 03, 2006 4:00 pm

I showed this tweak to a seller of instruments. His daughter was able to tell the tweaked from un-tweaked every time. It may be an experience thing. I notice that the raspiness is reduced on some.

DreamOgreen · Post by **DreamOgreen** » Sat Nov 04, 2006 10:07 am

Hello all, I have found this an interesting thread to read... For my .02c worth, I could see how one could spend too much time tweaking for a very slight chance of improvement. One of the beauties of a whistle though, is that it's basically a hollow tube with holes..... It's kind of neat that a hollow tubes with holes can make some pretty nice sound. If the hollow tube was cheap..... well thats even better still.

So I have found it's kind of fun to mess around with the fipples on my cheapies.... I can't speak from experience about the blu-tack tweak because I like to use an epoxy/wood flour mix myself. The theory being that , once hard the wood particles and hard epoxy act acoustically more like a wall of wood under the windway and resonate in a way more like the plastic fipple and the tube. Blu-tack, being somewhat soft, I would think might absorb vibration and dampen resonance. (but this is totally a wild guess). I have filled the under windway space of 2 Generations, 2 sweetones, 1 feadog, and a Clare. Two of em' had stronger bottom end and slightly smoother upper registers, the two sweetones were unchanged and the feadog seemed actually made worse by the epoxy treatment. This was all after the standard windway/sound blade cleanups were done...... Well at least I feal that the tweaking can be a fun experiment in acoustics...... enjoy.....